Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Useful advice on jobs, careers and entrepreneurship in Finland. Find job postings, job information, work permits and more.
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wolf80
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by wolf80 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 12:05 am

ilkin wrote:I dont think turkey will ever be in eu so Im going to be needed a working permit. But I still have time to learn finnish. I really am not as pessimistic as you are. Ofcourse you live there and you know everything about it but I still think that it cant be worse than here.
Also really? Qualified islam teacher? Why would anybody need that. Just read kuran everything is in that
Honestly, there are so many people here who are in the country and who know exactly how it is for foreigners, through their own lives and hundreds of stories of fellow expats. If you refuse to listen to their advice and are bashing it as pessimism, then you are blue-eyed at the border of foolishness. You might have heard a few stories of people who made it here, but what you didn't hear are the thousands of stories of people who failed.

About the language, your boyfriend is a psychologist, he should know that his profession relies more than any other on being able to understand what the other person is saying. How likely is it that a foreigner learns Turkish and gets a job as a psychologist in your country? Close to zero? Guess what, the Finnish language is much harder to learn. With some courses abroad and a Master course in the country he might get to B2-level, maybe if he is really good to C1, and that's by far not enough to work in the profession.



Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

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ilkin
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by ilkin » Wed Feb 17, 2016 12:27 am

leisl wrote:
ilkin wrote: Really :( thats really bad İts really worse than what we have been hearing about finland. I thought goverment take care of the unemployed people?
The government takes care of unemployed FINNS. Not "people who think it looks like a nice place to live". (Or people who have earned the right to get benefits, usually by having paid taxes.)

Not to be mean, but everyone seems to think Finland is a magic paradise with wonderful education. It's only wonderful education for Finnish children. Not for adults, not for teenagers, and not a magic paradise for pretty much anyone else. It's a hard, hard place to adapt to and deal with, for most people. Maybe if your home country is being bombed or in famine, then Finland's pretty awesome. But for most, it can feel like big sacrifices to stay. You know, like giving up a career or becoming self-employed in a totally unqualified field. Want to scrub floors or drive a taxi for twenty years, qualified lawyer Jones? Finland can help you do that.
ilkin wrote:I dont think turkey will ever be in eu so Im going to be needed a working permit. But I still have time to learn finnish.
These things are not related, you can't get a (working) residence permit by speaking Finnish, I don't think you're understanding. They can't even offer you a job unless nobody in the EU can fill the job. Your only choice would be that master's here. Which would be in English. Which probably still won't get you any job offers here, because everybody wants to be a psychologist, the USA has thousands of them out of work and they can't come here and get a job either. But the master's, you at least get an extra year extension to look for work (so if the master's takes you one year, you will need to bring about 14000 euro with you when you arrive so that you can eat, time to start saving up).
ilkin wrote:Also really? Qualified islam teacher? Why would anybody need that. Just read kuran everything is in that
Under Finnish law if enough children state a particular religion when enrolling at school, the school must provide them with religious instruction for that religion. So yes. There is a shortage of them.
I know that goverment takes care of people who are citizens and I know that learning Finnish is not going to get me a working permit but at least it would help. I think you are steriotyping me. I know that its not going to be easy. I am just sick of the people here. We got our share from syrians here. Our goverment even cant give a job for their own citizens now there is like 5 million refugees here. Our economy is bad we live in fear (especially women). So I think any place in europe is going to be better than here. But I love Finland ever since I was 12. It would be a dream come true for me to move there but if its really that bad I would consider other countries.

betelgeuse
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by betelgeuse » Wed Feb 17, 2016 12:36 am

leisl wrote: They can't even offer you a job unless nobody in the EU can fill the job.
s/can/wants/

Rosamunda
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by Rosamunda » Wed Feb 17, 2016 9:51 am

Rosamunda wrote: Unemployment is going to get better before it gets worse.
What I meant was.... better <---> worse.

But I guess everyone figured that out.

I don't think coming to study a Master's degree here, as leisl suggests, is really an option. Fees will be introduced next year for all non-EU applicants and the ball-park is going to be 10-20K€ per year. And that's just for tuition. Living costs are on top of that.

Unemployment benefits are not really enough to live off. Young unemployed people usually have to stay living at home with their parents as rents are so high here and there is a housing shortage. People who have already contributed to a union-based unemployment fund through their work can survive unemployment quite comfortably for a limited period of time but those are people who have been in work and have been made redundant.

The general mood at the moment - and one that is increasingly supported by the government and the public - is that Finland will do what it can to receive asylum seekers but the country simply cannot absorb economic migrants. It's just too small and the economy is too fragile.

But if you are not convinced, just take look at http://www.mol.fi/tyopaikat/tyopaikkatiedotus/haku/ where the open vacancies are posted and see what you can find - remembering that you will not get a "working permit" without a full-time job contract.

leisl
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by leisl » Wed Feb 17, 2016 10:15 am

wolf80 wrote:The problem here also is that a foreign psychologist NEEDS to speak Finnish at C2-level, but ideally native speaker-level.
(Probably OT, but native-level is C1. You could probably say that C2 is business-level Finnish.)
Rosamunda wrote:I don't think coming to study a Master's degree here, as leisl suggests, is really an option. Fees will be introduced next year for all non-EU applicants and the ball-park is going to be 10-20K€ per year. And that's just for tuition. Living costs are on top of that.
Neither do I, to be frank, but I am going on the assumption that once they do their homework for the master's they will realise how difficult it will be and it will stop them coming. It's not that I don't want them here. I'm greatly in favour of work-based immigration. But I'm a realist. Nothing that the OP has said has convinced me that it's a smart move for her. It's going to end in tears. She seems to think I'm anti-Turk or something... I honestly couldn't care what nationality or religion someone is or whether they are a psychologist or an Oracle programmer. But one of them will land a job in Finland and one will not.
ilkin wrote:I think you are steriotyping me. I know that its not going to be easy.
But you're not special. Nobody is a special snowflake. Everyone seems to think they'll work harder than everyone else so it won't be quite as bad as people say. Doesn't work that way I'm afraid, because nearly everyone is... average.
ilkin wrote:if its really that bad I would consider other countries.
Consider Sweden. Yes, it's "less of a paradise" with a not-perfect track record for harmony. But you and your boyfriend could get fluent in Swedish in 1-2 years, especially him. It's related to English, and the sentence structure is similar to the languages he already speaks. They have more immigrants so there is more opportunity for work.

Rosamunda
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by Rosamunda » Wed Feb 17, 2016 10:58 am

leisl wrote: (Probably OT, but native-level is C1. You could probably say that C2 is business-level Finnish.)
"native-level" "business-level" are meaningless. There are natives with varying degrees of proficiency. C1 and C2 are clearly defined by the Common European Framework of Reference. - no need to equate them to something as arbitrary as "nativeness".

Doctors, nurses, dentists etc moving to work in Australia and New Zealand need an IELTS score of 7.5 these days and that is a C1. I think the language requirement for working as a doctor in the UK will be less than that (my guess would be 6.5 - which is Masters degree entry level in most universities) but it is still under discussion.

I have seen doctors here in Finland from Russia, Lithuania... who definitely do not have C1 Finnish, more like a very average B2 (according to my SO). Somebody can be proficient at reading and listening but not be such a confident speaker. It's a can of worms. But I do think that in many situations it is possible for a health worker to do a good job without being a proficient user in Finnish. It depends on the nature of the job. The nurses caring for my mother-in-law do not speak Finnish at all. They don't need to - she cannot communicate. They do a brilliant job, btw.

leisl
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by leisl » Wed Feb 17, 2016 11:28 am

Oh that's fair, but what I meant is that native speakers wouldn't necessarily test C2 - supposedly C1 is the average that a native would test at. And native speakers (of any language) often make mistakes in written language that wouldn't be acceptable on a company letterhead. They're not stupid people by any means, just average. :)

And you are right, you can have people whose communication is perfectly adequate but they don't "sound" native. And they don't need to in order to perform their job. I've actually known people in the psychology field whose Finnish communication is definitely not C2. But I also know they have/ would have trouble getting hired when up against people with better language skill.

Doesn't matter if you "can" do the job. Matters whether you can get hired. I "can" cook a perfect steak. I doubt any idiot would hire me as a chef when up against people with experience and qualifications.

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Cod
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Re: Will I be able to find a job in Finland?

Post by Cod » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:55 pm

..and back to original question..re architects finding work..

Can be done, don't need Finnish but do need luck - and don't expect to get a business card until you can recite the SAFA terms with a lovely lilt. I'm aware of four guys working in the south. One is fluent.

I dipped out after 5 years practicing here ( i.e. practicing as a cad / rendering monkey ;) and went to software development since I wanted to get new insights. Leaving salary was 3k bruto, hours were good for architectural - i.e. Better than London - and good perks, i.e. Better than London, Malaysia and NZ. I was replaced by another english speaker - no Finnish.

Suggestion if I were to do it again would be to be more lucky - like really lucky. I've seen that pay off handsomely but for others - we need plan B's. ( look up Axel Thallemer, great example of a plan B Architect)


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