Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

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Pursuivant
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Pursuivant » Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:05 pm

I think the "ewww" you hear when your 10-year old lad gives a frog from his pocket to the neighbours girl might be close... ish... but I always need two beers to get my Estonian õ out.


"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."

Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

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Rosamunda
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Rosamunda » Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:34 pm

Yes, that is very close too. We actually watched some frogs (or were they toads) copulating on TV this evening and my youngest voiced a very loud "eeeeewwwwww" when he figured out what they were (all) doing.
(Infact, the bilabial semi-vowel /w/ is frictionless, ie not voiced)

Lazydriver
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Lazydriver » Sun Apr 19, 2009 2:24 am

Pursuivant wrote:
Lazydriver wrote:But aren't taxes there through the roof?
Well... yes, but then again we have it all packaged into "taxes" more or less, whereas you pay for the stuff we take for granted on the side.... roof? You think we can afford roofs? Of course, everyone has a roof they can afford, but thats the idea. Have you heard how we define traffic and other fines. :wink:

... the cunning plan is to invite Bill Gates over, lend him a Ferrari and get rid of the national debt....
Heh, thanks for the link. I'd assume there are taxes on how large someone's house is? Besides, your national debt is nothing compared to ours. We'd need 370 Bill Gates to pay ours off (and we don't even have a decent infrastructure, just insane spending on blowing things up!).
Pursuivant wrote:a "linguist" meaning a person that has a minimum of a masters degree in lingusitics... languages are actually not a requirement as theres a doctor Ammondt that sings Elvis songs in Sumerian. he's a linguist but don't know if he speaks any languages - live ones that is...
I see. Well, I suppose the better term would be "somebody who knows four languages", because the word "translator" would only apply to one job type. As, I see, linguist too.
penelope wrote: No, not even close.

The Finnish "y" sounds like a French "u" as in but, cul, du, eu, etc
I can't really think of a similar sound in English.

The French "aux" sounds more like the English "oh!" or "owe"
Oh! is more like the Spanish O or the Finnish, well, hell, I dunno.

Ewe is more like aux. Of course, that w has another phoneme besides ''water''.... Ah, English, you evil bastard. But yeah, everyone else's "ewwww" idea works.
easily-lost wrote:
You can make lots of money out of whatever profession, but one important issue is whether you are good enough. However, I'm not sure how long you can keep the original goal of being a linguist, especially after reading your quick switch to maths because of money.

Since you want to know if you would be hired in Finland as a linguist without any degree, a more practical way of answering that is actually a question for yourself:

Will people in your home country hire you as a linguist who has no degrees at all?

Surprise me.
I heard that people who speak many languages rarely get any specialized jobs over it, at least in Vegas. I'd assume it's that way in Finland after hearing about people who speak four or five languages when they get out of high school there. I was hoping to wait till I got to Finland, and then started to study Math there while having a job that has me use my language skills (because you people have free universities and I hate loans), but hey.

When it comes to a matter of money, I just want to eventually end up with a nice income. Enough to buy whatever food I fancy at the time (except for expensive stuff like caviar or 100-year-old Wine), and pay for a nice computer as well a decent car as well as a decent apartment or house and still be able to pay the bills. Whether that will happen in America or Finland is debatable, I'd still like to go to Finland one day irregardless.

Karhunkoski wrote:
onkko wrote:Kar, keer, kät. Its simple when you write it finnish :)
Indeed, we should adopt many typres of car

carsta
carlta
carssa
cariin
caraa
caroja
carjoista
carjoilta
carjoissa
carjoihin


And more to give a nice round 48 forms to the word (16 cases x partitive x plural partitive forms, etc), now that would be fun! :lol:
Yes, but there are probably that many variations in sentences when it comes to car depending on what you want to do with it in English :p. Except, it's not synthetic. You can get in a car in a number of ways, will you go under the car, over the car, on top of the car, below the car, break the window, open the door, pick the lock, and will you do it with others, etc.

Anyway, what do those forms of the car do with the car?
Where I live, it gets up to 55C in the Summer and it's rare to find someone that speaks Finnish. How's your sauna?

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Pursuivant
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Pursuivant » Sun Apr 19, 2009 11:49 am

Lazydriver wrote: I'd assume there are taxes on how large someone's house is?
Nope, thats in the UK. The price of construction and heating bills keeps the houses and apartments small... I saw how you build houses in Lost Wagers... my garden shed has more insulation.
Pursuivant wrote: "somebody who knows four languages",
Yeah, but you need to have a profession. Like doing something. Now as for someone not speaking Finnish and not having qualifications, you can't even get a job in McD. Maybe cleaning vomit from the buses at night kind of job. See now theres no need for languages in grunt jobs - except what everybody else speaks- and jobs which needs education the languages are taken for granted. So in other words "speaking 4 languages" isn't anything worth hiring some non-EU foreigner. We get people from the EU already -and our "south of the water" guys speak our language already. So to "make" it here your only option is the study path. Now it might help if you knew some trade that actually was in demand to make ends meet during studies.
I just want to eventually end up with a nice income.
I don't mind the income... just the cost of stuff.

Anyway, what do those forms of the car do with the car?
car
car's
on a car
from a car
into a car
with a car
yadayadayada
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."

Rosamunda
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Rosamunda » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:01 pm

Lazydriver wrote:
Ewe is more like aux.
:?
Ah non, tu t'es égaré...

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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by enk » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:56 pm

penelope wrote:
Lazydriver wrote:
Ewe is more like aux.
:?
Ah non, tu t'es égaré...
C'est ce que j'ai dit.... (and feel free to correct that. It's been about 15 years since I studied French :D)

-enk

Rosamunda
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Rosamunda » Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:15 pm

Well, it's 28 years since I actually studied French.... :lol:
Your French looks fine to me!

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easily-lost
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by easily-lost » Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:31 pm

Lazydriver wrote:I heard that people who speak many languages rarely get any specialized jobs over it, at least in Vegas. I'd assume it's that way in Finland after hearing about people who speak four or five languages when they get out of high school there...

When it comes to a matter of money, I just want to eventually end up with a nice income. Enough to buy whatever food I fancy at the time (except for expensive stuff like caviar or 100-year-old Wine), and pay for a nice computer as well a decent car as well as a decent apartment or house and still be able to pay the bills. Whether that will happen in America or Finland is debatable, I'd still like to go to Finland one day irregardless.
I think you can tell the differences between "speaking several languages" and "specialized in several languages" by now, can't you? 8)

A language speaker vs a linguist = day and night

It's good to have dreams, but make sure your feet are always on the ground, otherwise you fall hard.
Se ei pelaa, joka pelkää.

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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by pierrot » Sun Apr 19, 2009 2:15 pm

Lazydriver wrote:
It should have been: Mein Name ist Lazydriver. Ich frage Sie, wo bzw. wie ich in Finnland Arbeit für einen Linguisten/Sprachwissenschaftler finden kann.
But I guess you just wanted to dumb it down again for the unwashed crowd here ...
Was ist bzw.? Etwa ich werde suche für das wört "schaftler"? Doch kann ich habe mein "Sie'' ins Ende von die Meinung? Ich glaube dass Deutsch war eine flexibel Sprache!
bzw. = beziehungsweise. Und nein, Deutsch ist keine flexible Sprache.
Is the rest of the sentence supposed to mean anything?
Here in Finland, I have done everything I can to blend-in with the Finns, I've changed my hair color, wore differnet clothes, got different

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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by enk » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:35 pm

penelope wrote:Well, it's 28 years since I actually studied French.... :lol:
Your French looks fine to me!
Cool :D Well the last time I used French was about 10 years ago and then
my pronounciation managed to provoke the snotty guy sitting next to me
into almost horking up his mineral water :D

Here's how you learn languages in the States, btw. I spent years in
Spanish classes, which in my high school's opinion entitled me to skip
beginning French and go straight to advanced :D So imagine someone
speaking French as if they were speaking Spanish and painfully
pronouncing each and every letter in each and every word ;) The poor
kid sitting next to me, who had spent the previous 5 years in school
in Paris, cringed every time :D

-enk

Lazydriver
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by Lazydriver » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:00 am

enk wrote:
penelope wrote:Well, it's 28 years since I actually studied French.... :lol:
Your French looks fine to me!
Cool :D Well the last time I used French was about 10 years ago and then
my pronounciation managed to provoke the snotty guy sitting next to me
into almost horking up his mineral water :D

Here's how you learn languages in the States, btw. I spent years in
Spanish classes, which in my high school's opinion entitled me to skip
beginning French and go straight to advanced :D So imagine someone
speaking French as if they were speaking Spanish and painfully
pronouncing each and every letter in each and every word ;) The poor
kid sitting next to me, who had spent the previous 5 years in school
in Paris, cringed every time :D

-enk
Ah the joys of a system students really have no say in... But I hear you.

Spanish is lovely though with the fact every letter means something. But as a gabacho, my Spanish is going to be easy to ridicule. It's okay though, it works both ways :p.
Where I live, it gets up to 55C in the Summer and it's rare to find someone that speaks Finnish. How's your sauna?

AldenG
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by AldenG » Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:05 am

Dude -- lose the caffeine and especially the Red Bull. Somebody should've told ME that when I was your age. Seriously. It's messin' you up.

You came here for answers, but it's not the right answers you lack. It's the right questions. And you only learn those by listening and observing inconspicuously for a long time. In other words, by acting like a Finn.

What passes for doing something well in the States only rates mediocre at best in the Finnish scale of expectations. Especially in the sciences and most especially in engineering. That would be your first adjustment. Finns respect and pay their engineers the way the U.S. pays doctors (well, almost). And doctors in Finland only make out like engineers in the U.S.

Yes, you could learn a lot in Finland. The inherent value of stillness would be high on the list.

The bit about "most Finns" being fluent in multiple languages is a bit exaggerated. Conversant would be more like it, and even that is only in the cities. English, sure. Swedish, French, or German, that's not as common as some might lead you to believe. Nonetheless the way to approach Finland, like the way to approach most things in life, is as a humble learner. And really you should probably focus on learning ONE language really well. Trying to learn that many languages you will inevitably become a dilettante. You will put more effort into becoming merely conversant in Finnish than into all your other languages combined. And I for one have never met someone who succeeded in doing it without/before living in Finland.
As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.

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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by jas_rho » Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:19 am

AldenG wrote:Dude -- lose the caffeine and especially the Red Bull. Somebody should've told ME that when I was your age. Seriously. It's messin' you up.

You came here for answers, but it's not the right answers you lack. It's the right questions. And you only learn those by listening and observing inconspicuously for a long time. In other words, by acting like a Finn.

What passes for doing something well in the States only rates mediocre at best in the Finnish scale of expectations. Especially in the sciences and most especially in engineering. That would be your first adjustment. Finns respect and pay their engineers the way the U.S. pays doctors (well, almost). And doctors in Finland only make out like engineers in the U.S.

Yes, you could learn a lot in Finland. The inherent value of stillness would be high on the list.

The bit about "most Finns" being fluent in multiple languages is a bit exaggerated. Conversant would be more like it, and even that is only in the cities. English, sure. Swedish, French, or German, that's not as common as some might lead you to believe. Nonetheless the way to approach Finland, like the way to approach most things in life, is as a humble learner. And really you should probably focus on learning ONE language really well. Trying to learn that many languages you will inevitably become a dilettante. You will put more effort into becoming merely conversant in Finnish than into all your other languages combined. And I for one have never met someone who succeeded in doing it without/before living in Finland.
Dunno where you have looked but at least in the field that I work in, for the most part the engineers in the US get paid better than here in Finland. I am talking about in the telecom industry. Plus taxes are lower in the US and things are cheaper.
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AldenG
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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by AldenG » Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:13 pm

jas_rho wrote: Dunno where you have looked but at least in the field that I work in, for the most part the engineers in the US get paid better than here in Finland. I am talking about in the telecom industry. Plus taxes are lower in the US and things are cheaper.
Yeah, I was unclear about that.

Everything except menial work gets paid better in the U.S., though once you start looking at the cost of providing what your taxes buy in Finland, the tax comparison gets murky.

But the relationship between engineering and medicine within Finland seems inverted compared to the U.S. In fact, that's probably true through much of the E.U.

Our health care system in the U.S. is in meltdown, even for people with money and good insurance. Nobody knows the meaning of meticulous diagnosis any more, assuming they ever did in the first place. The integrity of our clinical research is in the toilet; we have almost 30 years' worth of selective publication of research results to go back through and try to ascertain what the REAL benefits were. (Almost any drug can be made to look good if you run 100 studies and publish only the best 15 of them, using nondisclosure and proprietary data agreements to gag the people who ran the other 85.)

Even though Finland's public health care has suffered due to budgetary problems, I'd still be 10x more willing to entrust my life to a Finnish hospital than to even a prestigious American one. The American hospital might have more equipment available, but there's no substitute for people who dot their i's and cross their t's and don't jump to hasty conclusions.

Apologists in the U.S. talk about the handful of very wealthy Europeans who come to the U.S. to jump the line on operations or scarce resources. Very few talk about the tens of thousands (possibly more) of Americans going to places like India these days to get operations their insurance company wriggles out of paying for.
As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.

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Re: Reckon They Could Use A Degreeless Linguist?

Post by jas_rho » Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:24 pm

AldenG wrote:
jas_rho wrote: Dunno where you have looked but at least in the field that I work in, for the most part the engineers in the US get paid better than here in Finland. I am talking about in the telecom industry. Plus taxes are lower in the US and things are cheaper.
Yeah, I was unclear about that.

Everything except menial work gets paid better in the U.S., though once you start looking at the cost of providing what your taxes buy in Finland, the tax comparison gets murky.

But the relationship between engineering and medicine within Finland seems inverted compared to the U.S. In fact, that's probably true through much of the E.U.

Our health care system in the U.S. is in meltdown, even for people with money and good insurance. Nobody knows the meaning of meticulous diagnosis any more, assuming they ever did in the first place. The integrity of our clinical research is in the toilet; we have almost 30 years' worth of selective publication of research results to go back through and try to ascertain what the REAL benefits were. (Almost any drug can be made to look good if you run 100 studies and publish only the best 15 of them, using nondisclosure and proprietary data agreements to gag the people who ran the other 85.)

Even though Finland's public health care has suffered due to budgetary problems, I'd still be 10x more willing to entrust my life to a Finnish hospital than to even a prestigious American one. The American hospital might have more equipment available, but there's no substitute for people who dot their i's and cross their t's and don't jump to hasty conclusions.

Apologists in the U.S. talk about the handful of very wealthy Europeans who come to the U.S. to jump the line on operations or scarce resources. Very few talk about the tens of thousands (possibly more) of Americans going to places like India these days to get operations their insurance company wriggles out of paying for.
Yeah I can somewhat agree with you on your points and do understand what you mean. I know the amounts of comments I might get for what I am about to write but its my opinion and that's that. I have been living in Finland now 10 years and have yet to ever used any of their public health services. I guess I should be happy that I am a healthy person and haven't needed it and yes I understand that you can never know when you will need it etc. But I have paid a heck of a lot of taxes and haven't got anything out of it. I would like to know what I would have had to pay insurance wise if I was living in the US and compare it that way. I guess I should admit I have been to a dentist here twice now so I have used the public dental service these past years. Now its coming time for me to get a check up so I decided to get in line and was told that 6 months from now someone will give me a call to set up an appointment. That's pretty bad if you ask me. Oh, and I get health care through my work here in Finland too so even if I did get sick I wouldn't go to the public sector. I am not one to judge who is better in health care, US vs EU. I personally feel that one is not better than the other in terms of quality. Of course if you are looking for faults you'll find them. But that's on both sides. Some people might think that why don't I just move to the states then? Well I would and just might some day but I also accept that they way things are here is just how they do it so I gotta do it too if I choose to live here ;) I can accept that.
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