Married man affair and police

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jack2012
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Married man affair and police

Post by jack2012 » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:51 pm

Hi,

One of my friend, she was in relationship with a guy who was already married. So, she feels that she was cheated and lied for sexual purpose. Someone told me long ago that women in Finland can make complain in such situation and also ask for some money as compensation. Can anyone advise what should she do? Also, both are in Finland as student and on Study residence permit.

Kiitos



Married man affair and police

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Piet
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Piet » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:06 pm

jack2012 wrote:Hi,

One of my friend, she was in relationship with a guy who was already married. So, she feels that she was cheated and lied for sexual purpose. Someone told me long ago that women in Finland can make complain in such situation and also ask for some money as compensation. Can anyone advise what should she do? Also, both are in Finland as student and on Study residence permit.

Kiitos
If you want anything remotely like a court case (without that, possibly no money), you will need evidence, without evidence of anything against the law, there is no case so no money.

(Finnish) law is not always logical, but I can imagine that if the guy being unmarried was a condition for the lady to consent with having sex with the guy, that condition has not been met and therefore the sex was done without consent which equals rape. But, that is just my logic.

What she could try (but dangerous and against the law so I am definitely not encouraging her to do that) is blackmail him with telling his wife, lots of films are made about that!! :lol: :lol:
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FinnGuyHelsinki
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by FinnGuyHelsinki » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:56 am

If the sex was consensual (and both parties were 16 years or older) then there was no rape. There is no law granting compensation for having second thoughts afterwards. Verbal agreements are valid, but she'll have hard time proving such ever existed, and furthermore that agreeing to having sex was her end of the deal (as if it was somehow uncommon for two adults to have sex otherwise).


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Oombongo
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Oombongo » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:02 pm

nopes. No such punishment or laws against cheating and adultery.

Your information is old like about 200 years.
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AldenG
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by AldenG » Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:07 pm

I believe one or more sex-under-false-pretenses cases have been won in Sweden but I don't recall the details nor whether the concept was plain fraud (receiving something of value by deception) or unlawful sex, of which Swedish law recognizes a number of varieties.
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betelgeuse
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by betelgeuse » Tue Dec 12, 2017 5:33 pm

Oombongo wrote:nopes. No such punishment or laws against cheating and adultery.

Your information is old like about 200 years.
Not exactly true. We do have the following on the books:
Chapter 18 - Offences against family rights
Section 1
(1) If someone states that his or her name or station is other than what it actually is and if another person is thus deceived into a marriage agreement, or if someone misleads another into a marriage agreement by concealing a legal impediment to marriage or another circumstance which could cause the marriage to be annulled, he or she shall be sentenced to imprisonment for at most one year or to a fine.
(2) If also a wedding is performed or if the deceiver has sexual intercourse with the woman who was misled into the marriage agreement, he shall be sentenced to imprisonment for at least six months and at most two years or, if the circumstances are very aggravating, to imprisonment for at least six months and at most four years.
(3) The public prosecutor may not bring charges for the offence mentioned here unless the injured party has reported the offence for the bringing of charges or applied in court for the annulment of the marriage agreement or of the marriage. (441/2011)
https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokse ... 890039.pdf


betelgeuse
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by betelgeuse » Tue Dec 12, 2017 5:40 pm

Piet wrote: (Finnish) law is not always logical, but I can imagine that if the guy being unmarried was a condition for the lady to consent with having sex with the guy, that condition has not been met and therefore the sex was done without consent which equals rape. But, that is just my logic.
Lack of consent is not sufficient to constitute a rape as a crime. See chapter 20. Lying to get laid is not a crime in Finland.

https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokse ... 890039.pdf


Upphew
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Upphew » Wed Dec 13, 2017 9:17 am

betelgeuse wrote:
Oombongo wrote:nopes. No such punishment or laws against cheating and adultery.

Your information is old like about 200 years.
Not exactly true. We do have the following on the books:
Chapter 18 - Offences against family rights
Section 1
(1) If someone states that his or her name or station is other than what it actually is and if another person is thus deceived into a marriage agreement, or if someone misleads another into a marriage agreement by concealing a legal impediment to marriage or another circumstance which could cause the marriage to be annulled, he or she shall be sentenced to imprisonment for at most one year or to a fine.
(2) If also a wedding is performed or if the deceiver has sexual intercourse with the woman who was misled into the marriage agreement, he shall be sentenced to imprisonment for at least six months and at most two years or, if the circumstances are very aggravating, to imprisonment for at least six months and at most four years.
(3) The public prosecutor may not bring charges for the offence mentioned here unless the injured party has reported the offence for the bringing of charges or applied in court for the annulment of the marriage agreement or of the marriage. (441/2011)
https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokse ... 890039.pdf
Family rights mean here mainly inheritance and family name. So no marrying while married or changing names to get inheritance. Anyway the punishments are fines or jail. Good luck for op's friend getting something for herself.
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Piet
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Piet » Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:32 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 5:40 pm
Piet wrote: (Finnish) law is not always logical, but I can imagine that if the guy being unmarried was a condition for the lady to consent with having sex with the guy, that condition has not been met and therefore the sex was done without consent which equals rape. But, that is just my logic.
Lack of consent is not sufficient to constitute a rape as a crime. See chapter 20. Lying to get laid is not a crime in Finland.

https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokse ... 890039.pdf
I guess that is exactly the reason Sweden is now, as we speak, changing the law in that matter, in Sweden you will need explicit consent for sex, otherwise it will be rape. This might prove to be a problem for a lot of people in case they need to provide evidence of this consent.

I remember a movie, where one needed a contract to have sex (was it cherry 2000??)

I guess Finland (and almost the whole rest of the world :lol: ) is running behind on Sweden regarding this matter.
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betelgeuse
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by betelgeuse » Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:58 pm

Piet wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:32 pm
I guess that is exactly the reason Sweden is now, as we speak, changing the law in that matter, in Sweden you will need explicit consent for sex, otherwise it will be rape. This might prove to be a problem for a lot of people in case they need to provide evidence of this consent.
Sweden is not planning to remove the presumption of innocence. It will be up to the prosecutor to prove lack of consent if it passes.
Past critics have claimed that the new law will not result in more court sentences, but the government and Löfven stress that it is also designed to change societal norms:
"We want to change society's attitudes and values".
https://www.thelocal.se/20171218/swedis ... onsent-law


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Piet
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Piet » Thu Dec 21, 2017 6:43 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:58 pm

Sweden is not planning to remove the presumption of innocence. It will be up to the prosecutor to prove lack of consent if it passes.
Past critics have claimed that the new law will not result in more court sentences, but the government and Löfven stress that it is also designed to change societal norms:
"We want to change society's attitudes and values".
https://www.thelocal.se/20171218/swedis ... onsent-law
So how does that work? How can you prove you did not say something (give consent)? that is technically impossible. One can only prove someone said something (by a recording for example). So effectively this does remove the presumption of innocence when charged by the victim and there are no witnesses you gave (got) consent.

It would be helpful to get the actual law text but I guess that is to much off topic to there.. :wink:
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AldenG
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by AldenG » Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:16 am

Piet wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:32 pm
I guess that is exactly the reason Sweden is now, as we speak, changing the law in that matter, in Sweden you will need explicit consent for sex, otherwise it will be rape. This might prove to be a problem for a lot of people in case they need to provide evidence of this consent.

I remember a movie, where one needed a contract to have sex (was it cherry 2000??)

I guess Finland (and almost the whole rest of the world :lol: ) is running behind on Sweden regarding this matter.
So pretty soon there will be booklets of panoseteleitä, huh? Your employer hands them out at the start of the month along with your lounassetelit, but you can also buy more wherever condoms are sold. And to have sex, you must both (or all 3, 4, whatever you're into) sign and exchange coupons from your respective booklets. I wonder how long you'll be required to keep them.

I'm surprised the EU hasn't already created such a system, now that I think of it. I suppose the more southern members might not be on board with such a proposal.
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Piet
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Re: Married man affair and police

Post by Piet » Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:19 pm

AldenG wrote:
Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:16 am

So pretty soon there will be booklets of panoseteleitä, huh? Your employer hands them out at the start of the month along with your lounassetelit, but you can also buy more wherever condoms are sold. And to have sex, you must both (or all 3, 4, whatever you're into) sign and exchange coupons from your respective booklets. I wonder how long you'll be required to keep them.

I'm surprised the EU hasn't already created such a system, now that I think of it. I suppose the more southern members might not be on board with such a proposal.
:lol: :lol:

Exactly! and being married does not exempt you from this system, might to want to keep them until you die or divorce :lol: otherwise this might be a severe problem when dividing the assets after a divorce (potential of blackmail). :ochesey:
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