Consumer rights info

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KauniitaUnia
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 7:36 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by KauniitaUnia » Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:16 pm

This is currently driving me crazy. I bought a brand new Nokia phone from Elisa, and from the second I had it, the camera didn't work. In the UK, you would just take it back and have it replaced. Here, I have had it (not) fixed three times, and so three months into having a new phone, I have never been able to use it. Apparently they will replace it if it doesn't work this time. It's absolutely incredible to me that a store could sell you something brand new that doesn't work and don't have to replace it immediately. Even if it was repaired, I don't pay full price to have a 'repaired' phone.

Aaaaand breathe :). Hopefully I get a new phone this week :).



Re: Consumer rights info

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brengun
Posts: 293
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 9:41 am

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by brengun » Thu Oct 15, 2009 7:22 am

There,s an awful lot of dissatisfied customers out there,judging by the views to this topic,5000, WOW, HOW about;;; all arriving at the main offenders doors one saturday afternoon,!for a picnic.
nothing you can do but you can learn how to be you,in time.its easy,.the beatles(j lennon)


sisu2008
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Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:47 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by sisu2008 » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:51 pm

Hi! One simple advice for those who might think it is a good idea buying mokkula from DNA. Never ever try this experience. It is bad connection and the contract is for two years. I have waited for half an year until now to close this unfair deal. It is not as it should be, not even the slow 384. It is around 5-10 kb. When you ask for something else (internet connection) they can not give you a straight answer and all the time they put you on hold. I gave back mokkula long time ago and I'm still paying for the service. I can not understand how they can charge you for some service they do not provide. It is so unbelievable and I wrote complains to consumer rights. I am still waiting and I don't know what to think. In my oppinion the contract is all the time involving both sides. It seems like you have no guarantee for the internet speed you pay but they can carge you every month. They can not give you a simple yes or no, but instead sending bills. I have never seen in my life such a strange attitude regarding old good customers.


karel
Posts: 892
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:05 am

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by karel » Wed Feb 17, 2010 3:24 pm

I've been trying to get a hold by phone of Kuluttajavirasto, but so far haven't succeeded. All busy all the time.
I'm wondering if someone has an answer to the following:

I'm about to buy a washer/dryer from a friend of mine who's moving out of the country.
She bought a previous machine in November 2007 with a 2 year warranty. The machine kept on having problems and in August 2009 the store replaced the defect machine with a brand new one. When I asked my friend about the warranty / receipt she told me she didn't get a new one.
I had her call to the store, where they told her that a new replacement machine doesn't get a new warranty, but it remains under the warranty period of the first machine. Meaning that the warranty of this brand new machine ran out last November.

Rules differ per country, but I know that in Holland the warranty starts with a new factory given period when a machine is replaced by a new one.

Does anyone know how it goes here?


Upphew
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Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:55 pm
Location: Lappeenranta

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by Upphew » Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:48 am

karel wrote:I've been trying to get a hold by phone of Kuluttajavirasto, but so far haven't succeeded.
Local kuluttajaneuvoja is the one who helps persons, kuluttajavirasto is interested in bigger picture.
karel wrote:I had her call to the store, where they told her that a new replacement machine doesn't get a new warranty, but it remains under the warranty period of the first machine. Meaning that the warranty of this brand new machine ran out last November.

Rules differ per country, but I know that in Holland the warranty starts with a new factory given period when a machine is replaced by a new one.
Warranty (takuu) != product liability (not sure if this is the correct term, virhevastuu). Warranty is what store gives and it is their job to show the fault is not in the item. Product liability is not connected to warranty and it is the consumers job to prove fault. Warranty is as long as shop decides, liability is expected to last "reasonable" time. One could argue that warranty replacement's product liability is extended, but that it doesn't extend warranty (unless the shop decides so).
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cybertiger
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Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:36 pm
Location: Espoo

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by cybertiger » Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:12 am

I no longer deal with verkkokauppa because I've had issues with trying to take back defective equipment before.

Stick to small specialist shops, there's enough of them, preferably ones that self-import.

Finland seems to have this distinction between companies that import and companies that sell.

So you'll have a specialist importer with a couple of contacts outside the country and then all the big stores that sell those items will import through the single importer.

Right now being an importer is a lucrative business, but I don't expect it will last with the next generation learning to use web shops abroad and effectively becoming their own importers, and cutting out two middle men.
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FinnGuyHelsinki
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Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:52 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by FinnGuyHelsinki » Wed Aug 25, 2010 1:19 pm

cybertiger wrote:Finland seems to have this distinction between companies that import and companies that sell.
There aren't that many resellers here that would sell enough (consider the overall market size) to make it worthwhile importing on their own. Giants (by local standards) such as Kesko and S-group are a different story, and ones dealing in specialty/niche products.


kilpikonna29
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:12 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by kilpikonna29 » Tue Sep 07, 2010 7:36 pm

Good to know


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Karhunkoski
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Re: Consumer rights info

Post by Karhunkoski » Tue Sep 07, 2010 7:54 pm

kilpikonna29 wrote:Good to know
Yes, and so is this:

http://finlandforum.org/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=5660

In particular this bit:
10. Do not cross post (post the same question in multiple categories), it's likely if you do this that all of your posts will be removed.

How come pretty much everyone else who joins this forum manages to ask their question once, in one forum section. But for some unexplained reason, you see yourself as ultra-important, and hence feel the need to cross post the same question across multple sections of the forum? Many people here flick through all the new posts that have been made since their last visit. Why torture these poor folk my making them read YOUR post four times???!!!!!
Political correctness is the belief that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


kilpikonna29
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:12 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by kilpikonna29 » Tue Sep 07, 2010 8:35 pm

Well, no torture was intended :)

I was just not sure which place was better.


Upphew
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Location: Lappeenranta

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by Upphew » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:08 pm

kilpikonna29 wrote:I was just not sure which place was better.
You'll fit fine in Finland: "Hmm, should I take kossu or vodka or whisky..."
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MigueleFI
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:45 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by MigueleFI » Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:50 pm

Upphew wrote:
kilpikonna29 wrote:I was just not sure which place was better.
You'll fit fine in Finland: "Hmm, should I take kossu or vodka or whisky..."
Kossu, take kossu :)

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jmakinen
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 2:33 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by jmakinen » Sat Oct 30, 2010 4:45 am

Verkkokauppa has some VERY weird approaches to guarantees. They have done some good work in general - but they have lost the 'red thread' re service and guarantee. Maybe Samuli Seppälä will step off his Caribbean yacht and get someone to re-think!


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Pursuivant
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Location: Bath & Wells

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by Pursuivant » Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:09 am

They used to be good, back when they were just a small garage. But you should have tried "cruz broker" back in the days... they'd tell you were too stupid to own a computer if you took something back that "didn't fit"... then again they wouldn't sell you a part sometimes unless you exactly knew what you were buying.
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Something wicked this way comes."


jmakinen
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 2:33 pm

Re: Consumer rights info

Post by jmakinen » Sat Oct 30, 2010 4:18 pm

So you'll have a specialist importer with a couple of contacts outside the country and then all the big stores that sell those items will import through the single importer.

Right now being an importer is a lucrative business, but I don't expect it will last with the next generation learning to use web shops abroad and effectively becoming their own importers, and cutting out two middle men.
One problem here is that manufacturers usually avoid a company that sells retail. They want distribution to at least several retail companies. And it is very difficult to have competition between or among 'importers' in the same country.

It used to be that retailers could import themselves from wholesalers outside Finland but now that can only happen if the other country is in EU. Importing from OUTSIDE the EU can be effectively limited to there being only one importer because of a legal interpretation (note - interpretation! - I believe it was a Nike case in Austria) that a manufacturer can limit distribution - thus 'grey importing' prohibited except intra-EU. This situation has not yet been definitively decided. Many consumer groups are fighting this 'no exhaustion of distribution rights' interpretation but they have not been very successful with stopping the defacto prohibition (there is some big money against open importing - especially the interestingly named 'ethical drug' industry.)


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