Helsinki "Underground"

Where to buy? Where can I find? How do I? Getting started.
Post Reply
wattypiper
Posts: 47
Joined: Fri May 23, 2008 3:28 pm

Helsinki "Underground"

Post by wattypiper » Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:48 am

It's summer now - or sort of. So people might not be so interested in this.

But during the last 20 years or so there has developed quite a lot of city underground or accessible underground.

Kamppi, Forum, Stockmann, Sokos, Railway Staion, etc

What's interesting and not so good is that when you are in one of the areas there is very little help to find one of the others. And in some cases they are almost secret 'Harry Potter' adventures - Forum to Kamppi

I've asked at the Info kiosks in each place and you can eventually extract directions but few give them very easily nor in some cases even know. I've found the people owning and/or administering these areas and they basically say it is not their business to promote the 'competing' areas.

I've asked newspapers and they say yes it would be good to make these maps etc. public but they never do.

(There are some real practical problems too. Park your car in the Erottaja maze.Go upstairs and when you then try to return to the area you will be lucky to locate the AREA your car is in - I've met some people down there who asked me to send down sandwiches and canteens)

Anyone find any place where this labyrinth might be published in whole?

Even this is without a map:

Wikipedia: Asematunneli



Helsinki "Underground"

Sponsor:

Finland Forum Ad-O-Matic
 

sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by sammy » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:05 pm

Haven't seen a map, though since I don't have a car I've been spared the parking thingy (but can imagine it's complicated, especially for first-timers).

I think it's possible to walk "underground" from Kamppi to Akateeminen - perhaps that is the longest stretch (?)

But it would be really interesting to see and underground passageway map - one which would also include the service tunnels and so on which are neither visible nor accessible to the public. There's even a tunnel to Suomenlinna...

Ha! Some info in here, although not quite in the sort of user-friendly form you're after

http://www.hel.fi/wps/portal/Kaupunkisu ... yleiskaava

...see the pdf maps (links on the right-hand margin)


User avatar
sinikala
Posts: 4993
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:10 pm
Location: Pori, Finland

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by sinikala » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:19 pm

Once you have wandered around a couple of times, there really isn't that much to get lost in, it's not quite on the scale of http://www.toronto.ca/path/ in Toronto, where you really do need a map.

Also, some of those tunnels under Hki have blast doors, looks like they have a dual role as bomb shelters? Perhaps that is why there are no comprehensive maps readily available? (thinking out loud)
Image


sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by sammy » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:33 pm

sinikala wrote:Once you have wandered around a couple of times, there really isn't that much to get lost in, it's not quite on the scale of http://www.toronto.ca/path/ in Toronto, where you really do need a map.

Also, some of those tunnels under Hki have blast doors, looks like they have a dual role as bomb shelters? Perhaps that is why there are no comprehensive maps readily available? (thinking out loud)
Possibly, but you're also underestimating the destructive force of an average Helsinki youth hooligan :lol:

But yes, it's not that complicated, after all Helsinki is a very small town (in a positive sense IMO). Incidentally - the malls in Minneapolis seemed to be on a similar level as those of Toronto, but interestingly enough, not so much underground but on "second" floor, the city centre buildings being interconnected with numerous walkways between them, above the street level.


User avatar
Karhunkoski
Posts: 7026
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:44 pm
Location: Keski-Suomi

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Karhunkoski » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:39 pm

sinikala wrote: Also, some of those tunnels under Hki have blast doors, looks like they have a dual role as bomb shelters? Perhaps that is why there are no comprehensive maps readily available? (thinking out loud)
That was my thought too.
Political correctness is the belief that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


User avatar
Mook
Posts: 2945
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 9:25 pm
Location: Etelä Tuusula
Contact:

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Mook » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:48 pm

There's a whole heap of "secret" tunnels under Hel'. All of them were used as bomb shelters back in the Winter War - just ask anyone who was in Helsinki during that time.

For instance, the Government has tunnels all around Senaatintori and probably as far as the parliament, with things like server rooms, bomb shelter down there.
---
Image http://blog.enogastronomist.com | http://blog.enogastronomisti.com


sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by sammy » Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:09 pm

An article about the "unknown" tunnels etc can be found here... (NB from 2001) - and another one here

Anyway it might be a good idea to have a map of at least the accessible public areas... at least the newbies in town might profit from it. However the "underground" areas are not on one level only, I mean think of e.g. Kamppi to Forum to Stockmann to Akateeminen... you need to go up and down a bit not just left and right... so you'd need to draw a 3-d map possibly? And if the map were to include shops etc, it would need to be updated every now and then since shops come and go... or change location.


User avatar
Hank W.
The Motorhead
Posts: 29987
Joined: Sat Jul 06, 2002 10:00 pm
Location: Mushroom Mountain
Contact:

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Hank W. » Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:14 pm

Well, theres a *lot* of non-general-public access tunnels, like the Suomenlinna tunnel thats used occasionally for ambulance transports and then a variety of city service tunnels criscrossing... or then like the hospitals access network... The army has "stuff"... you go walking in some obscure places and you see huge blast doors in a cliffside. It might be something or then it might be something more connected to places. Like next time you go to Seurasaari on the road up to Meilahti theres a grown-in lot with a dilapidated barb wire fence and signs "military installation"...
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


User avatar
Mark I.
Posts: 2055
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 9:28 pm
Location: Helsinki

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Mark I. » Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:55 pm

New tunnels seem to appear all the time.

Edit: Well, they don't "seem to appear", since I cannot see that underground world :wink: - and yes, it's remarkable how those tunnel maps are not available in public. Sure those tunnels are part of security systems, but still lack of underground maps is amazing.

I'v heard of huge tunnel works for the military - but no official info. Quite intriguing, what's under us?


wattypiper
Posts: 47
Joined: Fri May 23, 2008 3:28 pm

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by wattypiper » Mon Jun 09, 2008 3:50 pm

"However the "underground" areas are not on one level only, I mean think of e.g. Kamppi to Forum to Stockmann to Akateeminen... you need to go up and down a bit not just left and right... so you'd need to draw a 3-d map possibly? And if the map were to include shops etc, it would need to be updated every now and then since shops come and go... or change location."

Exactly! That's what I mean. You can get from one to another but it's thru 'back alleys,' up and down, etc. A Harry Potter adventure. It's really NOT so easy

And with all these junky news-sheets they have that are stuffed into mailboxes, it would seem to me the 'updating' and maps, new stores etc would be a wonderful opportunity for someone to make a combo news and ad paper called 'Helsingin Alamaailma' and have a pretty damn good level of success!!


Jukka Aho
Posts: 5238
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 1:46 am
Location: Espoo, Finland

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Jukka Aho » Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:51 pm

sammy wrote:Anyway it might be a good idea to have a map of at least the accessible public areas... at least the newbies in town might profit from it. However the "underground" areas are not on one level only, I mean think of e.g. Kamppi to Forum to Stockmann to Akateeminen... you need to go up and down a bit not just left and right... so you'd need to draw a 3-d map possibly? And if the map were to include shops etc, it would need to be updated every now and then since shops come and go... or change location.
Well, that’s clearly a job for some 3D first-person shooter map designer / cartographer enthusiast! (One just needs to be careful about that sort of thing since 3D modeling real-world locations seems to count as “suspicious activity” these days...)
znark


User avatar
Mook
Posts: 2945
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 9:25 pm
Location: Etelä Tuusula
Contact:

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by Mook » Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:31 pm

How about using google's sketchup? (I once designed a bathroom using it :-) )
You could then upload it all to google maps... maybe
---
Image http://blog.enogastronomist.com | http://blog.enogastronomisti.com


User avatar
AlexInHelsinki
Posts: 196
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:17 pm
Location: Helsinki, Finland

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by AlexInHelsinki » Fri Mar 17, 2017 10:53 pm

Old thread, but it was raining so I just tried to get from Kamppi to Stockmann completely underground today, and holy moley, it's pretty complex! I'm thankful I found my way out. Once you reach Forum, things really start getting confusing (though I always get confused in Forum anyway even when I'm not on an underground adventure).

In the end I couldn't figure out how to make it from Forum across Mannerheimintie, so I went above ground and tried from the Stockmann side. I ended up having to walk partly through one of the underground car parks, but (sort of) got there in the end. I don't think I'd be able to do it again without getting lost, though. The wayfinding is horrible, especially when your Finnish isn't very good.

However, there WERE a couple of maps. They weren't the most useful things ever, but they're there...I'd upload the photos of them I took, but then I'd have to find an image hosting site and I'm too tired right now.


riku2
Posts: 844
Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:13 pm

Re: Helsinki "Underground"

Post by riku2 » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:31 am

Did the maps have north at the top ? it's taking people in europe a long time to realise that it's much better if the map is orientated to match where you are standing, underground especially. In Japan, Taiwan, South Korean they always have the maps rotated like this.
In places like Sapporo you can walk for about 2km underground through wide walkways with shops either side and there are good maps with numbered exits from this underground world also (numbered exits are another thing that are taking their time to arrive).


Post Reply