We got married

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Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:56 pm

Hey everyone.
I am into a difficult situation, and I thought maybe you could give us some advice. But I would appreciate it if you don't start to judge us, my husband and I are genuinely in love, and we just want to be together.
I am a Tunisian citizen, I am 23, a medical student. I never have been interested in "fleeing" the country, if that was the case, I could have done so since a long time ago: I have always had excellent grades and could have studied in France, or Germany if I wanted with my grades. But no, that's not what I'm interested in, I love my country and I never thought of leaving it. But the thing here is that I just fell in love with a Finnish man. And I simply want to live with him.

I have known my Finnish husband through the internet for at least 4 years.
We decided to meet, last May. However my visa got refused. So we met in Turkey, we stayed there for two weeks. (Since he cannot visit me in Tunisia, a relationship between a native girl and a foreign non-Muslim man is forbidden, besides the dating itself is not really that accepted even between two natives, from the legal perspective, and could people get into prison. And ESPECIALLY when a foreign man is involved. Even if we met just outside, it would be quite remarkable) That's why he cannot come here. We wouldn't want to risk those things.
I applied for a second visa in August, it was refused AGAIN. Even though we showed them our pictures together and everything.
(I have been previously with a Norwegian guy, and I applied once for a tourist visa from that same embassy to visit him because it represents all of Scandinavia in my country, so sometimes I think they are judging me because of THAT..)
So the thing is, we ARE in love with each other, and we know we want a life together, before you start getting judgmental, I hope you understand that both of our countries are making it IMPOSSIBLE for us to even simply meet each other. And that is sad, to be misjudged, by everyone, and have to be away from the person you love...
So, we still haven't given up on each other, we met in Georgia, recently, by the beginning of September, and, yes, we got married there. (We would never be able to get married in Tunisia, and also in Finland, obviously..)
Now the thing is , He STILL CANNOT visit me in Tunisia, (our marriage will never get recognized in Tunisia, because again, he is not Muslim). I can't visit him in Finland either. (Because they will very likely refuse my visa again)
Should we keep meeting in other countries for years or what? :'( Knowing that he can get a holiday only for one month during the whole year!!!!! He can't leave his job either, just because of this
And I can't lie to you, it is killing us to be away from each other...
Should we apply for the residence permit right away? Or should we try to travel like two other times together, so that we prove to the officials that we truly love each other? is there any other way for us to prove to them that we are for real and we are genuine? I'm afraid they would judge us since we met only twice... But it's not really our choice... Besides, it would really suck to wait for 9 months for the residence permit without being able to meet my husband even for a day, and then get it refused...
I would really appreciate your advice on this matter.



We got married

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betelgeuse
Posts: 2621
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: We got married

Post by betelgeuse » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:27 pm

Peach7 wrote: can't visit him in Finland either. (Because they will very likely refuse my visa again)
Should we keep meeting in other countries for years or what?
After applying you can exhaust all the appeal options.

http://formin.finland.fi/public/default ... 20decision
Peach7 wrote: Should we apply for the residence permit right away?
If you are planning to move, it can make sense.
Peach7 wrote: Or should we try to travel like two other times together, so that we prove to the officials that we truly love each other? is there any other way for us to prove to them that we are for real and we are genuine?
I can't think of any magic bullets beyond having a child together.


007
Posts: 620
Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:01 pm

Re: We got married

Post by 007 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:29 pm

Peach7 wrote:Should we apply for the residence permit right away?..... it would really suck to wait for 9 months for the residence permit without being able to meet my husband even for a day, and then get it refused...
If you two are already married, you should apply for a residence permit, not tourist visa. Tourist visa is only for visiting and it seems that you've already earned a place on the blacklist of migri (immigration office). Unless and until your situation changes, subsequent tourist visa application will not be fruitful. What were the reasons given behind the refusal of tourist visa?

In any case, applying for residence permit is the wisest thing to do for you now. Other options including but not limited to are: a) He turns into a Muslim and you two live in Tunisia. b) You two go and live in a third country. c) You apply for other types of permits e.g. as a specialist, as an entrepreneur etc. d) You come to study here. Having a kid together will definitely help but I am not sure whether one should decide to have a baby just for the sake of self-interest.

However, there's a huge chance that migri will consider your marriage as a marriage of convenience to enter Finland as you already seem to have been flagged. In order to make your case stronger, I suggest you two live in a third country for a certain period of time before applying for a residence permit in Finland. Not absolutely necessary but it will definitely help.
“Go where you are celebrated – not tolerated."
"Aina, kun opit uuden sanan, opettele samalla sen monikko!"


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:52 pm

007 wrote:
Peach7 wrote:Should we apply for the residence permit right away?..... it would really suck to wait for 9 months for the residence permit without being able to meet my husband even for a day, and then get it refused...
If you two are already married, you should apply for a residence permit, not tourist visa. Tourist visa is only for visiting and it seems that you've already earned a place on the blacklist of migri (immigration office). Unless and until your situation changes, subsequent tourist visa application will not be fruitful. What were the reasons given behind the refusal of tourist visa?

In any case, applying for residence permit is the wisest thing to do for you now. Other options including but not limited to are: a) He turns into a Muslim and you two live in Tunisia. b) You two go and live in a third country. c) You apply for other types of permits e.g. as a specialist, as an entrepreneur etc. d) You come to study here. Having a kid together will definitely help but I am not sure whether one should decide to have a baby just for the sake of self-interest.

However, there's a huge chance that migri will consider your marriage as a marriage of convenience to enter Finland as you already seem to have been flagged. In order to make your case stronger, I suggest you two live in a third country for a certain period of time before applying for a residence permit in Finland. Not absolutely necessary but it will definitely help.

I have thought about the thing of living together in another country. But the problem is that he has a work in Finland, and if he leaves it he cannot get it back. Besides I'm not sure if he could get a similar job anywhere. Besides he has a child, and I think if he goes to another country he will lose his child custody.
As for the reason for the refusal, it was quite vague: "your intention to leave EU could not be established".


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:54 pm

And honestly, I wouldn't feel good if we have a child together just for the sake of getting me into Finland... It wouldn't feel right...


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:59 pm

I am still a medical student.
Would looking for a job there be an option? I don't know if that's possible since I still don't have a degree from my faculty yet, and I don't know if they would accept it (since I'm married and applying to move there on other means than family ties) ?


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rinso
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Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 7:22 pm

Re: We got married

Post by rinso » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:46 pm

As for the reason for the refusal, it was quite vague: "your intention to leave EU could not be established".
This makes sense; tourist visa and then try to get a residence permit once you're here. Not a route they like.
Applying for a RP based on your marriage seems the only option. But with two refusals under your belt it could be difficult (at least time consuming). But as Betelgeuse mentioned, there are many appeal options.


007
Posts: 620
Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:01 pm

Re: We got married

Post by 007 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:57 pm

Peach7 wrote:I am still a medical student.
Would looking for a job there be an option? I don't know if that's possible since I still don't have a degree from my faculty yet, and I don't know if they would accept it (since I'm married and applying to move there on other means than family ties) ?
So after graduation, you can practice as a doctor? Since there's a huge shortage of doctors in Finland, getting a job should be relatively easy for you as compared to other foreigners with no knowledge of local languages. I think foreign doctors undergo intensive language course for about 6 months or so before they are allowed to practice medicine. Also, there's some tests for doctors, I think. At the moment, as I understand, unemployment rate for doctors is about 0,2%.

Your best bet, however, at the moment is to apply for a family-based residence permit. It will take time, and meanwhile, you can complete your studies also. Getting a job and applying for a work permit has nothing to do with your marital status. So, you have two shots at the residence permit.

Disclaimer: I am no expert on such thing.
“Go where you are celebrated – not tolerated."
"Aina, kun opit uuden sanan, opettele samalla sen monikko!"


Rip
Posts: 5583
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 12:08 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Rip » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:13 pm

betelgeuse wrote: I can't think of any magic bullets beyond having a child together.

I'd add that even that would not necessarily change things (in eyes of Finnsh authorities) at all before the child is actually born. I also have a "hunch" that being a single mother or mother to be in Tunisia would not be that attractive option either...

My suggestion would be same as others here:
A) apply for family based residence permit. It would be slow, and initial refusal very much possible, but one can appeal and if necessary reapply
B) while doing that, meet as much as you can in a country where you can (it will look also better for the permit application)
C) Get your degree. While you'd need to learn Finnish and there are regulatory barriers to cross, medicine after all is a profession where there is a need for workers and even decently paid workers. Eventually you might get a permit on that grounds and even if you'd get your permit as a spouse the medical degree easily makes a difference between no job or a lousily paid job and a good and secure job.


Upphew
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Location: Lappeenranta

Re: We got married

Post by Upphew » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:21 pm

Peach7 wrote:I am still a medical student.
Would looking for a job there be an option? I don't know if that's possible since I still don't have a degree from my faculty yet, and I don't know if they would accept it (since I'm married and applying to move there on other means than family ties) ?
Looking for job or further education is always an option.

http://www.valvira.fi/web/en/healthcare ... ice_rights
http://google.com http://translate.google.com http://urbandictionary.com
Visa is for visiting, Residence Permit for residing.


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:10 pm

Thanks everyone for your replies.
Now here is the thing, medical studies are quite long. I would need at least 4-5 more years in order to become a real certified Doctor (or even longer, if I have to take the residency exam here). So waiting until graduation doesn't sound like a very good option, knowing the fact that we cannot meet that easily during all that time.

The other option of studying there requires quite a lot of financial funds. I don't want to be a burden to my husband. I don't know if it's possible to find a way to study something without having to pay huge amount of money right away in a bank account.
Now there is the option of getting a work NOW, as an unskilled worker, since I still do not have any higher education diploma yet. What do you think of that?


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Pursuivant
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Location: Bath & Wells

Re: We got married

Post by Pursuivant » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:40 pm

One option, but then again it depends on the husband and job, is you two go to France, if its easier for you. Then use the "EU freedom of movement" as the rules are different. But if he doesn't speak French that kind of kills it. Then again, if you were studying in France and had an EU permit, you could visit Finland freely.
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:25 pm

For now, There are no tuition fees, but there is something about being able to cover your expenses for the studies, and it is around 900 euros per month (10800 euros per year) and you would need to have that ready for you in a bank account already before applying for the student visa. It is a requirement.
Besides, they decided to add tuition fees for non EU students, starting from August 2017:
"Tuition fees for non-EU/EEA students
The Finnish Government has decided to introduce a tuition fees for non-EU/EEA students, starting from August 2017. This means that non-EU/EEA students who start their studies in autumn 2017 or after that, are subject to tuition fees. The tuition fees concern Bachelor's or Master's degree programmes offered in English."
http://www.studyinfinland.fi/tuitionfees


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:28 pm

roger_roger wrote:
Peach7 wrote:Now here is the thing, medical studies are quite long.
how long? Isn't 4-5 years the full course for GP? and then 2 more years for MD? In which year you are in your studies? Also look at medical studies in Finland and if you have similar courses you can also look for transfer of courses to get medical degree in Finland (given that you'd go through the extensive language course before getting place in medical school).
I'm in my second year.
Peach7 wrote:The other option of studying there requires quite a lot of financial funds. I don't want to be a burden to my husband.
Where? Education is free for the residents in Finland.
I'm basically not a resident yet, I would need to prove that I have financial funds, as "an international student".


Peach7
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: We got married

Post by Peach7 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:31 pm

Pursuivant wrote:One option, but then again it depends on the husband and job, is you two go to France, if its easier for you. Then use the "EU freedom of movement" as the rules are different. But if he doesn't speak French that kind of kills it. Then again, if you were studying in France and had an EU permit, you could visit Finland freely.
He doesn't speak French, and him moving out of Finland is not an option (because of his job, he would lose it if he did). :/


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