Digital Camera Goodness

Where to buy? Where can I find? How do I? Getting started.
dusty_bin
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Post by dusty_bin » Tue Oct 07, 2003 11:33 pm

Daft question but...

How BIG do you want the pictures to be?
I know that the idea of using the built in digital zoom, or cropping may be anathema, but you were after a good 'happy snappy' device.

I use a tiny Fuji F40i, with no optical zoom, there was not room. It has very good resolution for a two year old camera and can make decent A4 size (10*8) prints. It will stand up to some enlargement if you need to crop and of course for anything that you ever see on a monitor it is seriously ahead of the game. The thing is dicontinued, or I would recomend it to you, but it is seriously tiny, yet with a decent lens, which is more important IMHO than the final bit of resolution. The new crop of mini cameras offering 4-5 MPixels will allow more cropping without affecting resolution as far as the final picture is concerned.

I guess what I am saying is that a camera that responds quickly and allows sequence shooting as the Fuji range does, is probably more important than an optical zoom. In most cases given the wide/semiwide nature of the lenses fitted to these devices, what you are really doing is avoiding taking a step forwards or backwards. For portraits, almost none of them offer a sufficiently long 'long' end to offer decent modelling and not really enough to get close in detail landscapes. Why not go for a small, useable camera with a discreet appearance and good usability, rather than a more bulky unit that will not be used as much because of its size.

I have been a keen SLR user for GOD! almost a quarter century, yet my little Fuji is used much more than my SLR system or my rangefinder, simply because I always have it with me. The larger Nikons and Canons are technically more advanced, but I bet you will USE the little Canon, Fuji or Pentax machines more and yuo won't notice the lack of optical zoom, you just take the step backward or forward...



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Post by Guest » Wed Oct 08, 2003 5:57 am

The zoom would be for more specific topic photography. Think with that about for example nature photography.

PeterF
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Post by PeterF » Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:09 am

I have the Ixus 111..non digital version..it looks very like those in the photo/advert for the new.. "wait a couple of weeks".. probably same case size, mine is aluminium/silver..very small but full of features I like mine very much.. it is amost like a piece of Jewellery hanging around you neck on its metal chain... It has Zoom and Wide angle, multi mode flash and the abilty to add info for the APS auto processing such as Auto order extra prints of a particular shot.
By the way I was looking at Maippis mailing from Stockmans about crazy days they have several Digital camera on offer one Cannon Sure shot model is 285 €...reduced from close to 400€.
Last edited by PeterF on Wed Oct 08, 2003 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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neil
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Post by neil » Wed Oct 08, 2003 10:35 am

paulrenn wrote:Hi Arabella,

Do you still happen to have the battery charger for that Ixus? I have lost mine and am desperately looking for one!

Thanks,

Paul

Hi Paul,

Look on eBay for one. My mate lost his too and he paid about £30 for one from Canon in the UK. They were going for about a tenner on eBay and then you'll need a US to EU converter which is no problem to get at all.
Neil

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dusty_bin
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Post by dusty_bin » Wed Oct 08, 2003 11:08 am

Arno-

The point is that lenses on most compacts, especially digitals are wide angle to start with. When you have a three times zoom, for example, the effect is about the same as 28-80 on a 35mm camera. Ok for general shooting, not much use for portraiture, including candid portraits and not enough to pick out detail from a scene unless you are standing on top of your subject. When I was selling this kind of kit many years ago we always used to reckon that these zooms really did little more than save people's legs. For portraits you would normally choose a 100 - 135 type of prime lens, for landscape details something like 135 to 200 prime lens and for nature, animals etc where access is an issue 300mm and up.

Given todays resolution, if compactness is an issue, which it seems to be here, especially given its proposed primary use, then an optical zoom is probably not so important. Now, I also know that most people want a zoom of some kind, but the reality of what one NEEDS is often a little different. Now, an optical zoom that is then manually cropped or combined with a built in digital zoom (3x which can usually be done with OK results for prints at 5x7 gives equivalent to 240mm combined with a three times optical zoom) can give some quite extraordinary effects, but manual cropping in the computer tends to give better results than a digital zoom. I rarely use the built in zoom on my camera, prefering to use the whole frame for composing and then to crop for details later.

Whoops that was a long post for a little point...

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Post by Guest » Wed Oct 08, 2003 11:17 am

True, true... But that counts mainly for digicams. If you're using a 'normal' cam the functions of cropping and such are out of the question. Not until you get to a scanner with your slides or negatives or prints or whatever.
When I bought my camera the digicams were way out of my financial reach, but I still wanted the full range of 28-xx zoom. And since I didn't want to run around with a huge amount of lenses (28-80, 80-170/80-200, 170-300, 300-500), I got the 28-200, which covers the 'normal' options and the 170-500 zoom for the specials.

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Post by dusty_bin » Wed Oct 08, 2003 11:28 am

Don't forget, we are talking about digital cameras here! ;)

SOmewhat different constraints apply with SLRs, your choice of normal zoom lens covers the range that normal photographers use most of the time. A typical lens kit that I used to sell ?+#@ years ago typically would have a 28-80 zoom and an 80-200, plus the standard lens, because I got extra commission for selling one of those as well as the rest of the lenses. :) Really big zooms we sold fairly rarely because they were huge with a limited maximum aperture that usually meant that users had to tote a tripod. In most cases a single 400mm prime lens would do the job, any reframing done by cropping in the darkroom by the photofinisher.

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deojuvame
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Post by deojuvame » Wed Oct 08, 2003 1:52 pm

So verdict is... the Ixus 400 at VeikonKone!

It won because the prices of the compact flash memory and Canon acessories is more reasonable than the Sony set, and also the optics were a bit better from reviews that I've read.

I compared prices from a few different stores downtown. Stockmann's sale prices were still pretty high. The Rajala people weren't very nice, the guy acted like he had better stuff to do even though the store was empty :?, and it turns out they didn't stock any of the cameras I wanted to see anyways. (They didn't have the Sony DSC-P12, only had a display Canon 400, and didn't carry the 4500) but when I went to VeikonKone the girl who helped me really knew her stuff and could go into a lot of detail about the different advantages of each camera. And the prices were much better at VeikonKone too- and they let me pile employer discounts on top of that. Woot!

The battery's gotta charge for 18 hours, so I'll just sit patiently next to the outlet here...

Thanks for the advice everyone!

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deojuvame
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Post by deojuvame » Wed Oct 08, 2003 2:04 pm

But one minor drawback- the manual and all the software is in FINNISH! I COMPLETELY forgot that something like this was going to happen! Now I gotta fet my finnish up to speed enough to upload images and stuff to my computer... :?

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Post by Slothrop » Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:01 pm

arabella wrote:But one minor drawback- the manual and all the software is in FINNISH! I COMPLETELY forgot that something like this was going to happen! Now I gotta fet my finnish up to speed enough to upload images and stuff to my computer... :?
You sure they don't have it available on the Net in English in .pdf form - the manual I mean. First place you'd look I guess...so probably not...
"Passion is inversely proportional to the amount of real information available" (Benford's Law of Controversy)

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Post by dusty_bin » Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:23 pm

If you ask the shop, they will probably order one for you, I have become used to doing this. One day I will be charged...

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Post by PeterF » Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:23 pm

arabella wrote:But one minor drawback- the manual and all the software is in FINNISH! I COMPLETELY forgot that something like this was going to happen! Now I gotta fet my finnish up to speed enough to upload images and stuff to my computer... :?
Had the same problem with My Ixus 111..went to the Cannon service centre in Pitjänmäki...they had a box full of the English versions which they had removed and replaced with Finnish books.
By the way they told me that Stockmanns always insist that they are supplied with 10 spare copies of all manuals in English in case a foreign customer ask for one..
Go ask down stairs in Stockers..take your Finnish manual and do a swop.

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deojuvame
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Post by deojuvame » Wed Oct 08, 2003 4:33 pm

WLM wrote: You sure they don't have it available on the Net in English in .pdf form - the manual I mean. First place you'd look I guess...so probably not...
I actually didn't look there first thing, but I just checked and they don't have the manuals online at all.

So I guess I'm going to head downtown again tomorrow and fight myway through the hullut päivät shoppers, waving around a finnish manual... :ochesey:

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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Wed Oct 08, 2003 4:35 pm

And just don't tell them you bought it from Veikon Kone as then the Stockmann clerk will look you like a cheap sausage.
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.

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deojuvame
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Post by deojuvame » Wed Oct 08, 2003 4:41 pm

Actually I just found the coolest thing!

Amazon.com carries manuals of its electronics products! So I just put in Elph 400 (which is the same as the ixus) and now I can view the entire english manual. What a neat service!

If anyone wants to see:
http://images.amazon.com/media/i3d/01/M ... 000452.pdf


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