Banking Question - moving in October -help?

Where to buy? Where can I find? How do I? Getting started.
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eashton
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Post by eashton » Sat Aug 16, 2003 11:36 am

Caroline wrote: I think the reason is because the USA is overpopulated and has much more illegal immigration and public security/health threats, so the authorities screen resident aliens and newcomers much more thoroughly. Finland only has 7 inhabitants (?) per square mile (or was it kilometer?), and immigration has always been much more restricted. I've heard that it is relatively easy for employed, fluent Finnish-speaking resident aliens to acquire Finnish citizenship; I would guess that's because the government is trying to "fill up" the country.
You're joking, right? India with over 1 Billion people is overpopulated, the US with 8x the land mass and 1/4 of the population is not.

Actually, I think Finland is far, far more uptight about who they allow into the country and on what basis than the US, they just don't ask you if you're a @#$% Commie. The US will, by default, grant a green card to a spouse of an american, the Finns will not. I know someone, a Finn, whose spouse was not granted a visa. If anything, I think the Finns are desperately trying NOT to fill the country.

The US, in turn, gave visas to most of the terrorists on 9/11...two of whom Finland refused entrance to a while before that iirc. It's a lot easier to get into the US than Finland and most of the EU.



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Caroline
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Post by Caroline » Sat Aug 16, 2003 1:38 pm

eashton wrote:
Caroline wrote: I think the reason is because the USA is overpopulated and has much more illegal immigration and public security/health threats, so the authorities screen resident aliens and newcomers much more thoroughly. Finland only has 7 inhabitants (?) per square mile (or was it kilometer?), and immigration has always been much more restricted. I've heard that it is relatively easy for employed, fluent Finnish-speaking resident aliens to acquire Finnish citizenship; I would guess that's because the government is trying to "fill up" the country.
You're joking, right? India with over 1 Billion people is overpopulated, the US with 8x the land mass and 1/4 of the population is not.

Actually, I think Finland is far, far more uptight about who they allow into the country and on what basis than the US, they just don't ask you if you're a @#$% Commie. The US will, by default, grant a green card to a spouse of an american, the Finns will not. I know someone, a Finn, whose spouse was not granted a visa. If anything, I think the Finns are desperately trying NOT to fill the country.

The US, in turn, gave visas to most of the terrorists on 9/11...two of whom Finland refused entrance to a while before that iirc. It's a lot easier to get into the US than Finland and most of the EU.






I wasn't joking.....I simply didn't explain my opinion thoroughly enough.

I meant that, I think the USA has more red tape involved in the immigration process theoretically to restrict the number of newcomers, but it's also much easier to get away with doing things against the books if an individual knows how to play the system, so in actuality the immigration policies don't work. I've heard that the naturalization process is rather difficult in the USA.

On the other hand, Finland is much more restrictive towards who they allow to stay in the country and it's nearly impossible to do anything against the books, but once you get your "foot in the door"; it's quite easy to become a permanent resident, and to become naturalized. The Finnish government IS trying to populate the country because there is a labor shortage...the politicians talk about it often in the newspapers- encouraging people to have more kids and making immigration easier.
Former expat in Finland, now living in New Hampshire USA.

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eashton
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Post by eashton » Sat Aug 16, 2003 3:21 pm

Caroline wrote:I wasn't joking.....I simply didn't explain my opinion thoroughly enough.

I meant that, I think the USA has more red tape involved in the immigration process theoretically to restrict the number of newcomers, but it's also much easier to get away with doing things against the books if an individual knows how to play the system, so in actuality the immigration policies don't work. I've heard that the naturalization process is rather difficult in the USA.

On the other hand, Finland is much more restrictive towards who they allow to stay in the country and it's nearly impossible to do anything against the books, but once you get your "foot in the door"; it's quite easy to become a permanent resident, and to become naturalized. The Finnish government IS trying to populate the country because there is a labor shortage...the politicians talk about it often in the newspapers- encouraging people to have more kids and making immigration easier.
Actually, I got curious about world population density and found http://www.photius.com/wfb1999/rankings ... ity_2.html which looks interesting.

I knew a lot of guys in the IT industry back in the states who wound up getting married and staying in the US. The only difficulty in getting a green card this way is having to endure the paperwork and the regular interviews which ask what kind of sex you enjoy or how kinky it gets. If you hire someone who knows the system and the paperwork and can manage to stay married for 3 years, you're in like flint. However, I have heard that this has changed somewhat for those who are from countries that are 'on the list'.

It's funny that Finland is, indeed, looking to allow skilled people from other countries in at the same time most of the US IT sector is being 'off shored' to India and other parts of Asia. In most of the EU and the US, countries are going to face a population crisis due to too many old people vs. young people working to support them which will likely bring about radical change in the pension systems. The Economist frequently has articles on this coming crisis.

I don't know if it still exists, but Finland used to award medals to women who had more than 1 or 2 kids after WWII. I guess it's hard to convince educated, professional women that getting married and having babies is a patriotic duty. I recall reading in the Sanomat that 47% of Finnish households are single person dwellings so it's probably not a realistic goal in the short-term.

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Hank W.
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Post by Hank W. » Sat Aug 16, 2003 3:35 pm

The patriotic duty of any Finn is to pay taxes to support the likes of Lipponen and his 25 euro tax value van...
Last edited by Hank W. on Sat Aug 16, 2003 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Cheers, Hank W.
sitting here like a lemon looking for a gin.

Tom and Jerry

Post by Tom and Jerry » Sat Aug 16, 2003 3:57 pm

Caroline wrote:
eashton wrote:
Caroline wrote: I would guess that's because the government is trying to "fill up" the country.
You're joking, right?
Actually, I think Finland is far, far more uptight about who they allow into the country and on what basis than the US, they just don't ask you if you're a @#$% Commie. If anything, I think the Finns are desperately trying NOT to fill the country.

It's a lot easier to get into the US than Finland and most of the EU.
I wasn't joking..... The Finnish government IS trying to populate the country because there is a labor shortage...the politicians talk about it often in the newspapers- encouraging people to have more kids and making immigration easier.
The politicians talk about it in Finnish. The newspapers write about it in Finnish. That is a message meant for Finnish people. It cannot be translated in English. There are a lot of statements in the newspapers about this (like the one from prime minister Vanhanen), but that is different from a policy.

The only politics I know about is the 'aluepolitiikka'. Institutes and companies get subsidy if they built in a so-called II-luokka area. This is to prevent the depopulation in some areas.
Like Lapland lost 25 % of its polulation since 1989, Karelie also something like 20%.

Otherwise, there is no population strategy whatsoever in Finland. There is also no immigration strategy. Some rules were changed due to the EU in 1995, but that's it.

I think myself that the Finnish ulkomaalaisvirasto really don't care whether there are 5 million people in Finland or 1 million. As long as they have something to control and to rule.

rze
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visa to Finland

Post by rze » Tue Sep 02, 2003 11:16 am

Hi,
I am Hungarian and came here to marry a Finnish citizen in 2001. I applied for visa in Hungary as just a girlfriend and they have to give permission to live here on that basis if you are not a criminal or so. So I received the visa in 4 months. Although with that visa (B type) You cannot freely go to work. But still you can look for work by yourself, and if you find an offer you can apply for work permit which is given in shorter time. After you are married or lived together fro 2 years you can have permanent (A type) visa with which you have nearly the same rights as a Finnish citizen, only you cannot vote at elections and you will be treated as foreigner personally (not by every Finnish). But for example my husband does not look like a Finnish, so even if he is a Finnish citizen he is often treated as a foreigner just after his outlook. Of course officially this does not occur.
And: you can also apply for the first visa in Finland, if you stay here, but in that case you cannot leave Finland while your visa is not ready as your passport stays at Immigration office.
In the visa decision it is good to have some amount on a bank account and also helps a letter from your spouse that you would like to live together and he or she take care of you here in Finland, where you live together, how much is your salary, how do you know each other, how much time you have spent together, and so on.
But you find all info at:
http://www.uvi.fi/englanti/oleskelu.html
perhaps a bit more detailed at the Finnish page
So after half a year we got married here in Finland and I applied for A visa and received it in three weeks. (OK, I also had work at that timalready)
You do not need work permit for short time teaching or research work, for example.
The rule is then that you have to renew the A visa one more time a year later, and the one more year to get the permanent status, after that you do not need to contact immigrtaion office any more. Now I am applying for the first prolongation of my A visa, and it take about 3 months. So I do not have passport now. But if I tell them that I would like to travel abroad they do it more quickly.
It is really annoying sometimes what they ask of you, and how they talk to you, but not too bad, as I heard from my friend who married a US citizen, the process there was worse, and it took 8 month for them to get together in the US.
And I nearly forgot, the keyword is NOKIA. If you work there or your spouse, everything can happen in no time!
Sorry for my English, I hope it is still understandable.
Best wishes, Edina


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