sell services for cash

[truman]

Hi everyone.

Until now i was doing business in Finland by non-cash transactions.
Now... There is some client outside EU to sell to him in cash my non-material services.
I am planning place this cash on company's bank account myself as sale proceeds:
1. Do i have a right to do so on my behalf or
my client needs to go to the bank (Danske) and place this cash on my company's bank account only himself
as payment on invoice?
2. Do i need cash book to make notes about it? (Until now i have not one. I am not planning to settle something in cash
and have a company cash reserve whatsoever)
3. What company details do i need to get from the client?

Cheers

[cors187]

You sound like a black marketeer.

I had a long convo with one once.
Essentially they leave their own country because its crap, full of black money, everyone trying to do some business without paying for the privilege.
They come to another country like Finland which has a thriving white money economy due to smart planning,systematic check points etc.

Then they wander around looking at ways to create black money markets and reject the "privilege payments or dues".

If it was a medical journal , these entrepreneurs are classified as tumors.

These tumors are always taking and never returning anything.

If it was a family ,these entrepreneurs are classified as an intruder coming into your home and sitting at your dinner table eating from the plates of food.
Leaving a trail of morsels that the seagulls(criminal.org) look for.

Now the house has seagulls and intruders and after a while the intruder complains and goes to another clean house.

Those countries are crap because the people who live there are ,well you know.
And they come into other countries with their head held high thinking they are justified in the way they deal between themselves.
These idiots are unemployable!

[betelgeuse]

Hi everyone.

Until now i was doing business in Finland by non-cash transactions.
Now... There is some client outside EU to sell to him in cash my non-material services.
I am planning place this cash on company's bank account myself as sale proceeds:
1. Do i have a right to do so on my behalf or
my client needs to go to the bank (Danske) and place this cash on my company's bank account only himself
as payment on invoice?

There is nothing illegal about taking payments in cash and then depositing it to your bank account. You do need to give a receipt and your accounting will have to reflect the movements of the cash. You do avoid dealing with cash in accounting if you give them an invoice and they pay it through a Finnish bank. Then it's like any other transaction for you so far.

2. Do i need cash book to make notes about it? (Until now i have not one. I am not planning to settle something in cash
and have a company cash reserve whatsoever)

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/1 ... 71336#L2P4

The Accounting Act requires to requires inputting cash payments without delay. You can either have a cash book or use direct access to your accounting.

3. What company details do i need to get from the client?

None. You only need to give a receipt:
http://www.vero.fi/muistakuitti

[DMC]

3. What company details do i need to get from the client?

None. You only need to give a receipt:
http://www.vero.fi/muistakuitti

I that is interesting. I hadn't seen that. I have occasionally had cash customers outside of EU and there was no paperwork for those transactions. Certainly I would have provided a receipt if required, but they didn't want receipts or invoices or anything. We just agreed a price and they handed over the readies. I paid this into my company bank account and explained what it was to my accountant, and there was no problem.
Do I have to do anything different now? I can hardly force my customers to take a receipt if they don't want one.

[betelgeuse]

I that is interesting. I hadn't seen that. I have occasionally had cash customers outside of EU and there was no paperwork for those transactions. Certainly I would have provided a receipt if required, but they didn't want receipts or invoices or anything. We just agreed a price and they handed over the readies. I paid this into my company bank account and explained what it was to my accountant, and there was no problem.
Do I have to do anything different now? I can hardly force my customers to take a receipt if they don't want one.

First I should should note that everything I have said so far is the same for EU customers. Since beginning of this year you have been required to create a receipt and offer it to customers. They can refuse it and then you can put it to the trash. If an inspector comes and does not find these receipts in the trash for a customer that just left, you will be fined.

[betelgeuse]

Certainly I would have provided a receipt if required, but they didn't want receipts or invoices or anything. We just agreed a price and they handed over the readies. I paid this into my company bank account and explained what it was to my accountant, and there was no problem.

http://www.vero.fi/fi-FI/Syventavat_ver ... janpitoonx

Note question 12. The answer says that if you haven't had a cash register, then you have been required to file the receipt also to your bookkeeping (this has not changed).

[truman]

3. What company details do i need to get from the client?

None. You only need to give a receipt:
http://www.vero.fi/muistakuitti[/quote]

I mean will be there some problems (the thing is that vat=0% in this case (VAT 0%, Tax-exempt sale outside the EU) without company details of the client? (like TIN (taxpayer identification number) in his country, company address etc)

[DMC]

I mean will be there some problems (the thing is that vat=0% in this case (VAT 0%, Tax-exempt sale outside the EU) without company details of the client? (like TIN (taxpayer identification number) in his country, company address etc)

When I do an invoice/receipt for non-EU clients I just include a note that there is no VAT to pay because the customer is not located in the EU. For businesses registered for VAT in the EU but not in Finland I quote their VAT registration number with a note that there is no VAT to pay because the customer is VAT-registered elsewhere in the EU. I make sure this is on all paperwork such as invoices or receipts.

[betelgeuse]

I mean will be there some problems (the thing is that vat=0% in this case (VAT 0%, Tax-exempt sale outside the EU) without company details of the client? (like TIN (taxpayer identification number) in his country, company address etc)

http://www.vero.fi/en-US/Companies_and_ ... of_(30191)

For them to be paying in cash in Finland I assumed they would have a permanent establishment. If there's no permanent establishment then you just issue a normal VAT invoice:

https://www.vero.fi/en-US/Precise_infor ... atimuksetx

Here's the general guideline you need to satisfy:

https://www.vero.fi/fi-FI/Syventavat_ve ... arjoittaja

Jos ostaja on sijoittautunut EU:n ulkopuolelle, myyjän on muulla tavalla varmistuttava siitä, että ostaja on elinkeinonharjoittaja. Jos myyjällä on palvelun luonteen tai muun seikan perusteella syytä epäillä, että ostaja ei ole elinkeinonharjoittaja, myyjän tulee hankkia ostajalta vahvistus siitä, että ostaja on elinkeinonharjoittaja. Sovellettaessa myyntimaan yleissääntöä myyjän tulee menetellä vastaavasti, jos hänellä on syytä epäillä, että ostaja ei toimi elinkeinonharjoittajan ominaisuudessa.

Basically you need to verify that you are not dealing with a consumer. Marking the information you mentioned, goes towards that.

[DMC]

For them to be paying in cash in Finland I assumed they would have a permanent establishment.

Oh, that's a good point about paying cash in Finland. Most of my customers are not in Finland and most of the time what I supply is arguably not in Finland. In the case of someone from outside the EU who is in Finland and paying cash for something supplied in Finland, I think they should be charged VAT - although I guess it could be sealed and they could claim the VAT back when they leave. I don't have any experience of that though.

[truman]

Jos ostaja on sijoittautunut EU:n ulkopuolelle, myyjän on muulla tavalla varmistuttava siitä, että ostaja on elinkeinonharjoittaja. Jos myyjällä on palvelun luonteen tai muun seikan perusteella syytä epäillä, että ostaja ei ole elinkeinonharjoittaja, myyjän tulee hankkia ostajalta vahvistus siitä, että ostaja on elinkeinonharjoittaja. Sovellettaessa myyntimaan yleissääntöä myyjän tulee menetellä vastaavasti, jos hänellä on syytä epäillä, että ostaja ei toimi elinkeinonharjoittajan ominaisuudessa.

Is anywhere placed on vero.fi (i have not found it there) or something "Value added tax in international services from 1.1.2010" in English instead of
"Palvelujen ulkomaankaupan arvonlisäverotus 1.1.2010 alkaen" in Finnish?
https://www.vero.fi/fi-FI/Syventavat_ve ... ot%2814323

[betelgeuse]

Is anywhere placed on vero.fi (i have not found it there) or something "Value added tax in international services from 1.1.2010" in English instead of
"Palvelujen ulkomaankaupan arvonlisäverotus 1.1.2010 alkaen" in Finnish?
https://www.vero.fi/fi-FI/Syventavat_ve ... ot%2814323

No. The pages seem to have a link to the English version when available.