Childless foreigners in Finland, what about the babies??

[Cory]

However, I wish to point out the obvious fact that no-one, but no-one, gets involved in a relationship, gets married, has children etc.etc. actually being able to imagine for real "what if"... People may be mature and sensible (and naturally all the points for at least trying!) and they may discuss all those things but when it comes to the crunch... All's thrown out of the window. Sometimes life indeed is b**ch and then you die... Meaning that however much you try to accommodate and not think about yourself etc.etc. there comes a limit when, for example, the other half all of a sudden starts seeing things differently. And you have no control over that. Depending on the person, of course!

For sure. And everything changes based on the moment's situation. However, IMNSHO, I believe that based the multitude of choices people are faced with on a constant basis, sometimes committments are made loosely and without really having been thought through. In today's world, everything is *fast*..the saying "you snooze, you lose" is a belief not only held dear in the business world. Unfortunately, **some** people don't think before they act.

No judgements are being made, just an observation, btw!

Cory

[Rosamunda]

Especially if you look at someone else's situation: you never, ever know the actual details if you are not a member of that particular family and have not lived in their shoes... Reason why I find it pretty upsetting when there is an uproar in cases like the most recent international custody battle... I really, sincerely wish it will all turn out for the children's best.

Sooo true. In fact it is truly amazing how close you can be to a family (neighbours, godparents, life-long friends) and STILL not know so much about their personal relationships ie: between husband and wife or between individual parents and children. A very close friend of mine told me she was about to leave her husband last year.... I was totally gobsmacked, almost in a state of shock and cried for days. I just could NOT believe it was happening and I could not believe that their couple was not working. So you just have to stand around and try and offer good advice (when asked for it ) and not be too judgemental.

My boys know the boys in the current court case and they are really concerned. Concerned for their friends and concerned also about the general issues raised re: marriage and divorce and loving someone and then having kids. We've had some good discussions this week, but I can tell they are still perplexed and confused.

[strawberry]

IMNSHO, I believe that based the multitude of choices people are faced with on a constant basis, sometimes committments are made loosely and without really having been thought through. In today's world, everything is *fast*..the saying "you snooze, you lose" is a belief not only held dear in the business world. Unfortunately, **some** people don't think before they act.

Now this is spot on, too!! I have been thinking about this one a lot lately, and it seems some people are "serial divorcees" without ever thinking twice, and for every single relationship they have a baby... Plus, then they start using the kids as weapons... But, yeah, you live in the fast lane and one tiny little obstacle will send you to the magistrate's... Never mind the babes etc. I have always in the past objected to "mandatory conselling" type of thing, which has from time to time been on the cards, but I must say that I'm slowly beginning to reconsider my stand... All this stems from the general attitude (used to bring children up, too, these days) that I want it all NOW - and I'm entitled to it! As a mate said: the "I love me, who do you love" attitude. That is not only extremely sad but scary: where will it all stop...

Now all the above naturally applies to all relationships, not just international ones... Funnily enough, sometimes I think that an international relationship can be even stronger than an "ordinary" one, despite the special hardships. Or, maybe just because of them??

[otyikondo]

Good thread

[Cory]

it seems some people are "serial divorcees" without ever thinking twice. I have always in the past objected to "mandatory conselling" type of thing, which has from time to time been on the cards, but I must say that I'm slowly beginning to reconsider my stand...

I'm a big *big* supporter of counselling before marriage, whether it be supported by the church or supported by the state. I truly believe that having people *really* think about the fact that they're going to have to spend 24/7 with one person for the rest of their lives will deter the weak kneed..heck after 10 years it still scares the crap out of me!

I also believe that counselling should be a big part of prenatal classes as well..

Cory

[Cory]

Now all the above naturally applies to all relationships, not just international ones... Funnily enough, sometimes I think that an international relationship can be even stronger than an "ordinary" one, despite the special hardships. Or, maybe just because of them??

Good point! There are a ton of added stresses in a relationship when one is married to a person from a different country. I think every one of us on this list can attest to that one. I believe that one of the reasons my dh and I have such a strong marriage is because we've had to go through a lot due to our living abroad and through this have developed a level of respect for one another that may or may not have developed had we been a "mono-cultured" couple.

Cory

[Rosamunda]

I also believe that counselling should be a big part of prenatal classes as well..

Cory

Not sure I know exactly what you mean by "counselling" in this context (that's a very American English term, I think). But I'm all for teaching some kind of "parenting" skills in secondary school.... after all, a huge number of kids have babies within 5 years or so of leaving school. My husband's niece's baby is due any day now and she only just graduated from her matric in May. I had my first at 34 yrs and I just cannot believe how anybody as young as 18 can be a parent. But some do and they make a good job of it. Some just have nothing better to do at the time.

[bubble]

Interesting disscusion afoot!

I believe if you are together an have moved abroad AND have had kids, all that comitment and strength in the relationship (and by god you need it with kids!) will make it stronger than most relationships. Relationships are an on going loving and learning experience and need to be worked on continuously, what you put in you get out.

Bet you never thought you'd get this much of a lecture Phil!

I know alot of muticultural families here with young kids, however what I have been wondering is what happens when they start their schooling here. I worry about being able to support them, help them with their studies etc.

Any one with such experience?

[yaxxi]

I think the problem is the same even when you live in different areas of the same country!

After all, Finland is a very safe and nice place to have kids, so go on making babies Have you ever heard the vauvatekohomma-song? *ggg*

[yaxxi]

[quote="bubble"]Interesting disscusion afoot!

what I have been wondering is what happens when they start their schooling here. I worry about being able to support them, help them with their studies etc.

quote]

I do not have children yet, but I think I understand your worries. It scares me for instance if my own child would talk Finnish and I would not understand everything (although I speak it quit well already). On the other hand, having one parent from another culture also enriches the life of the child. As a teenager they might want to neglect it, or maybe they get teased in school, but after all, I think it is positive for them, especially when they are bilingual.

But still, unfortunately as a foreigner you will always look a bit stupid among the Finns, simply because of a lack of conversation skills... at least I have the feeling sometimes