kvantumrakenne

[Satish]

Working my way through "Harjoitus tekee mestarin - volume 2", I came across this bit of a construct:

Kvantumrakenne vastaa mikäli-lausetta:
1) Uskoakseni sääntö on yksinkertainen.
2) Nähdäkseni kokouksessa ei saatu mitään aikaan.

With my knowledge of mikäli = in case, as far as, assuming etc, do the sentences mean:
1) As far as I believe, the rule is simple
2) As I see, there is no time available in the meeting

Also, is this construct - 1st infinitive + kse + personal suffix productive? i.e. in practice do people use this structure for a large range of verbs or is it only for canned phrases such as uskoakseni, nähdäkseni etc?

[Jukka Aho]

Working my way through "Harjoitus tekee mestarin - volume 2", I came across this bit of a construct:

Kvantumrakenne vastaa mikäli-lausetta:
1) Uskoakseni sääntö on yksinkertainen.
2) Nähdäkseni kokouksessa ei saatu mitään aikaan.

With my knowledge of mikäli = in case, as far as, assuming etc, do the sentences mean:
1) As far as I believe, the rule is simple
2) As I see, there is no time available in the meeting

Your translations are spot on but I’m not sure how you could rephrase those ideas with mikäli... or what the author(s) of the book mean when they say “Kvantumrakenne vastaa mikäli-lausetta”? What kind of sentences with mikäli are we talking about?

Also, is this construct - 1st infinitive + kse + personal suffix productive? i.e. in practice do people use this structure for a large range of verbs or is it only for canned phrases such as uskoakseni, nähdäkseni etc?

I think this “as far as I...” sense is connected to expressions such as uskoakseni, nähdäkseni, käsittääkseni – all having something to do with the observations or assessments you have made of the matter at hand... so it’s a fairly limited set of verbs.

You could say other things using a grammatically similar verb form but they don’t carry the “as far as I” sense... but rather “in order to”... such as:

Pyöräilläkseni Rantakatua pitkin täytyi minun ensin ylittää Pitkäsilta.
= Voidakseni pyöräillä...
= Jotta saatoin/kykenin/pystyin pyöräilemään...

Jouduin käymään kolmella eri ympärivuorokautisesti auki olevalla huoltoasemalla ostaakseni maitoa.
= ...voidakseni ostaa...
= ...saadakseni ostettua...
= ...kyetäkseni ostamaan...
= ...pystyäkseni ostamaan...
= ...jotta saatoin/kykenin/pystyin ostamaan...
= ...jotta sain ostettua...

There are a lot of ways to express these almost identical ideas.

[Satish]

I’m not sure how you could rephrase those ideas with mikäli... or what the author(s) of the book mean when they say “Kvantumrakenne vastaa mikäli-lausetta”? What kind of sentences with mikäli are we talking about?

The author (Marja-Liisa Saunela, Art House 2010) does not provide any more details, but looking at the dictionary, I think the mikäli we are talking about is sikäli kuin = as far as, insofar as etc and not siinä tapauksessa että = in case, in the event that...

[Upphew]

2) Nähdäkseni kokouksessa ei saatu mitään aikaan.

2) As I see, there is no time available in the meeting

As far as I see, we didn't get anything done in the meeting.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/saada_aikaan

[Jukka Aho]

2) Nähdäkseni kokouksessa ei saatu mitään aikaan.

2) As I see, there is no time available in the meeting

As far as I see, we didn't get anything done in the meeting.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/saada_aikaan

Oh, good catch. I only focused on the -kseni construct so missed that one.

[Rob A.]

I'm sure you've had a look at this:

http://www.uusikielemme.fi/infinitives1.html

...the long form of the first infinitive...

The usual meaning is "in order to..."

...But there are exceptions and the exceptions are quite commonly used....

[Satish]

I'm sure you've had a look at this:

http://www.uusikielemme.fi/infinitives1.html

...the long form of the first infinitive...

The usual meaning is "in order to..."

Hey, thanks. I had forgotten about that classic resource.

...But there are exceptions and the exceptions are quite commonly used....

Now you make me cry...