Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

How to? Read other's experiences. Find useful advice on shipping, immigration, residence permits, visas and more.
Post Reply
Kuzay
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:54 pm

Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Kuzay » Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:36 am

Situation:

1. My non-EU wife applies in February for her residence permit based on family ties here in Finland.(Her visa is valid for 1-year)
2. She stays here with me until June (overstays 90 days as she's allowed to). Leaves Finland for 2-3 weeks. (Direct flight to another country with no layovers)
3. Enters Finland again ( her visa is still valid but 90/180 days are used).

I'm concerned about point #3 and initially I thought it's not going to work out, but here's what I found on this forum (it says for US citizens, but I feel like it should be the same for non-EU too):
OK U.S.A. peeps, I now have reliable information as I actually took it upon myself to e-mail the Finnish border security and got a surprisingly speedy reply. A US citizen, whose immigration process is ongoing, is allowed to travel in and out of Finland even after the 90 days in Schengen area in the past 180 are up. This has a few requirements though:
- Must only travel to and from Finland directly outside Schengen (so, for example, directly from Helsinki to LAX in our case, no layovers within Schengen)
- Passport has to be valid for 3 months after re-entering Finland and
- It is recommended to have a copy of the Migri paper stating your RP is in process with you when you travel

If your 90 days within 180 days are not over however, you have no problem travelling back and forth with as many layovers as your heart pleases.

I'm definitely printing that e-mail and giving it to my fiancé when he flies out to the States, as we all know, the more paper you have, the better!!!
And this is what migri's site stating (there's a warning about issuing a new visa, but my wife's visa is going to be valid at that time )
.
I have submitted an application for a residence permit in Finland. May I leave Finland and then return to Finland to await my decision?
Yes, you may, if a Finnish mission (embassy or consulate) grants you a visa or if you can return visa-free. Please remember that you will not necessarily be granted a visa for the purpose of returning to Finland.
What do you guys think about that situation? Do you think it's going to be a problem to leave and enter Finland again after 90/180 days expire ?

Thanks for the help in advance!



Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Sponsor:

Finland Forum Ad-O-Matic
 

Upphew
Posts: 10670
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:55 pm
Location: Lappeenranta

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Upphew » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:17 am

Kuzay wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:36 am
Situation:

1. My non-EU wife applies in February for her residence permit based on family ties here in Finland.(Her visa is valid for 1-year)
2. She stays here with me until June (overstays 90 days as she's allowed to). Leaves Finland for 2-3 weeks. (Direct flight to another country with no layovers)
3. Enters Finland again ( her visa is still valid but 90/180 days are used).

I'm concerned about point #3 and initially I thought it's not going to work out, but here's what I found on this forum (it says for US citizens, but I feel like it should be the same for non-EU too):
OK U.S.A. peeps, I now have reliable information as I actually took it upon myself to e-mail the Finnish border security and got a surprisingly speedy reply. A US citizen, whose immigration process is ongoing, is allowed to travel in and out of Finland even after the 90 days in Schengen area in the past 180 are up. This has a few requirements though:
- Must only travel to and from Finland directly outside Schengen (so, for example, directly from Helsinki to LAX in our case, no layovers within Schengen)
- Passport has to be valid for 3 months after re-entering Finland and
- It is recommended to have a copy of the Migri paper stating your RP is in process with you when you travel

If your 90 days within 180 days are not over however, you have no problem travelling back and forth with as many layovers as your heart pleases.

I'm definitely printing that e-mail and giving it to my fiancé when he flies out to the States, as we all know, the more paper you have, the better!!!
And this is what migri's site stating (there's a warning about issuing a new visa, but my wife's visa is going to be valid at that time )
.
I have submitted an application for a residence permit in Finland. May I leave Finland and then return to Finland to await my decision?
Yes, you may, if a Finnish mission (embassy or consulate) grants you a visa or if you can return visa-free. Please remember that you will not necessarily be granted a visa for the purpose of returning to Finland.
What do you guys think about that situation? Do you think it's going to be a problem to leave and enter Finland again after 90/180 days expire ?

Thanks for the help in advance!
The 90/180 rule is for visa free travel. So if you stay in Schengen area for more than 90 days in 180 days you'll need visa or residence permit. While your permit is processed you have right to wait for the decision in Finland, but you don't have right to bounce around in Schengen area.

So concerning your 3rd point: if your wife has valid Visa she can travel freely. No need to muddle up things with visa free period, which might or might not apply to your wife.
http://google.com http://translate.google.com http://urbandictionary.com
Visa is for visiting, Residence Permit for residing.

Kuzay
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:54 pm

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Kuzay » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:26 am

Hi upphew, thanks for your answer, but I find it a bit confusing. My wife doesn't have visa free right as she's non-eu. So even for entering Finland she needs to have visa initially.

So concerning your 3rd point: if your wife has valid Visa she can travel freely. No need to muddle up things with visa free period, which might or might not apply to your wife.
Sorry, are you saying it's going to be ok to exceed 90/180 rule and leave the country and then come back (assuming there's no borders crossed in-between).

Upphew
Posts: 10670
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:55 pm
Location: Lappeenranta

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Upphew » Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:08 pm

Kuzay wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:26 am
Hi upphew, thanks for your answer, but I find it a bit confusing. My wife doesn't have visa free right as she's non-eu. So even for entering Finland she needs to have visa initially.

So concerning your 3rd point: if your wife has valid Visa she can travel freely. No need to muddle up things with visa free period, which might or might not apply to your wife.
Sorry, are you saying it's going to be ok to exceed 90/180 rule and leave the country and then come back (assuming there's no borders crossed in-between).
USA is non-eu, but their citizens don't need visa for Schengen area, if they stay under 90 days in any 180 days period. You brought up USA example and so I assumed your wife is from similar country.
If one has visa then you can check from that how long it is valid and how many entries it covers, https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/visa-sticker/ and forget about those visa free periods

I'm saying that there is no 90/180 rule _unless_ you are travelling without visa. You don't need visa if you are from a list of countries that don't need one: https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/who-ne ... ngen-visa/

And just to be clear... Visa is for visiting, up to three months, residence permit is for residing.
http://google.com http://translate.google.com http://urbandictionary.com
Visa is for visiting, Residence Permit for residing.

mdn
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 9:58 am
Location: Tampere, Finland

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by mdn » Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:35 pm

Kuzay wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:36 am
Situation:

1. My non-EU wife applies in February for her residence permit based on family ties here in Finland.(Her visa is valid for 1-year)
2. She stays here with me until June (overstays 90 days as she's allowed to). Leaves Finland for 2-3 weeks. (Direct flight to another country with no layovers)
3. Enters Finland again ( her visa is still valid but 90/180 days are used).
There will no be problems on Finnish border for her (almost, might be just some small delay).

The problem for her will be to reach Finnish border. The only paper after #1 has a 1st line with bold text something like "Not valid for travels" (and the only text in English there), and for most airline companies it would be not enough to allow to board her with visa without available stay days.

You might request some clarification from raja.fi. I am not sure what they will reply, it might be that airline personnel would like to check it and call / send request to Finland - it really might take an additional time.

And do not forget about Corona, any other limitation might be on that side / here. If she would fly now to Finland - she must confirm that she is not just a tourist also, by some documents that she has some family ties with someone residing in Finland. I have no any clue how that airline would check it and what is required.

Kuzay
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:54 pm

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Kuzay » Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:23 pm

Got it, I brought up US example because the main point of it is that a person overstayed 90/180 days during his/her stay on visa free / Schengen visa period (it doesn't matter) but was able to leave and enter Finland after that having the paper from migri on hands.
And just to be clear... Visa is for visiting, up to three months, residence permit is for residing.
Yeah that's true :) but there's also a valid right to stay at the country while rp is in progress exceeding visa 90 days or even visa validity time. Also, don't see a reason why Finnish government would 'close' any possible travels even to a home country for a person who's waiting for rp in Finland for about 9-12 months.

Yeah, this paper from migri of course can't be used as a travel document such as visa, because it has a different purpose and related only to Finland. But I hope it allows a person to move out and come back without consequences. And the concern about getting to Finnish border is also valid, I think, when it comes to airlines.

vitaliysh
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2009 10:36 pm

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by vitaliysh » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:11 pm

My mother was in similar situation. Her permit expired January 2019, new one was granted June 2020. Migi told us she is allowed to leave the country, but won't be allowed to return. She will have to apply for a new residence permit back home, starting entire process all over again.
https://migri.fi/en/-/suunnitteletko-lo ... n-voimassa

I'm not sure traveling within EU is a good idea either. With COVID right now, they could easily spot check ID. Even before COVID-19 times I've had my permit checked few times on the exit from the plane. Border control is waiting in the hub from the plane.

Kuzay
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:54 pm

Re: Leaving and entering Finland while waiting for residence permit.

Post by Kuzay » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:20 pm

vitaliysh wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:11 pm
My mother was in similar situation. Her permit expired January 2019, new one was granted June 2020. Migi told us she is allowed to leave the country, but won't be allowed to return. She will have to apply for a new residence permit back home, starting entire process all over again.
https://migri.fi/en/-/suunnitteletko-lo ... n-voimassa

I'm not sure traveling within EU is a good idea either. With COVID right now, they could easily spot check ID. Even before COVID-19 times I've had my permit checked few times on the exit from the plane. Border control is waiting in the hub from the plane.
Hi, this is not a similar situation because there was a gap when she didn't have any permit/visa to enter Finland again.

So, even if you have the paper from migri, but no valid visa / permit at the time you crossing the border, you can't come back to Finland. I believe you can ask for a tourist visa during this time also but there's no guarantee they will approve it.


Post Reply