Finally it happens

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jcooper
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Finally it happens

Post by jcooper » Tue Jun 24, 2003 11:53 am

Well after a long time my move is about to happen. Today circa 15 mins ago I was told that the entire development team are being reorganised and that 50% must go. I was actually quite happy it means that I can leave on good terms, !"#¤% package but have access to Dutch benefits which I've paid into for the last 3 years.

I'm unsure as to whether I will receive them through Kela or directly from the Dutch CWI....Ahh well, its all at an end... viva la Helsinki!!!

It will be good to put faces to the names.
ttys,
James



Finally it happens

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PeterF
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Post by PeterF » Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:08 pm

Hi James..
Sounds as though you have been expecting this bad news..I know the feeling the waiting for the axe to fall is the worst time...been there too. :x
So are you moving to Finland if so when and what are your plans :?:


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jcooper
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Post by jcooper » Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:35 pm

Hey Peter,
Yeah things actually have not gone all that well for the company I worked for. I joined a project in caos that was late when I arrived, and the final working version has not been accepted by the client or gone into pre-production yet. In that time, circa 2 years, we've just been kept going by this delayed work and now thats all but dried up they have to let people go. I mean so far everything is very much amicable and so things should pan out relatively ok.

The funny part is that I was planning to resign at the end of the month anyway, this means that I leave on better terms and with benefits. There are some small questions though, do I get my job seekers benefits from Holland or from Finland via Holland, so the latter is taxed. I'll check with the CWI here about that.

The plan is to chill out for July, go on holidays with my girlfriend in August and arrive in Helsinki mid August. I'm a software engineer with about 4 years experience, mainly LDAP, meta directories and J2EE stuff with Critical Path, so I figure I'll get into some open source projects and keep myself busy. The uncertainty is now over, so thats cool and leaving on good terms was very important to me.

I was wondering there are quite allot of techy people here and Phil mentioned this about a year ago, but I'd to maybe set up a First Tuesday type thing for techies. Beers, kebabs, general pseduo professional chit chat. Does anything like that exist? Or would people be interested in getting invovled?


PeterF
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Post by PeterF » Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:45 pm

jcooper wrote: I'm a software engineer , mainly LDAP, meta directories and J2EE stuff with Critical Path, so I figure maybe set up a First Tuesday type thing for techies. Beers, kebabs, general pseduo professional chit chat. Does anything like that exist? Or would people be interested in getting invovled?

Well I am a hardware engineer the only software I know anything about is spelt Soft Wear.. :wink:
With the list of items that you intend to discuss at your beer sessions you and Phil are likely to be lonely. 8) .the rest of us will be talking about the sexy blond bar maid..that what we Hard Wearing guys need for softywear :wink:


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jcooper
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Post by jcooper » Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:56 pm

Ah Peter, that stuff goes without saying, though in Finland your eyes can go into sensory overload, I mean its like every day is like a different copy of FHM. Ok, for all the ladies, maybe I'm over stating it....but the ladies sure are fantastic. But as you've posted before, they can whine allot...course like yourself I keep that well to myself!

But heard ware....hmm I'm leave the jokes out. They get worse.

Seriously, boozing is also fine by me too. I've been on the look out for a good tracksuit and think Rotterdam might just sell what I'm looking for.

Also I'll actually found pints(ok pints - ish) for 3 euros last weekend in Helsinki, was quite impressed with myself, it was just a pity I'd just shelled out 14 euro on 8 cans of Koff in Vuorsaari. I was almost ready to cry....14 euros!! I think I'll have to rely on my dear old grandfather Poteen recipe, spuds are cheap in Helsinki and theres a definite market for booze.

Course I can ditch the tech talk and rely on slashdot :)


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Sara
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Post by Sara » Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:57 pm

Peter Floyd wrote: the rest of us will be talking about the sexy blond bar maid


speak for yourself there Peter!! :o :wink:

good news for you though James, hope your transition over will be smooth :D


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Tue Jun 24, 2003 2:14 pm

jcooper wrote:Hey Peter,
do I get my job seekers benefits from Holland or from Finland via Holland, so the latter is taxed.


http://www.mol.fi/migration/engopas.pdf

"Daily allowance for three months

The immigrant can look for work in Finland and be paid a daily unemployment allowance from the country he/she has come from for a maximum period of three months. This rule applies to both employees and self-employed persons. To obtain a daily allowance while looking for work in Finland, he/she needs an E303 Certificate.

Applicant can obtain an E303 Certificate:

- if he/she is an EU/EEA-country citizen

- if he/she applies for the certificate before travelling to Finland

- if he/she applies for the certificate well before travelling and at the same time informs the authority, who is responsible for the unemployment security, in which country he/she is going to look for work

- if he/she are being paid daily unemployment allowance in his/her own country

- if he/she has been unemployed, a job applicant and available for work for at least four weeks before leaving for Finland.

To receive the daily allowance during the whole time the certificate is valid, the applicant must register with an Employment Office in Finland within seven days of the date the certificate becomes valid. Otherwise he/she will only receive the daily allowance starting from the date he/she registers at the office. As a rule, if he/she finds work in Finland while the certificate is in force, he/she becomes entitled to coverage by unemployment insurance in Finland. Once the person has made sure that he/she is covered by Finnish unemployment insurance, he/she ceases to be insured in the home country. He/she must, therefore, notify the unemployment authorities in the home country of this fact. If the person fails to find work, he/she must return to the home country and register with an Employment Office while the E303 Certificate is still valid to continue receiving daily unemployment allowance without interruption. If person registers with the Employment Office after the certificate has ceased to be valid, his/her daily allowance payments will be continued only upon fulfilling certain conditions. If the applicant has been paid a daily allowance abroad on the basis of his/her E303 Certificate, he/she can get a new certificate only after he/she has been at work in the home country again."
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Wed Jun 25, 2003 9:54 am

jcooper wrote:Poteen recipe


this kettle is boiling over
i think i'm a banana tree


:mrgreen:
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


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jcooper
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Post by jcooper » Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:03 pm

Hey Hank, thanks for the info mate. I get the feeling that I can only really get a residence permit when I have a job and without that, no bus pass, no phone. Bit of a pain in the nuts that....

C'est la vie
Who is this dog Franks?


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:22 pm

Yeah, its a bit anal like that. Though you can get a prepaid Telia card you can feed off the wall and keep an 'unlisted' number so really the only thing is a bus pass - and you can get a residence paper from where you live to use to get a bus pass, so there are a few ways to circumvent the problems. Basically as you have no credit history in Finland (and no job) almost every place will tell you to go away or pay cash... and now in some jobs they require a credit history... :mrgreen:
Last edited by Hank W. on Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


PeterF
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Post by PeterF » Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:24 pm

If you are an EU citizen an think you can you can get a Temporary residents permit while you are job hunting. :D .the permit is valid for 5 years so give you plenty of time to buy us all a beer before they kick you out of Finland :wink:


Tom and Jerry

Post by Tom and Jerry » Wed Jun 25, 2003 2:05 pm

Aren't the Dutch unemployment benefits in the first year a lot higher than the Finnish ones?
In Finland there is also something like 'työehtojen täyttämistä'. It means that you have been working for the past 40 weeks in Finland before you get more money than the basic (ansiosidonnainen päiväraha and peruspäiväraha).

Would it be an idea to remain officially living in the Netherlands, buy or rent here a summer cottage (for one square meter in Amsterdam, you may get in the backyard of Mäntsälä a whole hectare) and enjoy your time on holiday in Finland. Today, it is very nice weather for instance.

It may save you a lot of problems with the Finnish Kela.


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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Wed Jun 25, 2003 2:20 pm

Well, in Finland atleast you may not be out of the country (not even a boat trip to sweden) if you are claiming unemployment - Don't know how the Dutch have it figured out.

And to be on anything else than on basic unemployment, you need to have had belonged and paid dues to an unemployment fund for atleast 10 months. No fund = no ansiosidonnainen.

There is something called 'työmarkkinatuki' and 'integration allowance' available from KELA, but these don't run far.
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.


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WebDesEyen
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Post by WebDesEyen » Wed Jun 25, 2003 4:28 pm

the dutch unemployment system works slightly different from the finnish one, buit not all that much. these are the basics:

once you are working full time here in the netherlands you "build up" your unemployment "savings". the longer you work, the longer your benefit will last. the benefit is 70% of your last income, until you reach a roof and don't get anymore. the length of this benefit depends on how long you have worked, you roughly get 1.5 month of benefit for every fully worked year. so four years working here means six months of "full" (70%) benefit.
after that you drop to 70% of the minimum wages. which is too much to die from, but not nearly enough to live on. that is where i am now.

once you decide to move abroad you can take this benefit with you. you will get three months of benefit through the local unemployment system (kela), at the same level as it would have been here. after those three months you get whatever the social system gives out, i think this is 300 euros in finland, but could be wrong here.
if the moving doesn't work out jobwise you can go back to the netherlands and claim the rest of your benefit, but to get it you have to prove you actually moved back to the netherlands.
i should have studied something basic, like quantummechanics...


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jcooper
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Post by jcooper » Wed Jun 25, 2003 9:09 pm

Yeah I've thought about that, I've worked in the Netherlands for the last umm 3 years and to be honest I'm not entirely keen on actually having to turn up and my local CWI, which I believe should be sometime next week.

But since I've been with . for the last while, I've noticed that getting a job is by no means a foregone conclusion. So I think I'd be biting my nose off despite my face not taking advantage of social supports whilst job hunting.

WebDesyen I never actually realised that the 70% WW was linked to length of service, good to know.

As for remaining pseudo resident, that maybe allot of hassle. The Netherlands unlike Finland is not one big integration project, but for instance once I forgot to change my postal address and all my financial assets where frozen until I proved I was still living here. Also I don't know whether benefits are taxed as in Finland, which to be honest if like putting money in one pocket and taking out from another. Though once I met a guy who is permanently unemployed, he simply moves to a cheap part of the planet and lives it up on the Dutch tax payer, in this case hes in Venezuala. Personally I'm against that and I'll probably go down the E303 route...
Who is this dog Franks?


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