Help with correct RP

How to? Read other's experiences. Find useful advice on shipping, immigration, residence permits, visas and more.
Zaybia
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:30 pm

Help with correct RP

Post by Zaybia » Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:42 pm

Greetings everyone,

I'm currently married to a Finnish citizen and about to apply for residence permit on the basis of family ties whilst here in Finland.

However, I'm also contemplating a job offer from a Finnish business that would sponsor me to stay in Finland under a work RP.

I understand that the marriage RP is logically the best way to go but with the wait time of 9months+ and not being able to work, I'm thinking it might be better to go down the work sponsorship route?

My question is if I apply for a work based RP in Finland and for some reason it was rejected, would I still be able to apply for another RP straight after on the basis of family ties? From reading the criteria for a work RP there shouldn't be any reason it's declined as it's a specialist position but wanted another opinion. My main concern is that If MIGRI declines my work RP application I have to leave and cannot be with my partner.

Any advice would be appreciated :)

Thanks in advance.



Help with correct RP

Sponsor:

Finland Forum Ad-O-Matic
 

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:49 pm

Zaybia wrote:
Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:42 pm
Greetings everyone,

I'm currently married to a Finnish citizen and about to apply for residence permit on the basis of family ties whilst here in Finland.

However, I'm also contemplating a job offer from a Finnish business that would sponsor me to stay in Finland under a work RP.

I understand that the marriage RP is logically the best way to go but with the wait time of 9months+ and not being able to work, I'm thinking it might be better to go down the work sponsorship route?

My question is if I apply for a work based RP in Finland and for some reason it was rejected, would I still be able to apply for another RP straight after on the basis of family ties? From reading the criteria for a work RP there shouldn't be any reason it's declined as it's a specialist position but wanted another opinion. My main concern is that If MIGRI declines my work RP application I have to leave and cannot be with my partner.

Any advice would be appreciated :)

Thanks in advance.
A negative decision won’t have legal effect immediately (time to appeal etc). You will be able to lodge a new application during this period. You are also able to disclose any additional grounds as part of the specialist application.

” Please state whether there is any other purpose for your residence in Finland than that stated above which you wish to declare.”

https://migri.fi/documents/5202425/5790 ... 8en%29.pdf

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Sat Aug 07, 2021 10:21 pm

Zaybia wrote:
Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:42 pm
Any advice would be appreciated :)
Marriage based RP and ask your employer to let you work remotely from your home country.

There are many horror stories on this forum about negative decisions on work based residence permits.

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Sat Aug 07, 2021 11:47 pm

jaatelo wrote:
Sat Aug 07, 2021 10:21 pm
Zaybia wrote:
Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:42 pm
Any advice would be appreciated :)
Marriage based RP and ask your employer to let you work remotely from your home country.

There are many horror stories on this forum about negative decisions on work based residence permits.
Please give some examples of horror stories for specialist permits. I don’t think they are a common occurance.

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Sun Aug 08, 2021 12:55 am

betelgeuse wrote:
Sat Aug 07, 2021 11:47 pm
Please give some examples of horror stories for specialist permits. I don’t think they are a common occurance.
Common issues regarding work related residence permits (not specialist) on this forum:

1) TE office called my company but they could not get in touch with my employer and therefore residence permit was refused.

2) Migri says that my salary is not high enough and refused my residence permit.

3) My employer assumed I was EU citizen and now they are not ready to sponsor my residence permit application.

4) Migri says Finnish language is required for this job and refused my permit.

Kuzay
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:54 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by Kuzay » Sun Aug 08, 2021 1:57 am

Apply for RP based on work and specify the date when you need to start as soon as possible, but according to your contract. This will give your RP a priority. It won't take 9 months for sure.
In case you get a negative decision, apply for RP based on family ties and wait either in your home country or in Finland with your spouse.
There are 10 times more horror stories about negative decisions for RPs based on family ties, so don't bother.

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:24 am

jaatelo wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 12:55 am
betelgeuse wrote:
Sat Aug 07, 2021 11:47 pm
Please give some examples of horror stories for specialist permits. I don’t think they are a common occurance.
Common issues regarding work related residence permits (not specialist) on this forum:

1) TE office called my company but they could not get in touch with my employer and therefore residence permit was refused.

2) Migri says that my salary is not high enough and refused my residence permit.

3) My employer assumed I was EU citizen and now they are not ready to sponsor my residence permit application.

4) Migri says Finnish language is required for this job and refused my permit.
So basically you admitted to misleading the original poster…

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Sun Aug 08, 2021 1:14 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:24 am
So basically you admitted to misleading the original poster…
Well all of those things can happen to specialist permit application also, or are you saying that TE office is not involved in those permits? Or that specialist permits are always granted?

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Sun Aug 08, 2021 1:39 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:24 am
So basically you admitted to misleading the original poster…
Marriage based permit is also better for other situations like unemployment. And you can always exercise treaty rights in another EU country. It always helps to have a marriage based permit in hand while exercising those rights in other countries. Also, to refuse a marriage based permit, migri have to deny you a human right to be with your family, which in my opinion should be more difficult than to deny you a permit to work.

Zaybia
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:30 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by Zaybia » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:23 pm

Thanks for the replies everyone,

I'm already in Finland, so I guess my main concern was getting a work RP declined and then not being able to apply for a family ties RP in Finland straight after.

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:30 am

jaatelo wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 1:39 pm
betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:24 am
So basically you admitted to misleading the original poster…
Marriage based permit is also better for other situations like unemployment. And you can always exercise treaty rights in another EU country. It always helps to have a marriage based permit in hand while exercising those rights in other countries. Also, to refuse a marriage based permit, migri have to deny you a human right to be with your family, which in my opinion should be more difficult than to deny you a permit to work.
There is no difference for getting unemployment benefits.

Exercising treaty rights is done with a marriage certicate – not with a Finnish residence permit.

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:32 am

jaatelo wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 1:14 pm
betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:24 am
So basically you admitted to misleading the original poster…
Well all of those things can happen to specialist permit application also, or are you saying that TE office is not involved in those permits? Or that specialist permits are always granted?
TE office is not involved. They are not always granted but only a couple percent get refused.

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Mon Aug 09, 2021 1:25 pm

Zaybia wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:23 pm
I'm already in Finland, so I guess my main concern was getting a work RP declined and then not being able to apply for a family ties RP in Finland straight after.
So as another user suggested, specialist permits are granted 98% of the time.

However, refusals don't look good for future applications.

In fact, any time you apply for a visa for UK, USA, Canada, there is a question on the form:

"Have you ever been refused entry into a country, a visa or a resident permit?"

And if you answer YES to this question then the other country will also become suspicious of your purpose of visit etc.

jaatelo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 09, 2021 1:40 pm

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by jaatelo » Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:17 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:30 am
Exercising treaty rights is done with a marriage certicate – not with a Finnish residence permit.
Yes but one cannot cross a border with a marriage certificate if someone is waiting in Finland and comes from a country of origin for which a visa is required to enter the Schengen zone and 180 days have already passed. Such a person then can't legally cross border into Germany etc and claim treaty rights with a marriage certificate. They would have to obtain a Finnish residence permit first.

betelgeuse
Posts: 4353
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Help with correct RP

Post by betelgeuse » Mon Aug 09, 2021 6:55 pm

jaatelo wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:17 pm
betelgeuse wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:30 am
Exercising treaty rights is done with a marriage certicate – not with a Finnish residence permit.
Yes but one cannot cross a border with a marriage certificate if someone is waiting in Finland and comes from a country of origin for which a visa is required to enter the Schengen zone and 180 days have already passed. Such a person then can't legally cross border into Germany etc and claim treaty rights with a marriage certificate. They would have to obtain a Finnish residence permit first.
In normal times between Finland and Germany only identity documents (passport) is checked by the airline. For member states outside Schengen, please see the following:

"If your non-EU family members need an entry visa, they should apply for one in advance from the consulate or embassy of the country they wish to travel to. If they will be travelling together with you, or joining you in another EU country, their application should be processed quickly and free of charge:"

"However, if they arrive at the border with their passport but without an entry visa, the border authorities should give them the opportunity to prove by other means that they are family members of a mobile EU citizen. They can do so by providing proof of their identity and family ties with an EU citizen (for example a marriage or birth certificate) and, proof that they are joining or accompanying the EU citizen (for example, proof that the EU citizen is already living in the country where entry is sought). If they manage to prove it, they should be issued with an entry visa on the spot."

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/t ... ard-doc-no


Post Reply