"Here" and "There" words

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jrdioko
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"Here" and "There" words

Post by jrdioko » Mon Sep 27, 2004 3:02 am

I'm about a month into a beginning Finnish class, and I have a question that keeps coming up again as I do the various exercises. A quick look through my books and a dictionary shows 3 words for "here" (Tässä, Täällä, and Tänne) and 6 words for "there" (Tuossa, Tuolla, Siellä, Siinä, Sinne, Tuonne). I think I've gotten a good idea about the first two in each category, but I'm confused about the rest. What differentiates all these words?

Thanks in advance,
Johnathan



"Here" and "There" words

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bretti_kivi
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Post by bretti_kivi » Mon Sep 27, 2004 8:41 am

IIRC, there are not-so-subtle variations on meaning between the words.

it's not just "here" or "there", but e.g "over here", "here", "directly here" etc... you also forgot "tähän".

i'm sorry, i can't list them out with their meanings as i don't know them all myself...

Bret
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jrdioko
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Post by jrdioko » Mon Sep 27, 2004 8:56 am

I assumed there was some sort of explanation like that but I can't seem to find anything that tells me which is "over there," "way over there," "right here," etc. If anyone here (täällä?) could explain some or all of them, that would be great!

-Johnathan


PeterF
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Post by PeterF » Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:24 am

Fixed or moving is the first rule..
Olen "here" sitting standing "here" fixed..
Olen talla.
Come here! " move" your ars "to here"
Tule tanne!
He is sitting/"fixed" over there...Hän istu Tuolla.
Go over there "move" your ars and sit over there.
Mene sinne!

Tassa is an odd one...I am not sure if there is a rule when one is tassa and not talla...I think that if you were using it in a sentence is usual to be "talla" but if someone called on their mobile and said "missa olet?"..they cannot see you..perhaps you might say..Olen tassa pubbissa...I am here in the pub..
but.."talla pubbissa" sounds Ok also...but if you were at a location which must be "lla" e.g railway station...tassa sounds/feels wrong..has to be.."talla juna asemalla"


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:52 am

No no no,

olen tässä pubissa =I am (here) in this pub.
olen täällä pubissa = I am here, in a pub.

and if you say olemme tällä juna-asemalla it means we are on this here train station (as pointing on a map) vs. olemme täällä, juna asemalla saying on the phone we're here on the train station :wink:



Tässä, Täällä, and Tänne

tässä = right here, definite place/object

tässä on kylmä = right here (in this very spot) it is cold.

täällä= in here, in a room/area täällä kaikuu =it echoes in here

täällä on kylmä = in here (in the room) it is cold

tänne = hither tule tänne come hither

and 6 words for "there" (Tuossa, Tuolla, Siellä, Siinä, Sinne, Tuonne

tuossa = right there
tässä on kylmä, mutta tuossa on kuuma
tuolla = yonder täällä on kylmä mutta tuolla on kuuma
tuonne = tule tänne - mene tuonne (come hither, go thither) :wink:

Siellä siinä sinne is used as 'there' with the same logic.

siinä on = there is (on the table)
siellä on = there is (in the room)
sinne = to the place

siinä on huone, siellä on pöytä, sinne viedään tuoli.

there is a room, there in the room is a table, there to the room a chair shall be taken
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


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Jarkka
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Trying to elaborate on "tässä" etc.

Post by Jarkka » Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:48 am

Here's a brief summary, hope it helps. In general, tässä/tuossa/siinä refer to a more exact location than täällä/tuolla/siellä.

tähän --> tässä --> tästä
tänne --> täällä --> täältä
Tässä refers to an exact spot within reach. Eg. "Kirjoita nimesi tähän" ("Write your name here"), "Tavataan tässä kello 10" ("See you here [in this exact spot] at 10"). Täällä would mean a building, area, city etc. Eg. "Tavataan täällä kello 10" ("See you here [in this building etc.] at 10". "Mennään pois täältä" ("Let's get away from this place"). Strangely enough, you'd wave and shout "(Olen) täällä!" if someone's looking for you in a crowd. You would also say "Tule tänne" ("Come here") regardless of whether you're talking to someone in the same room or another town.

tuohon --> tuossa --> tuosta
tuonne --> tuolla --> tuolta
Eg. "Laita laatikko tuohon" ("Put the box there", pointing at a spot in the room). Tuolla might refer to a place you can see but is not within a few metres, ie. "over there".

siihen --> siinä --> siitä
sinne --> siellä --> sieltä
These words refer to a place that is closer to the person you're talking to (simple, innit?). Eg. "Tule pois sieltä!" ("Come away from there!"). "Miten löydän sinne?" ("How can I find my way there?").


jrdioko
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Post by jrdioko » Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:12 pm

Wow, this is a bit more complicated than I imagined (as Finnish always seems to be). I think I understand most of what was said so far, but I have one more question. I guess I'm not entirely clear as to the difference between There #1 (tuossa/tuolla and variations) and There #2 (siinä/siellä and variations). Which is more common, and is there any straightfoward way to differentiate between the two? I see what Jarkka said, but I can think of many situations when something "there" is not within a few meters but also closer to the person you're talking to, within a few meters but closer to you, etc. I'd assume there'd be some sort of easy way to tell the difference such as There #1 is generally closer to you than There #2 (like the difference between "there" and "(way) over there" in English). Thanks for all the info so far though, it's been very helpful.


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:25 pm

Its derivatives of "tuo" and "se" . Demonstrating pronouns.

tämä and nämä are an oblect that is close or that has just been spoken of.
tuo and nuo are further but still visible objects. se and ne are things we cannot see.
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


jrdioko
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Post by jrdioko » Tue Sep 28, 2004 12:36 am

Ok, makes sense. Kiitos!


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Post by kalmisto » Tue Sep 28, 2004 11:05 pm

jrdioko

Tässä on sinulle kaunis valokuva ( Here is a beautiful photo for you ) :

http://taivasalla.net/2004/2004-09/img/ ... 24x768.jpg


thanquanngoc
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Re: "Here" and "There" words

Post by thanquanngoc » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:31 pm

Thank you all :)


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