Probation period of 6 months

[elvis.is.in.finland]

Hello all - I will be starting work in Finland.

While re-reading my contract and only now noticed that it states that the probation period is 6 months. I have never heard of such a long prob. time needed.

Can anyone tell me what the normal probation time is?

My work is for a governmental organisation and is fixed-term for 5 yrs.

Thanks in advance

Elvis!

[Hank W.]

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokset ... 010055.pdf

section 4 specifically.

[elvis.is.in.finland]

There is no training period in my case, so does this actually imply that a 6 month trial period is not legally binding?


Excerpt from the PDF...

Section 4
Trial period

The employer and the employee may agree on a trial period of a maximum of four months starting from the beginning of the work. If the employer provides specific, work-related training for the employee, lasting for a continuous period of over four months, a trial period of no more than six months may be agreed on.

If a fixed-term employment relationship is shorter than eight months, the trial period may not exceed 50 per cent of the duration of the employment period.
If a collective agreement applicable to the employer contains a provision on a trial period, the employer must inform the employee of the application of this provision at the time the contract is concluded.

During the trial period, the employment contract may be cancelled by either party. The employment contract may not, however, be cancelled on the grounds referred to in chapter 2, section 2, paragraph 1, or on grounds which are otherwise inappropriate with regard to the purpose of the trial period. The employer may not cancel an employment contract when it has neglected the obligation to inform laid down in paragraph 3 of this section.

[agn71]

Keyword here is goverment.

Four month trial period is maximum length if you are doing a normal job and six months if you get training.

But if you are going to office (virka) different laws apply and six month period is maximum with or without training.

[Hank W.]

Section 2
Derogations from scope of application This Act does not apply to:
1) employment relations or service obligations subject to public law;
2) ordinary hobby activities;
3) such contracts on work to be performed which are governed by separate provisions by law.

So I guess if its under "Valtion virkaehtosopimus" or the likes....

See theres "government" and "government companies" and "county" and then it gets confusing...

[elvis.is.in.finland]

Better make this clear: I will be paid by the state.

I will work for a University

[agn71]

Main question is do you get a job or office?

job = max four month trial period
office = max six month trial period

[korppu]

Better make this clear: I will be paid by the state.

I will work for a University

At least Helsinki University states this about professor´s positions and in the same text they recommend a similar practice for assistants etc (positions that are for max 5 years).
"Nimityspäätöksessä voidaan määrätä enintään 6 kuukautta kestävästä koeajasta, jonka kuluessa virkasuhde voidaan molemmin puolin purkaa ilman irtisanomis- tai purkuperustetta. Yliopistossa suositellaan, että koeaika otetaan yleisesti käyttöön. Mikäli henkilö on jo ollut yliopiston palveluksessa vastaavissa tehtävissä, voidaan koeaika jättää määräämättä.

Koeajan tarkoituksena on varata virkasuhteen kummallekin osapuolelle mahdollisuus palvelussuhteen alussa (koeaikana) harkita, vastaako virkasuhteen jatkaminen heidän etujaan. Virkasuhdetta ei kuitenkaan koeaikanakaan saa purkaa epäasiallisilla perusteilla (ks. valtion virkamieslaki 10 § 1 momentti). "
http://www.helsinki.fi/henkos/palveluss ... lajit.html
=Max 6 months trial period...recommended that this practice will be taken into general use...person who has earlier worked for the Uni does not necessarily need trial period...for both parties best interest...if the work relation is ended it cannot be done during trial period or after on epäasiallinen syy unjust/unspecified/not relevant cause..law as stated.

[elvis.is.in.finland]

Main question is do you get a job or office?

job = max four month trial period
office = max six month trial period

Not sure what this question means!?
Just guessing, but I suppose to you, or the Fins, there is a difference between a job and an office. So now we are also exploring language...

I'll try to explain this in my English:
I will have a 'job' and I will work in my 'office' (and other facilities that fall under my supervision).

...but I'm sure this is not what you are referring to?

[Hank W.]

No, "office" as in "tenure" .

So in other words
If you are in "job" and I bribe you, you just work there, its a marketing offence.
If you are in "office" and I bribe you, you're a civil servant, its high treason.

So you have an university tenure, so its six months probation, and no, you don't have a "real job" congratulations anyhow.

[elvis.is.in.finland]

Ah ha! How enlightening

I think I understand all I need to know now; i.e. 6 months is 'normal'.
(not really, but in Fi it is).

Thank you.

[Hank W.]

You're gonna find a lot of stuff "not normal- but in Fi it is"

[Tapani]

/moaning foreigner
Did anyone tell him about your vacations days? or lack there of
/end moaning foreigner

[dave071061]

/moaning foreigner
Did anyone tell him about your vacations days? or lack there of
/end moaning foreigner

Lack of??? You are joking right?

[Majava]

I guess Tapani does not mean the official national holidays. Pllenty of those, yes, but you can't go on a holiday usually during your first year at a Finnish employer. On the other hand...when it's for a Uni with school holidays?? I don't know...