US to Finland Extended Family in Sweden

[tjline1221]

We are just beginning to think of considering if a move to FInland is possible for us. We are interested primarily because of the school system. We are just so disappointed with the system here in the US. I have an 11 year old and an 8 year old. We do not have family in Finland, but we do have quite a bit of extended family in Sweden. Wondering if that makes a difference?

Also, what are the employment prospects for Americans who speak only English? I have an understanding of spanish, but not enough to sell myself as bilingual. My husband is a retired law enforcement who now does insurance investigation. I am a writer and corporate communications professional. (Likely two jobs not at all in high demand in Finland LOL)

Wondering how well kids from the US integrate themselves into Finish schools without speaking the language.

Many, many questions as we consider if this is something we can even seriously contemplate. So appreciative of incites and experiences. Thank you!

[rinso]

You need to apply for a residence permit. Therefore you need a reason;
- married to a Finn
- a job
- study
A marriage is obvious no option.
If you want to study here, you have to be accepted in a university and bring enough money to take care of yourself (and family). After the study you have to leave unless you found a job.
(info at migri.fi)
So the job option seems to be your only chance.

Also, what are the employment prospects for Americans who speak only English?

Bad. Fluent Finnish is almost always a selection criteria, even for jobs that don't require it.
Besides employers have to look in the EU first before they can hire someone from outside.
And indeed your professions don't seem in high demand. At least not without the language.

Wondering how well kids from the US integrate themselves into Finish schools without speaking the language.

This is the only positive point. Children of that age should not have to much trouble integrating here.
But because of their language disadvantage they might lag behind in school.

[Flossy1978]

Depending on the school, will depend on well your kids would do in school without Finnish.

My son's school IS VERY GOOD at helping non Finnish speakers to integrate and learn Finnish. There's only one child in over 100 students who doesn't speak Finnish, so he gets very good attention. And my municipality is very good about children who speak different languages.

It's kind of a huge leap to give up your lives in America and just turn up in Finland.

Having 'some' relatives in Sweden won't help you here.

You could always try to get into Sweden using your relatives. Surely the schooling isn't much worse there than than it here. And it's the best in the world here. This part of the world is very similar in a lot of the countries.

Actually we usually hear about Americans on this board speaking !"#¤% how the school systems are crap because our kids aren't in school ALL DAY (mine is only 4 hours a day right now) and don't do activities from dawn till bedtime. Or all those stupid tests Americans make their kids constantly take.

But honestly, Finland is going downhill economically. So actually your chances of finding a job will be just about NIL. Unless you are big hot shot, some company here wants you to lead.....

I am sorry, I also think it's a bit silly to uproot your family and life to a country you would have no connections with, probably know almost nothing about etc.... All for schooling.... Is it for the free schooling? Or what? Or you have read the recent articles about how Finland has the best schooling system in the world? Yeah, it does... And we pay for it dearly with our taxes. On the 1.1.2013 in the municipality I live in, they hiked our income taxes. They are going to do the same on 1.1.2014 here in the same municipality. It's insane, but obviously worth it, since we seem to be raising pretty much well grounded kids who go on to study and make good lifes for themselves.

[browndude]

First, you need to have a valid reason for coming here. The probability of finding work here without Finnish skills, for the two of you is almost zero. As in most of the world, the economy here too is not doing too well right now. The kids will probably adjust after a while.

[Ninja]

Well I think your question would be equivalent to asking someone "I'd like to move to the United States, I have family in Canada if that makes a difference"...It seems the Finnish and Swedish cultures are much more historically entwined than the US and Canada, however they seem to be about as separate as you'd expect any other countries would in other regards, legally speaking.

You would also need a reason to come here, you have a 3 month visa permit that you can just come without any prior arrangements...however for any kind of residency permit you'd need family ties or basically a job, or as a student but that wouldn't quite work with your family.

Finally the language barrier is really the most difficult situation to overcome as just your basic daily life, as many people speak English here (younger crowd mainly) it's still dominated by Finnish obviously, so unless you've got a good grasp on the language it's going to be quite difficult to assimilate, although I've only been here for a short-term, also culturally somethings are a bit difficult to adjust to than may be perceived. There is no Halloween in Finland makes me a very sad man.

The economy is not great either, it's a small country with not a whole lot of jobs, and seems to be geared more towards certain sectors where they really need people...not to mention, it's extremely expensive compared to the US, down to the smallest thing that we'd get for just a few dollars, might be a great deal more expensive here, you might spend 10 dollars for something that used to cost you 1 or 2, maybe even more.

So it's not the greatest country to come to and live the "dream" idealy, I think it's a nice country, it's settled...quiet, beautiful, not very social and quaint, but economically speaking it seems like there will be a glass ceiling...without a good grasp on the language It seems daunting, especially considering people who are educated, and more fluent in Finnish than you'll ever be combined with knowing/speaking reasonable English, as well as Swedish...no Spanish speaking countries here locally.

If you can get a work visa and get yourself established here then that might open up a door of opportunity, but to have "permanent residency" I am not sure how to attain that without otherwise having worked here a number of years...in all honesty I think the Finns could learn a thing or two about American business/capitalism, but you might be a bit hard pressed finding a job as they seem pretty defensive about doing things outside of their comfort zones...it's the impression that I get anyway..."like this is how Fins like to do it because this is what we're comfortable with, and want it to stay that way...even if we could be getting better results out of changing/adapting" but that's speculative at best, they just don't seem very "flexible" in my overall impression....businesses seem to largely mirror each other, you can't even always tell what store you're in versus the next.

[Upphew]

Finally the language barrier is really the most difficult situation to overcome as just your basic daily life, as many people speak English here (younger crowd mainly) it's still dominated by Finnish obviously, so unless you've got a good grasp on the language it's going to be quite difficult to assimilate, although I've only been here for a short-term, also culturally somethings are a bit difficult to adjust to than may be perceived.

Language barrier... lets turn the table: how would it sound if I described US as "many people speak Spanish there, but it's still dominated by English, so unless you got a good grasp on the language it's going to be quite difficult to assimilate"?

[rinso]

If you can get a work visa and get yourself established here then that might open up a door of opportunity, but to have "permanent residency" I am not sure how to attain that without otherwise having worked here a number of years.

This is confusing. There is no "work visa".
There is a residence permit based on work which is given for a short time and which can be renewed until it becomes "permanent"
The conditions however are that you must have a job before you get it and still have a job when you renew it. And there are certain conditions for the job and the employer.

[Flossy1978]

I am not too sure about your last paragraph.

As there are companies implenting this Japanese 'LEAN' system in places were there is 'tuotanto'. Is that how it's written LEAN?

So, actually Finns, at least some companies are open to change. But then again, this is a Japanese change. And well, Finns and the Japanese seem to have a lot of similarities, so are the business Finns really opening their doors to change at all? LOL. I am just joking.

There is very little competition in this country..... For example the supermarket chains are own by two major companies. I believe SIWA and a couple of others are free from the grasp of the them. K-Plussa and this S-Group. I am not even sure of their proper names. But that makes for no competition whatsoever. They can set the prices pretty much as they wish, up to the highest amounts the government will allow and 'too bad, so sad' for the little man. It kind of really sucks. And really sucks the Government has allowed this to go on. But naturally the polititions have no worries.... They make so much money, they can afford to shop in either chain..... But the average Joe is stuck.

In the town I live there are 6 petrol stations for a town of 15,000. Granted they also get the surrounding tinier places (as in VERY few people) in my municipality using these pumps too because there are no other petrol stations other than in the capital city of the municipality. Anyway, 6 petrol stations within about 2-3km on the same stretch of main road.... Think there's any competition to make the prices lower to get people to come to them? Nope. They don't all belong to the same companies. They almost always have the same prices, all 6 of them. With the one attached to the S-market and the Teboil one actually having much higher prices because of some kind of bonus cards. Sometimes the Shell has 1-3 cents cheaper. But that's it. NO COMPETITION. And the owners don't care. What can Finnish people do about it? Other closest petrol stations are about 13 kilometres up the road to the captial city of the municipality which has even higher petrol prices, or about 12km or something to the Neste on the motorway towards Helsinki, which is actually often insanely much cheaper. That's it.

It's about the only thing I really don't like about Finland. I am tired of buying fruit and vegies which are overpriced and OLD. F*cking old. I want to sink my teeth into an insanely expensive Granny Smith apple and get that lovely tangy sour taste they have when freshly picked. Ok, so I grew up in Oz and we could stop at farming places where they'd sell such items in boxes fresh from the orchards. Well, one can be a bit spoiled and then it ruins you for the rest of your life if you don't get the same fresh quality and for such a cheap price LOL.

[Ninja]

Finally the language barrier is really the most difficult situation to overcome as just your basic daily life, as many people speak English here (younger crowd mainly) it's still dominated by Finnish obviously, so unless you've got a good grasp on the language it's going to be quite difficult to assimilate, although I've only been here for a short-term, also culturally somethings are a bit difficult to adjust to than may be perceived.

Language barrier... lets turn the table: how would it sound if I described US as "many people speak Spanish there, but it's still dominated by English, so unless you got a good grasp on the language it's going to be quite difficult to assimilate"?

In the United States it is multicultural and even certain cities/neighborhoods the language is dominated by a certain ethnic group...you can go to cities where the signs of the actual businesses are not even in English, they're in Chinese or Spanish...so you might actually be able to go to the United States, get a job without ever having to learn English, and many do.

What people don't understand about Finland, is it's just Finnish people, mostly speaking Finnish...with Swedish people sprinkled in.

This is a very general and vague generalization, but one that is shared from perspectives of people coming from the US...we imagine most of the world speaking English and maybe even doing business in it since it's so widely spoken throughout the world.

[Ninja]

If you can get a work visa and get yourself established here then that might open up a door of opportunity, but to have "permanent residency" I am not sure how to attain that without otherwise having worked here a number of years.

This is confusing. There is no "work visa".
There is a residence permit based on work which is given for a short time and which can be renewed until it becomes "permanent"
The conditions however are that you must have a job before you get it and still have a job when you renew it. And there are certain conditions for the job and the employer.

I get a headache thinking of the correct terminology and assessments of statuses and such...I'm no an immigration officer however, and many people usually post links to most of this information anyway leading them to a government website...I have a vague understanding that you can get a permit to work here, what it's called exactly and how it's done is something that they can research that information officially themselves or use other more well-detailed links, I'm just giving a general idea to a general question...many people here are in the stages of just probing to figure out if they'd be able to come here and under what conditions, most of the legal detail people will forget or probably not really understand fully until they actually start assessing whether they can and will come here.

If somebody asks you how a car works, they're not acting for a spec sheet of the car and how it's built in great detail...they're just asking to get a general idea.

[rinso]

I'm just giving a general idea to a general question.

Yes, but it is vague and half correct. And you do it after others have explained it in more detail.
It only leads to confusion.
For instance:

You would also need a reason to come here, you have a 3 month visa permit that you can just come without any prior arrangements

US citizens don't need a visa for Finland. So your statement becomes really confusing and might lead tjline1221 into thinking he can get a "working visa" as you suggest a few lines later.
When he starts researching it he can only find contradictory information. Or he starts researching "working holiday visa" which only applies to Australians.
A waste of time.

If you only have a vague idea, don't enter the discussion with the pretense you supply "information".

[browndude]

Ninja is just SOOO American