Tori.fi fraud and police response

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winsiebunny
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Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2016 12:31 pm

Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by winsiebunny » Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:45 pm

I recently have been the victim of a fraud on tori.fi. I have reported to the police and the police contacted me recently. They policeman who called said in Finland the police don't investigate this kind of crime because it is too little. It is not possible because there are thousands of this kind of crimes in Finland at the moment.
It usually doesn't come to people's mind that there are frauds in tori.fi because here in Finland things are so transparent. You have the account number then the police can get all the information needed for the investigation. However,there are two things that make fraud so easy in this country. First, there is no secured method of payment on tori.fi and huuto, and when you make the bank transfer, it also doesn't matter if the name and account number matches. As long as the number is right, your money is taken to the fraudster's account. Second, the police has no energy to deal with this kind of cases. In their own words, they have murder cases to investigate. So not possible to investigate into a fraud. So the fraudster's can play with the system and make easy money. I have paid for my lesson for this. People, always pick up when buying things on tori.fi. Don't buy through post.



Tori.fi fraud and police response

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Flossy1978
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Flossy1978 » Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:00 pm

Murder cases? Is there only a handful of policemen? How many murders happen there a year? :lol: What a load of tosh. Probably it would take too much manpower and the guilty will get off lightly. So not worth the police force's time.


winsiebunny
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by winsiebunny » Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:10 pm

I understand that they prioritize the cases especially during summer time and this may take a year or sth. But saying they don't investigate because the crime is too little and there are thousands of similar crimes is ridiculous.


Rosamunda
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Rosamunda » Wed Jul 13, 2016 6:34 pm

...and there is also the possibility that the perpetrators of this type of fraud - are not even in Finland. There are similar issues with apartments that are up for rent, asking for down payments from foreign students etc.

I guess the only thing you can do is report it to Tori.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that the police should acknowledge the crime so that, at the very least, it appears in the statistics as an unsolved case of fraud. If they refuse even to do that, you could argue that they are fudging their own performance metrics.


AldenG
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by AldenG » Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:02 pm

Rosamunda wrote:...the police should acknowledge the crime so that, at the very least, it appears in the statistics as an unsolved case of fraud. If they refuse even to do that, you could argue that they are fudging their own performance metrics.
The tabloid headlines write themselves, don't they?

This must have already been a story and a campaign-of-the-week at some point. But if it hasn't been, it would be a profitable one. A paper could hire some expert to generously estimate how many millions of EU a year this fraud is costing Finns while the police sit and do nothing, don't even have a cybercrime unit set up to address the problem, don't have any internal estimate of the volume of cybercrime, don't have a spokesman familiar with the issue, etc.

That would sell a few papers and ads.

But there are plenty of resources to ensure nobody drives 10 kph over the speed limit. Yeah, there could be a sidebar in the article with all the annoying and in some cases probably stupid things the police DO have resources to clamp down on, only not to address the most widespread crime in the nation.

It could be very satisfying to work for a unit investigating these crimes. Frustrating at times, but interesting and satisfying as well. The evidence trail is probably better than for quite a few other types of crime, but people and organizations do this in large part precisely because they know the police turn a blind eye.
As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.


winsiebunny
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by winsiebunny » Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:26 pm

The seller speaks perfect Finnish and the bank account is OP bank kajaani branch. it doesn't look like a criminal a who is not here. It is just that the fraudster faked his name so the police said there is no real name of the suspect. ( can't they request the bank for the information?) anyway, just remember always pick up ! Never use post!


winsiebunny
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by winsiebunny » Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:27 pm

It feels that it doesn't cost anything to commit a crime like this in Finland because they know the police won't care.


007
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by 007 » Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:53 pm

winsiebunny wrote:It feels that it doesn't cost anything to commit a crime like this in Finland because they know the police won't care.
You can be sure that the person who cheated you lives on sossu and is a junkie. In such cases, society cannot do anything. Putting in jail is the only available option but it seems to cost society even more.

I have also been a victim of online fraud. It was through huuto.net. Nowadays, I do face-to-face dealings only if money involved exceeds 15-20 euros.

You can check my post history if you are interested in my case. Bit tired as well as uncomfortable to write on mobile phone.
“Go where you are celebrated – not tolerated."
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007
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by 007 » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:04 pm

My cycle got stolen yesterday. And, police won't go a thing. Police force is tremendously overstreched lat
“Go where you are celebrated – not tolerated."
"Aina, kun opit uuden sanan, opettele samalla sen monikko!"


Upphew
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Upphew » Thu Jul 14, 2016 11:17 am

007 wrote:My cycle got stolen yesterday. And, police won't go a thing. Police force is tremendously overstreched lat
The bike is either on sale/sold in tori/huuto/fb, stripped of components or just laying in some ditch. What could police do even if they had manpower?
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007
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by 007 » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:30 pm

Upphew wrote:
007 wrote:My cycle got stolen yesterday. And, police won't go a thing. Police force is tremendously overstreched lat
The bike is either on sale/sold in tori/huuto/fb, stripped of components or just laying in some ditch. What could police do even if they had manpower?
My bike is stolen and I get a snide remark. :x Of course, police can do a lot if possible. I understand that police has limited resources and cannot probably do much because of that, but why do you think that they won't do a thing about bike theft if they have manpower and other resources. After all, their credibility is on line when people fear for their properties and believe that police cannot do a thing about it.

Bike theft has skyrocketed over the years. And, a handful of thugs have made a life out of it. I am sure police will be happy to get them. I mean there's organized gangs that steal bikes here and sell in eastern europe. Well..I am not suggesting that local theives are less guilty. Mofos put stolen bikes online for sales and all that a victim can do is nothing (unless lucky enough to notice it on time). :evil:
“Go where you are celebrated – not tolerated."
"Aina, kun opit uuden sanan, opettele samalla sen monikko!"


DMC
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by DMC » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:42 pm

Upphew wrote:What could police do even if they had manpower?
Many years ago I did some research for a UK police force who had huge stocks of recovered cycles (which they periodically auctioned off) and huge piles of stolen cycle reports. Their problem was difficulty matching a recovered cycle to a stolen cycle report. I discovered that the average plod could not describe a cycle correctly even when it was right in front of him, and very few owners could accurately describe their cycle after it was stolen. It was so bad that the only 100% reliable piece of information available from owners was which side of the handlebars their bell or horn was mounted (if they had a bell or horn). I developed a computer system for matching lost & found reports coupled with a picture-based description method that did improve things a little but was never really successful and was quite time-consuming to operate. So even if the police were to recover a stolen cycle the odds of the original owner getting it back was low. I doubt if it is much better now, or here.


Rosamunda
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Rosamunda » Thu Jul 14, 2016 1:29 pm

....many years ago...

But surely, nowadays it should be relatively simple to conceal an RFID or even a simple bar code or microchip (like cats and dogs) somewhere in a bike. I'm surprised nobody has come up with some kind of app/service that would help people to trace, or at least prove ownership of, their bikes.

I rarely use my bike in Espoo for the simple reason that I don't want it to get stolen (we have had bikes removed from outside our front door). I will have the same issue when (if) the metro extension ever opens. Where will I leave my bike and will it be secure?


Upphew
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Upphew » Thu Jul 14, 2016 2:37 pm

007 wrote:
Upphew wrote:
007 wrote:My cycle got stolen yesterday. And, police won't go a thing. Police force is tremendously overstreched lat
The bike is either on sale/sold in tori/huuto/fb, stripped of components or just laying in some ditch. What could police do even if they had manpower?
My bike is stolen and I get a snide remark. :x Of course, police can do a lot if possible. I understand that police has limited resources and cannot probably do much because of that, but why do you think that they won't do a thing about bike theft if they have manpower and other resources. After all, their credibility is on line when people fear for their properties and believe that police cannot do a thing about it.
Snide remark my ass. I've lost my share of bikes. Not lately, but about 20000mk worth of them. One was found. Couple were never seen again, probably sold for components or were later recovered in drug bust or something. Regardless, I got something from insurance and after that it might have gone a bit hairy if the bike(s) were found.

What police could do? Drive eyes peeled on people driving bikes and stop them? Bust druggies on hunch? Those are not likely to happen and easily identified bikes are not likely to be seen driven around or parked on sight. Even if police had double the manpower, I can't imagine them doing anything differently about stolen bikes.
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Upphew
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Re: Tori.fi fraud and police response

Post by Upphew » Thu Jul 14, 2016 2:49 pm

Rosamunda wrote:....many years ago...

But surely, nowadays it should be relatively simple to conceal an RFID or even a simple bar code or microchip (like cats and dogs) somewhere in a bike. I'm surprised nobody has come up with some kind of app/service that would help people to trace, or at least prove ownership of, their bikes.
Bikes have VINs too and police asks for it when you report theft. I'm not sure if I have mine written down anywhere...

RFID tags would be nice, they would be easily scannable from distance. Thieves could probably fry them, but it would help. My newest one talks BT and can inform other bikes about its whereabouts if reported stolen. Dunno if that works, especially as there aren't that many of those bikes in Finland. But the technology is coming.
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