Lox, bagel and cream cheese

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sammy
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by sammy » Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:39 pm

Näköjään täällä on pastanjauhanta edelleen käynnissä :lol:



Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

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jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:00 pm


Not true. Whilst Barilla and DeCecco can be found in most stores, most of the pasta section shelf space is occupied by low quality, domestic pasta which is close to inedible - Myllyn Paras and Torino to name but two

http://www.torino.fi/www/page/1912
http://www.myllynparas.fi/portal/suomi/ ... atuotteet/

If there was no demand for that crap it wouldn't be on the shelves, would it?
Have a look at the labels - am pretty sure all or most contain at least some portion of Durum. Have you ever eaten the 'Vaasa' spaghetti which was from pure Pohjanmaa winter wheat? Pretty much indistinguishable from Wonder bread - soaked in water - and pushed thru a pasta machine. Aaaaaggghhhh!

As for many people still buying crap - guess you are right - Saarionen still sells!!

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:05 pm


Tell me something I don't know. And how can this be? Considering that Finland is a today haven for gourmands?
No, the majority here know what they like: cheap and cheerful. Infact forget cheerful - they like cheap.
Who the hell said it's haven for gourmands? And who the hell needs that - gourmands and gourmets are not the core of good eating. Simple people knowing their ingredients and techniques are quite enough. One can eat really well with a very moderate budget - it just takes experience to have learned what quality differences are - and to take a bit of trouble to find good ingredients.

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:12 pm

This whole thing about Finnish spaghetti (who knew?) and the licensing office has been eye-opening for me. I remember Kekkonen's funeral and did live under Eila Kännö but never experienced the full Kekkonen-era Finland.
I'm not so sure whether this is a sincere statement or a bit of sarcasm. Life was pretty rough if you were not born in Finland or were from an Anglo-Saxon country, white and had a PhD - I thus qualified - but knew many who were thrown out because they were not. And I had practical experiences at License Office where the place was packed with Jingoists - and were not afraid to let that be known.

The spaghetti thing was the tip of the iceberg - and I don't mean lettuce.

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 12:08 am

I am curious as to how reviews on Eat.Fi support the thought that food offered in Finland must 'match' some local Finnish temporal taste preference before it is considered 'good'

I really would appreciate some specific 'quotes' from Eat.Fi (copy/paste)

I have searched considerably myself and really have no idea what these references might be

(I hope it goes beyond some preferences such as 'less hot/spicy preferred' )

Upphew
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by Upphew » Wed Dec 22, 2010 9:05 am

jmakinen wrote:I am curious as to how reviews on Eat.Fi support the thought that food offered in Finland must 'match' some local Finnish temporal taste preference before it is considered 'good'
Finns don't eat out. If a restaurant don't cater to maximum number of people, it won't survive. McD has been in Finland from 1984, it has made profit in 2008 and 2009, iirc. Of course some of that is smart tax planning, but McD-Fi has got some of its loans and interests (from McD-US) waived.
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jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:21 am

Finns don't eat out. If a restaurant don't cater to maximum number of people, it won't survive. McD has been in Finland from 1984, it has made profit in 2008 and 2009, iirc. Of course some of that is smart tax planning, but McD-Fi has got some of its loans and interests (from McD-US) waived.
THAT certainly is true - the whole restaurant scene is geared to lunches, 'business' tax-deductible stuff - and Uudenmaankatu-type 'smart (dumb) set' salad plates.

But my question related to eat.fi reviews as it was intimating that the content of these reviews was referring to 'Finnish preferences' - and I was more than interested in seeing some SPECIFIC quotes (unrelated to how much chili was in a dish)

Tiwaz
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by Tiwaz » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:39 am

jmakinen wrote:My argument is not that there aren't 'ethnic' restaurants easing up mostly on spicy hot - but that the situation is DRAMATICALLY changed from years ago - and changing all the time. 'Finnish' preferences have developed tremendously. You could probably been arrested by Kekkonen's police if they caught you with a chili in 1970.
And here the great white master is up on it again.
As we can see, Finns DEVELOP by eatings stuff more in line with preferences of great white master.
Great white master has not yet grasped that his preferences in food do not equal the absolute, 100% objective truth.

Your might be less failure in life if you ate big helping of humble pie and accepted that your preferences in taste are just that, not some @#$% universal absolute.
No FINN would ever eat today the spaghetti they were manufacturing and selling EXCLUSIVELY - those knowing Finland for only the last 10-15 even 20 years will have no idea what I'm talking about, referring to - or realizing what a long path the Finns have traveled in these years.
And Bluearse has already debunked the claim.

As for your eat.fi question. If food is considered bad by people, then it does not fit the local preferences.
It is too spicy, it is too that or what.

Here is one part from "New Bamboo Center" from Finland, from FOREIGNER apparently.
We asked for highly spiced and it was. The first time in Finland that spicy actually was spicy.
In short, food is altered to suit Finnish taste.

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:46 am

In short, food is altered to suit Finnish taste.
I said to leave out the too hot-spicy category. One will find that Asian food as prepared in Asia is almost ALWAYS too 'hot' for whatever local preferences are in this matter - anywhere except Asia (and maybe Mexico where the kids eat chili candy)

One will find food 'altered' that way EVERYplace - but the number of Scovilles is not really a parameter of taste in general - nor preferences. Mushy carrots are mushy globally - tough meat is always tough meat, pasty bread is always pasty bread - etc etc etc.

Hopefully your concept of taste and preferences is not so one dimensional as to limit itself to chili quantity.

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:49 am

No FINN would ever eat today the spaghetti they were manufacturing and selling EXCLUSIVELY - those knowing Finland for only the last 10-15 even 20 years will have no idea what I'm talking about, referring to - or realizing what a long path the Finns have traveled in these years.


And Bluearse has already debunked the claim.
Hardly - you didn't read the later part re that they now contain at least partially Durum wheat - the ingredient of real pasta. Durum does not cook to paste when it is 'done' - depending on type of pasta - cooking time of 6-9 minutes still leaves 100% Durum products 'al dente' - if only 50% or so - it will still keep the pasta from being like thick library glue.

Upphew
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by Upphew » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:19 pm

jmakinen wrote:Hardly - you didn't read the later part re that they now contain at least partially Durum wheat - the ingredient of real pasta. Durum does not cook to paste when it is 'done' - depending on type of pasta - cooking time of 6-9 minutes still leaves 100% Durum products 'al dente' - if only 50% or so - it will still keep the pasta from being like thick library glue.
Real pasta... for the region where durum grows, elsewhere pasta was made with regular wheat and is now called fresh pasta. Dunno why every other fresh pasta recipe calls for durum?
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jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:30 pm


Real pasta... for the region where durum grows, elsewhere pasta was made with regular wheat and is now called fresh pasta. Dunno why every other fresh pasta recipe calls for durum?
Yes - right - should have specified DRY pasta - fresh pasta can be made from whatever. But if made with soft wheat then the product will not have the 'al dente' characteristic you get with Durum. Using Durum means one is wanting a higher protein/gluten content - Durum at 15% being double of the 'soft' types - so you'll get more 'chewiness' rather than 'pastiness' - one can also use Durum in making bread with similar results.

And this is the place for 'preferences' - I happen to 'prefer' a bit of 'bite' -- but the old Vaasa dried soft wheat just made a giant gluey mess - covered with ketchup - it was often the favorite of kids.

Rob A.
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by Rob A. » Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:26 pm

Upphew wrote:Finns don't eat out. If a restaurant don't cater to maximum number of people, it won't survive. McD has been in Finland from 1984, it has made profit in 2008 and 2009, iirc. Of course some of that is smart tax planning, but McD-Fi has got some of its loans and interests (from McD-US) waived.
Now that sounds like good news to me...McD can't make a profit in Finland.... :D I've wondered, too, since the shock of seeing my first McDonald's sign in France if they are making a profit there.... I have to beieve, though, that their target market must be foreign tourists.... Surely it can't be les Françaises....... :(

jmakinen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by jmakinen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 9:08 pm

Now that sounds like good news to me...McD can't make a profit in Finland.... I've wondered, too, since the shock of seeing my first McDonald's sign in France if they are making a profit there.... I have to beieve, though, that their target market must be foreign tourists.... Surely it can't be les Françaises.......
But don't knock the coffee (when you remember to ask it comes from the fresh pot) - and the Sausage McMuffin is pretty damn tasty - though a better deal in US at $1.

tuulen
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Re: Lox, bagel and cream cheese

Post by tuulen » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:23 pm

jmakinen wrote:...and the Sausage McMuffin is pretty damn tasty...
How could a Sausage McMuffin compare to lox, bagel and cream cheese?

There is a world of difference between them!


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