Hello Dear All,
I would like to appeal to the collective wisdom and parental experience of the users in the following situation:
Our baby is still quite small, not even a year old yet. We are planning on starting a daycare after a year. There are 3 languages in our family. Mom's, Dad's (Finnish) and we speak English with each other. Actually, our English is often on a Finglish side but I'm now trying to re-train ourselves to stick to purer English. It's extremely important for me to preserve my native language in our child's active use on as good level as possible. That's why I try exposing the baby to my language as much as possible, in addition to just me baby-talking to her.
In addition to daddy, there are other Finnish relatives nearby and a few Finnish kids of similar age among our neighbors. If we'll go for Finnish daycare, I'd have to work hard providing my native language environment in the rest of the time, which is indeed possible. However, it would mean getting involved with a lot of those activities on regular basis all over the capital region, which might be a bit exhausting and also reducing dad's casual time with the baby.
So, which language daycare would you recommend?
And on a non-language note. I started "shopping around" and so far visited 2 nearest Finnish daycare places and both managers gave me a very nice tour. They seemed nice, although quite different from the daycare I attended and saw in my home country. Can you probably share your opinion on differences between different language daycare places in PKS (again, apart from the language itself)? And also, can you probably point out some differences between a good and not-so-good Finnish daycare? In other words, what should I be paying attention to when daycare-shopping, what to ask etc?
Thank you All in advance.
Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Questi
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chickensexer
- Posts: 1248
- Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 8:50 pm
Re: Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Qu
It's been a long time for me and I don't know about Finnish daycare specifically, but I would say: don't be blinded by the facilities and the wonderful organisation etc. Look at the kids, do they seem relaxed?
I put my two into a place that was perfectly efficient, there were charts everywhere, it was very clear that they spent a lot of effort in meeting all the regulations and were very very organised. I got told about all the things they did for measuring child development. I was impressed. I put my kids in there. Things went ok, I mean, you expect some adjustment and some stress, but life went on and I felt my kids were safe.
A year later, we moved house and they went to the local place because I was desperate for two slots in a nearby daycare, so I took it. It was a much lower socio-economic area (not a slum by any means but a lot more middle-class). They had far fewer rules and charts and so on but OH MY GOODNESS, the difference in my children. They began smiling about kindy and about their friends and about having FUN. Kid #1 still cried every time I left (that was no different) but this time, at the end of the day they didn't want to come home.
All three of us have very warm memories of that second place and I wish I had looked around as a mother instead of like I was interviewing the place.
As for which language to pick... I don't really see that you have a solution that fixes everything. Your child won't get to English fluency from you two speaking only to each other, by the way... I know a family where each parent spoke a different language to the kids and a third with each other. The third language was still close to non-existent in the kids by adolescence because neither parent ever spoke it with the children. Hearing it is just not the same as interacting - the kids would just tune out when the parents were speaking to one another. Your baby is sure to pick up a fair bit of English in peruskoulu just like their peers will, but "not achieving native level" will be a thing, and might affect your choice so it's good to know. My gut feeling is that baby will get nice and fluent in speaking your native language just from you. It just tends to happen when it's the mother and she spends more time with the child.
Be prepared, whatever language daycare is in, that will be the first language baby speaks, which can be a shock if you're babbling to her in your own language and she replies in Finnish. But it's not a concern, it's just part of the language process.
I put my two into a place that was perfectly efficient, there were charts everywhere, it was very clear that they spent a lot of effort in meeting all the regulations and were very very organised. I got told about all the things they did for measuring child development. I was impressed. I put my kids in there. Things went ok, I mean, you expect some adjustment and some stress, but life went on and I felt my kids were safe.
A year later, we moved house and they went to the local place because I was desperate for two slots in a nearby daycare, so I took it. It was a much lower socio-economic area (not a slum by any means but a lot more middle-class). They had far fewer rules and charts and so on but OH MY GOODNESS, the difference in my children. They began smiling about kindy and about their friends and about having FUN. Kid #1 still cried every time I left (that was no different) but this time, at the end of the day they didn't want to come home.
All three of us have very warm memories of that second place and I wish I had looked around as a mother instead of like I was interviewing the place.
As for which language to pick... I don't really see that you have a solution that fixes everything. Your child won't get to English fluency from you two speaking only to each other, by the way... I know a family where each parent spoke a different language to the kids and a third with each other. The third language was still close to non-existent in the kids by adolescence because neither parent ever spoke it with the children. Hearing it is just not the same as interacting - the kids would just tune out when the parents were speaking to one another. Your baby is sure to pick up a fair bit of English in peruskoulu just like their peers will, but "not achieving native level" will be a thing, and might affect your choice so it's good to know. My gut feeling is that baby will get nice and fluent in speaking your native language just from you. It just tends to happen when it's the mother and she spends more time with the child.
Be prepared, whatever language daycare is in, that will be the first language baby speaks, which can be a shock if you're babbling to her in your own language and she replies in Finnish. But it's not a concern, it's just part of the language process.
Re: Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Qu
Private daycare= 2nd rate(usually) in Finland. You may find a great Montessori place or something but usually regular Finnish municipal kindergartens are better by a mile. Stick with them at least until kid is 3 years, then they are moved into bigger groups and there may be a case for moving to private.
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Flossy1978
- Posts: 1395
- Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 3:38 pm
Re: Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Qu
My son went to a public and private day care.
The public did hardly any extra activities. They did the usual stuff and were good. But they basically just played outside for two hours in the morning and two hours in the afternoon. Nothing extra.
But then my son went to a private day care when we moved. The difference was great! The kids did so many extra things that weren't being done in the public day care. In the private day care, the head teacher was into sports. Had some kind of sports credentials. The kids went skiing and ice skating every week, at least once, during winter. They would go to sauna. The education portion was better. They had a better area to play in outside and weren't "just" sent outside to play for the morning and afternoon play times. The day care organised games and other educational stuff for them to do while outside playing. This day care also arranged for little trips for the younger kids and slightly more time consuming trips outside of the day care, during the days. They'd go to the library every week. They'd go to plays etc. The teachers/carers were wonderful and often the kids didn't want to go home.
It just depends on the day care. But I think private day cares have more leeway to do more stuff with children. Whether they choose to do it, or just run the place like a factory, depends on the individual day care.
As for languages. The Finnish Government suggests speaking ONLY your native tongue to your child. Speaking other languages to the child is NOT a good idea, if you are not a native speaker of said language. Your husband should speak ONLY Finnish to your child. You should speak ONLY your language. And neither should be teaching your child English. English will be easily learned in school, even from grade 2 - 3. And there is so much English in society there, children who have no English at home pick it up easily nowadays.
You really do not need to do all that extra stuff to get your child to learn your language. Just speak to your child in your own mother tongue. Read to the child when older. Do some book activities, put tv on in your language, etc. If you want to, you could hire someone to come around 2-3 times a week to just play with your child in your Mother Tongue. There really is no need to go to crazy lengths, like how you've written to have them learning your language.
If you don't follow what the Government says, regarding languages, it is highly likely your child is going to have their language/speech messed up. Dad speak Finnish, you speak your language and leave out the English. Young children learn languages so easily, but also can get severely messed up if taught poor language skills from non-native speakers. Your child will be fine with a bilingual home, especially if you both speak a different language. 100000's of children have been taught this way before your child and 100000's will learn after your child, very easily.
Don't make it harder than it sounds (because you are, especially regarding your own language).
The public did hardly any extra activities. They did the usual stuff and were good. But they basically just played outside for two hours in the morning and two hours in the afternoon. Nothing extra.
But then my son went to a private day care when we moved. The difference was great! The kids did so many extra things that weren't being done in the public day care. In the private day care, the head teacher was into sports. Had some kind of sports credentials. The kids went skiing and ice skating every week, at least once, during winter. They would go to sauna. The education portion was better. They had a better area to play in outside and weren't "just" sent outside to play for the morning and afternoon play times. The day care organised games and other educational stuff for them to do while outside playing. This day care also arranged for little trips for the younger kids and slightly more time consuming trips outside of the day care, during the days. They'd go to the library every week. They'd go to plays etc. The teachers/carers were wonderful and often the kids didn't want to go home.
It just depends on the day care. But I think private day cares have more leeway to do more stuff with children. Whether they choose to do it, or just run the place like a factory, depends on the individual day care.
As for languages. The Finnish Government suggests speaking ONLY your native tongue to your child. Speaking other languages to the child is NOT a good idea, if you are not a native speaker of said language. Your husband should speak ONLY Finnish to your child. You should speak ONLY your language. And neither should be teaching your child English. English will be easily learned in school, even from grade 2 - 3. And there is so much English in society there, children who have no English at home pick it up easily nowadays.
You really do not need to do all that extra stuff to get your child to learn your language. Just speak to your child in your own mother tongue. Read to the child when older. Do some book activities, put tv on in your language, etc. If you want to, you could hire someone to come around 2-3 times a week to just play with your child in your Mother Tongue. There really is no need to go to crazy lengths, like how you've written to have them learning your language.
If you don't follow what the Government says, regarding languages, it is highly likely your child is going to have their language/speech messed up. Dad speak Finnish, you speak your language and leave out the English. Young children learn languages so easily, but also can get severely messed up if taught poor language skills from non-native speakers. Your child will be fine with a bilingual home, especially if you both speak a different language. 100000's of children have been taught this way before your child and 100000's will learn after your child, very easily.
Don't make it harder than it sounds (because you are, especially regarding your own language).
Re: Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Qu
If mum and dad are using English as a vehicular language then its difficult to imagine a family scenario where the little one would not be hearing English/Finglish. My kids had a similar problem: Three languages at home. Very tricky. Unless the parents are actually separated or divorced!
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chickensexer
- Posts: 1248
- Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 8:50 pm
Re: Multilingual Baby. Which Daycare? And General Daycare Qu
Thank you All for your replies. I visited 6 Finnish daycares in the vicinity and picked one. Normal, municipal. It has plenty of activities, including cooking, water games and carpentry; hiking trips and theater visits; lots of attention to books and learning about different cultures; organized activities and a peaceful nook just to enjoy some solitude... It's not the nearest but still close to home. I hope our child will like it there.
As for English language - i''m fully aware of the OPOL recommendation and we follow it when speaking TO the baby. However, banning English from our home altogether is not possible because I'm not capable of speaking decent Finnish.
We also started attending activities in my native language and I'm participating in a group of parents in the similar situation and also in a study of bilingual upbringing. Hopefully it all will bear some nice fruits. We'll see in a couple of years and later.
As for English language - i''m fully aware of the OPOL recommendation and we follow it when speaking TO the baby. However, banning English from our home altogether is not possible because I'm not capable of speaking decent Finnish.
We also started attending activities in my native language and I'm participating in a group of parents in the similar situation and also in a study of bilingual upbringing. Hopefully it all will bear some nice fruits. We'll see in a couple of years and later.