Rp and funds question

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Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:28 pm

Hi , I got a study place for masters but no scholarship. I would really appreciate if someone can help me with my questions:
1) my master's is 2 years .I can show funds for living plus tution for 1 year . am I able to apply for only 1 year permit ? Won't migri question me about funds for the remaining year ? Will applying for 1 year reduce my chance of rp ?
2) can a bank personal loan be shown as good source of funds if it's in my account ? What should be the duration of the loan ?
Thanks a lot !!



Rp and funds question

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betelgeuse
Posts: 3490
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by betelgeuse » Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:39 pm

Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:28 pm
Hi , I got a study place for masters but no scholarship. I would really appreciate if someone can help me with my questions:
1) my master's is 2 years .I can show funds for living plus tution for 1 year . am I able to apply for only 1 year permit ? Won't migri question me about funds for the remaining year ? Will applying for 1 year reduce my chance of rp ?
"For a two-year stay, you must have EUR 13,440 at your disposal. If you only want the residence permit for one year at a time, you must have EUR 6,720 at your disposal in your own bank account."

No problem applying for one year.

https://migri.fi/en/means-of-support
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:28 pm
2) can a bank personal loan be shown as good source of funds if it's in my account ? What should be the duration of the loan ?
Thanks a lot !!
Yes but the payment plan needs to start after the validity of the residence permit.

FinlandGirl
Posts: 405
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:43 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by FinlandGirl » Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:10 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:39 pm
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:28 pm
Hi , I got a study place for masters but no scholarship. I would really appreciate if someone can help me with my questions:
1) my master's is 2 years .I can show funds for living plus tution for 1 year . am I able to apply for only 1 year permit ? Won't migri question me about funds for the remaining year ? Will applying for 1 year reduce my chance of rp ?
"For a two-year stay, you must have EUR 13,440 at your disposal. If you only want the residence permit for one year at a time, you must have EUR 6,720 at your disposal in your own bank account."

No problem applying for one year.
The only problem might be that the money for the second year will have to come from somewhere.
The extension also costs 200 Euro extra.

560 Euro is a tight budget for a student in Finland, don't expect to spend less.
(Student) jobs are very hard to find for people who do not speak Finnish.
And it is not helping that the economy is currently at the start of a recession, with high unemployment expected.

Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:27 am

Thank you so much! So, for two years - if I just show that I have paid the fees for 1 year ,and have living expenses for two years- would that be ok? Or do I have to show the funds for the 2nd year tuition as well ?

Instead- if I just want to apply for 1 year- in the RP , there is no way to say I want to apply for 1 year vs two years...how do I do that- is it just on the basis of funds I present?

yeah I have the funds for the two years, only thing they are locked up in stocks /bonds which I hope will better recover next year- and don't want to take them out now ...as it would be a massive loss..
Thanks a whole bunch again betelgeuse and Finlandgirl!

Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:55 am

sorry for the multiple follow ups ..another one on source of funds..
I have invested a lot of my money in stocks/ fixed deposits etc, which are in my name..and which I would redeem to show in my application as proof of sufficient funds. The bank statement thus would have a lotttt of new entries of funds ..would that be a problem? I currently work and have a job , but 90% of my earnings I invested/saved in this form...

betelgeuse
Posts: 3490
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by betelgeuse » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:32 pm

Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:55 am
sorry for the multiple follow ups ..another one on source of funds..
I have invested a lot of my money in stocks/ fixed deposits etc, which are in my name..and which I would redeem to show in my application as proof of sufficient funds. The bank statement thus would have a lotttt of new entries of funds ..would that be a problem? I currently work and have a job , but 90% of my earnings I invested/saved in this form...
You could just use the stocks as assets directly.

FinlandGirl
Posts: 405
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:43 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by FinlandGirl » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:01 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:32 pm
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:55 am
sorry for the multiple follow ups ..another one on source of funds..
I have invested a lot of my money in stocks/ fixed deposits etc, which are in my name..and which I would redeem to show in my application as proof of sufficient funds. The bank statement thus would have a lotttt of new entries of funds ..would that be a problem? I currently work and have a job , but 90% of my earnings I invested/saved in this form...
You could just use the stocks as assets directly.
Do you have any source that Migri accepts stocks instead of money?

https://migri.fi/en/means-of-support
Migri wrote: You should attach a bank statement to your application, showing that you have the necessary funds in your bank account.
You must have the necessary funds in your own bank account that is in your personal use only.
Migri talks about funds in a bank account, not assets whose future value is unknown.

Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:01 pm

Yeah , I think I have to show the actual money , instead of just assets in my name ..

So , do you know how I say I want the permit for 1 yr vs two ? There's no place in the rp form to indicate that ...
Also since my course is two years , won't migri ask what am I planning to do after year one ?

I just don't want my permit to be rejected , so I will take out my stocks to show year 2 if needed , but it will a huge loss as the markets are really down due to coronavirus. Thanks for your advice !!

betelgeuse
Posts: 3490
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by betelgeuse » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:45 pm

FinlandGirl wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:01 pm
betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:32 pm
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:55 am
sorry for the multiple follow ups ..another one on source of funds..
I have invested a lot of my money in stocks/ fixed deposits etc, which are in my name..and which I would redeem to show in my application as proof of sufficient funds. The bank statement thus would have a lotttt of new entries of funds ..would that be a problem? I currently work and have a job , but 90% of my earnings I invested/saved in this form...
You could just use the stocks as assets directly.
Do you have any source that Migri accepts stocks instead of money?
"An alien’s means of support are considered secure at the time when the alien’s first residence permit is issued if the alien’s residence is financed through gainful employment, pursuit of a trade, pensions, property or income from other sources considered normal so that the alien cannot be expected to become dependent on social assistance referred to in the Act on Social Assistance (1412/1997) or on other similar benefit to secure his or her means of support. Social security benefits compensating for expenses are not regarded as such a benefit."

https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokse ... 101152.pdf
Last edited by betelgeuse on Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

betelgeuse
Posts: 3490
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by betelgeuse » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:55 pm

Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:01 pm
So , do you know how I say I want the permit for 1 yr vs two ? There's no place in the rp form to indicate that ...
For anything for which there is no specific place, it can be written in the additional information section.
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:01 pm
Also since my course is two years , won't migri ask what am I planning to do after year one ?
The law explicitly allows for shorter permits so they would have the burden of proof that you would not be following the rules.

FinlandGirl
Posts: 405
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:43 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by FinlandGirl » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:12 pm

betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:45 pm
FinlandGirl wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:01 pm
betelgeuse wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:32 pm


You could just use the stocks as assets directly.
Do you have any source that Migri accepts stocks instead of money?
"An alien’s means of support are considered secure at the time when the alien’s first residence permit is issued if the alien’s residence is financed through gainful employment, pursuit of a trade, pensions, property or income from other sources considered normal so that the alien cannot be expected to become dependent on social assistance
Such a broad reading would also imply that Migri is violating the law by not accepting sponsorship agreements from relatives - a monthly payment from the parents is a normal source of income for a student.

And I do not think Migri would be interested in making any guesses how much (if any) money can be made from selling shares in the future.

betelgeuse
Posts: 3490
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:24 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by betelgeuse » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:49 pm

FinlandGirl wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:12 pm
Such a broad reading would also imply that Migri is violating the law by not accepting sponsorship agreements from relatives - a monthly payment from the parents is a normal source of income for a student.
I assume this is because Finnish law does not consider such agreements to be legally binding by default.

https://www.opuslex.fi/artikkelit/kaupp ... ntajaansa/
FinlandGirl wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:12 pm
And I do not think Migri would be interested in making any guesses how much (if any) money can be made from selling shares in the future.
It's not fundamentally different from the variance in currency exchange rates.

Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:10 pm

this is super interesting...the current market value of my shares definitely covers the complete expenses multiple times over ( these are all public traded companies , liquid) . My only reluctance in selling them now is that I'd be selling them at a loss...However, the money will not be in my account if I show the share statements. That's my only concern as the instruction says the complete amount should be in your account..but that's only for living expenses.
Even that, I can manage ( living expenses for two years) . But to show upwards of ~30000 Euros as tuition fee on top of that is where I'm struggling. Who actually keeps that kinda money (~50000) euros in their account anyways!?

FinlandGirl
Posts: 405
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:43 am

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by FinlandGirl » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:33 pm

Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:10 pm
Who actually keeps that kinda money (~50000) euros in their account anyways!?
Interest rates in the Eurozone have been around 0% for a decade now, the only risk-free way to keep 50k available here is in a normal bank account.

Oopsidaisy
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:22 pm

Re: Rp and funds question

Post by Oopsidaisy » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:49 pm

FinlandGirl wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:33 pm
Oopsidaisy wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:10 pm
Who actually keeps that kinda money (~50000) euros in their account anyways!?
Interest rates in the Eurozone have been around 0% for a decade now, the only risk-free way to keep 50k available here is in a normal bank account.
makes sense, so do the banks guarantee this amount? Like, what if the bank goes bust?
in my country it is possible for banks to go bust, and then only a fraction of amount is guaranteed out of one's total savings, if that happens.

plus there are other attractive avenues to invest which offer like ~15% return, so generally we keep only around 1 year expense in bank account at a time , rest are fixed deposits/funds/stocks...which I was planning to take out annnnyway....until the unwelcome virus guest entered the scene !

Btw, do you think I need to show funds for the 2nd year tuition fee too, if for 2 year permit- or just paid tuition for 1 year and living for 2 ?


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