Gigantti instalments only for Citizens?

[Honest]

That might be against EU rules but that is logical. How would they recover their 10000 euros from somebody living in Romania?

[onlyforgame]

That might be against EU rules but that is logical. How would they recover their 10000 euros from somebody living in Romania?

That makes sense :v

[Sunil-123]

Resident doesn't mean you are never gonna return to your home country. You migh be robbing all shops which offer credit before making your final flight,

[betelgeuse]

Are they legally right to provide the instalment payment system only to citizens?

No.

Ketään ei saa syrjiä iän, alkuperän, kansalaisuuden, kielen, uskonnon, vakaumuksen, mielipiteen, poliittisen toiminnan, ammattiyhdistystoiminnan, perhesuhteiden, terveydentilan, vammaisuuden, seksuaalisen suuntautumisen tai muun henkilöön liittyvän syyn perusteella. Syrjintä on kielletty riippumatta siitä, perustuuko se henkilöä itseään vai jotakuta toista koskevaan tosiseikkaan tai oletukseen.

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/alkup/2014 ... idp1104000

I went to Megastore to buy something and asked the seller if I could use that 10 months instalment options, he said its only for citizens. I said him, no it cannot be, there cannot be a different rule for citizen and other EU citizens inside the EU states. He wasn't quiet expecting that reply from me and went to ask his supervisor where they discussed a bit and came up with confident reply that the service is only for Finnish Citizen.

There's rules for discrimination in the functioning of the EU itself but I would be interested in seeing a source that extends it to the private sector (might just be that I haven't researched the topic enough). For example the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights says only:

1. Any discrimination based on any ground such as sex, race, colour, ethnic or social origin, genetic features, language, religion or belief, political or any other opinion, membership of a national minority, property, birth, disability, age or sexual orientation shall be prohibited.

2. Within the scope of application of the Treaties and without prejudice to any of their specific provisions, any discrimination on grounds of nationality shall be prohibited.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/ ... 12012P/TXT

At first the seller asked my ID to write something in computer, I gave him driving license which he denied and asked for another card, I gave him the card from police. Upon Police card he was typing something in computer and asked me aren't you a citizen? I said yes I am citizen of my country but not of Finland. In that case, he went to ask his supervisor and later came and asked for passport (assuming I'd not have one). I gave him my passport and he went to his supervisor again and after some discussions they were in conclusion that I cannot buy the item in instalments as I have to be citizen as the computer says so. I said him the same EU citizen cannot be treated separately within EU states which they said will inform and ask with their big bosses.

Conclusion: Gigantti instalment payments are only for citizens. Another thing I couldn't grasp is what is secret thing that only citizens have as per Gigantti instalment payment system form? that other residents don't?

You should make a complaint to the Non-Discrimination Ombudsman:

https://www.syrjinta.fi/web/en/customer-service

[Oho]

You should make a complaint to the Non-Discrimination Ombudsman.

Not gonna work, citizenship is valid bases for treating people asking for credit differently because of increased risk of debtor defaulting on the loan by moving out of the country.

[betelgeuse]

You should make a complaint to the Non-Discrimination Ombudsman.

Not gonna work, citizenship is valid bases for treating people asking for credit differently because of increased risk of debtor defaulting on the loan by moving out of the country.

So you think a foreign national who has lived their whole life in Finland has a higher risk of moving out of country than a Finnish citizen who just yesterday moved to the country? Using a rigid rule that only allows Finnish citizens is discriminatory and illegal. It is valid, for example, to deny applications of people who have not been resident long enough (regardless of citizenship).

PS. Moving out of the country does not automatically mean you can't be collected from.

[Honest]

Leaving your country forever for 10-20 thousands is a lot less likely than leaving another Country to come back to your Country with the same amount of money

[Oho]

So you think a foreign national who has lived their whole life in Finland has a higher risk of moving out of country than a Finnish citizen who just yesterday moved to the country?

Does not really matter what I think, now does it. I think its a pretty safe bet Gigantti has had the policy scrutinized before implementing it as it obviously is quite controversial and perhaps ended up at such blunt formulation precisely to avoid discrimination charges even if in reality they had out most trust in some nationalities or individuals. Collecting from foreign jurisdictions, sure, but I doubt that possibility obligates the creditor in any way.

Its the flip-side of anti discrimination legislation. You are really not allowed to asses the risk individually lest you be accused of discriminatory practices, and thus you end up using very blunt instruments indeed... Shows in hiring too, companies have started avoiding hiring women and minorities because getting rid of bad hires is so much easier when the recruit is a white or an East-Asian male.

[Oho]

Leaving your country forever for 10-20 thousands is a lot less likely than leaving another Country to come back to your Country with the same amount of money

Well its not just that, the only country where one really has positive right to reside in is the country of his/her citizenship.

[betelgeuse]

Does not really matter what I think, now does it.

It depends on what you do for a living. Since you contracted the Non-discrimination Act without sources, probably not. Here's the unofficial translation in case it makes understanding easier.

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokset ... 141325.pdf

I think its a pretty safe bet Gigantti has had the policy scrutinized before implementing it as it obviously is quite controversial and perhaps ended up at such blunt formulation precisely to avoid discrimination charges even if in reality they had out most trust in some nationalities or individuals.

If they really did scrutinise it and the facts of this thread hold, then they need to get better advice.

Its the flip-side of anti discrimination legislation. You are really not allowed to asses the risk individually lest you be accused of discriminatory practices, and thus you end up using very blunt instruments indeed... Shows in hiring too, companies have started avoiding hiring women and minorities because getting rid of bad hires is so much easier when the recruit is a white or an East-Asian male.

To some extend I agree on the effect on actors (which does not mean the laws automatically should be changed). However, for lending individual risk assessment is fine (think about credit cards and young males).

Leaving your country forever for 10-20 thousands is a lot less likely than leaving another Country to come back to your Country with the same amount of money

Well its not just that, the only country where one really has positive right to reside in is the country of his/her citizenship.

Hogwash. How do you reconcile your statement with rights granted by for example European Union citizenship?

[Rosamunda]

Thanks for sharing your plight. I will think twice before shopping there again and probably go elsewhere. Have you tried Verkkokauppa? Do they have similar rules? Hobby Hall?

[Oho]

Hogwash. How do you reconcile your statement with rights granted by for example European Union citizenship?

That's not an inalienable right but a contractual one. Gone as soon as EU membership and subject to conditions even as it stands, i.e commit a crime serious enough and you are out on your ass which really is not the case for citizens, not quite sure but if not mistaken the right is also conditioned on ability to support one self after the three month or 90-day grace period.

[betelgeuse]

Hogwash. How do you reconcile your statement with rights granted by for example European Union citizenship?

That's not an inalienable right but a contractual one.

It's a right granted by a treaty (not a contract). Treaties are part of legislation like domestic acts.

Gone as soon as EU membership and subject to conditions even as it stands, i.e commit a crime serious enough and you are out on your ass which really is not the case for citizens, not quite sure but if not mistaken the right is also conditioned on ability to support one self after the three month or 90-day grace period.

So are any other rights (like the right for citizens to return) if the Finnish parliament so decides. Yes citizens do have stronger rights to be in the country. After tens years of residence an EU citizen or their family member can only be deported on imperative grounds of public security.

[sky2]

see my response to your mate above. As I said thieves and fraudsters are the ones who thinks about stealing, robbing and running away, not a decent human. Also as reputed member of the society my duty is to help those thieves from not doing wrong thing and start earning their own living.

It's not written on anyone's face who is fraudster and who is not.

I guess you need help, come to Luckan Integration on Monday (17th October) around 15.00, there is 3 hours session to help and peer support unemployed immigrants like you. People are really good there and they do really help and support. If possible I'll come too, I like giving support to fellow immigrants finding job in Finland, so they do not have to think about stealing and robbing any more.

Adsress is:
Luckan Integration, Simonsgatan 8
Helsinki, 00100 Finland

may be, just maybe you showed the same attitude to them as well? Being polite helps sometimes.

[sky2]

wrong assumptions, try again.

No, I won't waste my time as I got better things to do. Instead you try again.. to buy things you can't afford paying at once.