This finnish language, why is it no one can master it???????

japwonj · Post by **japwonj** » Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:03 pm

Been browsing this forum and its like finnish is the hardest thing on the planet, for example someone stated that they had studied nursing at a Finnish institution for 3.5 years but still couldn't get a job because of language. Is this possible 3.5 yrs yet language is still a problem?? Someone needs to start Finnish for medical purposes and such like ideas. Cheers

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enk · Post by **enk** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:36 pm

Yeah, it's so hard that only 5 million + Finnish manage to master it

-enk

DMC · Post by **DMC** » Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:34 am

It is very odd. I find the language very difficult to learn, but I really don't know why. On the face of it Finnish should be one of the easiest languages to learn. It follows rules, there are few exceptions to the rules, there are no tones to worry about, things are always spoken as they are written and so on. Yet still I find it hard.

Manazir · Post by **Manazir** » Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:57 pm

For me, I find Finnish language very easy to learn and the language has some kind of 'charm' in it : ) ...... i never wanted to learn this language before, but when i started it, it got me really interested! So far, I learned many things including basic grammars n stuff, and still learning it. Hopefully, within next few months, I'm guessing i'll have a good knwledge in it, all u need is just some practise and try n remember the stuff

brahiam.correa · Post by **brahiam.correa** » Tue May 04, 2010 11:35 am

Well, there's still one good thing about finnish for me! As someone said previously, it's spoken as it's written. My language -spanish- as well.

irnbru · Post by **irnbru** » Tue May 04, 2010 2:20 pm

brahiam.correa wrote:Well, there's still one good thing about finnish for me! As someone said previously, it's spoken as it's written. My language -spanish- as well.

Chuckle

Mölkky-Fan · Post by **Mölkky-Fan** » Tue May 04, 2010 3:18 pm

The problem for me is that it is difficult to get started.

I learnt Dutch, as well as my mother tongue English, and that was quite simple. once you know the word for house, or horse or cat or whatever you can use it and hear it quite easily. You can quite quickly communicate, and then you are encouraged to continue to learn.

In Finnish you learn a noun, but then it can change so many times with his, her, on, to, from endings that it becomes difficult to firstly hear the original word and the time it takes me to think of not only the noun but then the endings and then how the endings effect the base word, well by that time the conversation is dead.

I think it is too easy to give up.

sinikala · Post by **sinikala** » Tue May 04, 2010 4:04 pm

brahiam.correa wrote:Well, there's still one good thing about finnish for me! As someone said previously, it's spoken as it's written. My language -spanish- as well.

Perhaps you mean it is pronounced as it is written?

Manazir · Post by **Manazir** » Tue May 04, 2010 8:12 pm

brahiam.correa wrote:Well, there's still one good thing about finnish for me! As someone said previously, it's spoken as it's written. My language -spanish- as well.

there are little exceptions to this :

- the 'y' in Finnish is pronounced as 'uu'
- the 'j' is pronounced as 'y' instead.

Rob A. · Post by **Rob A.** » Tue May 04, 2010 10:42 pm

Mölkky-Fan wrote:...and the time it takes me to think of not only the noun but then the endings and then how the endings effect the base word, well by that time the conversation is dead.

Yeah....and I still have that problem with French, as well....if the conversation gets at all "conceptual" or "slangy".... Unless the person is unusually patient or has for whatever reason become "enamoured" with me....

Mölkky-Fan wrote:I think it is too easy to give up.

....Besides simply practicising, and practising, and practising.....I think it helps to continually remind oneself to try to "think the Finnish way" and to try not to think that language has to follow a general I-E pattern to make sense....

One simple little example is this:

"Liisa on Pekkaa vanhempi"....v. Liisa on vanhempi kuin Pekka.....Apparently they are both equally acceptable....but the second version has a decided I-E flow to it and is instantly comprehensible...the other only "makes sense" if you force yourself to "think in the Finnish way"....and I still tend not to initially "see" the first version when I encounter it....

enk · Post by **enk** » Tue May 04, 2010 10:52 pm

Manazir wrote:
brahiam.correa wrote:Well, there's still one good thing about finnish for me! As someone said previously, it's spoken as it's written. My language -spanish- as well.
there are little exceptions to this :

- the 'y' in Finnish is pronounced as 'uu'
- the 'j' is pronounced as 'y' instead.

There are a heck of a lot of exceptions to that unless you want to go around speaking
Grammar Book or the latest dialect to appear on the maps: Foreigner Finnish.

Even Spanish has a bunch of exceptions when you get down to the nitty gritty. Where I
come from, -ll- is pronounced y ('j' in Finnish), but when I lived in Spain I got nothing
but grief for mispronouncing it in their opinion. The Argentinians got a lot of flack too
for the way they said yo and other similar words. Not to mention missing syllables
in Spanish ('pa') or other assorted things dropped out of words (nublao: hey, where'd
that d go! Los Estao Unio... heck now we're missing the d and the s!). But it's always
easy to make linguistic generalizations without really thinking about it.

-enk

raamv · Post by **raamv** » Fri May 07, 2010 11:03 pm

Many find it dificult cos they dont try to "speak" it...and "USE" it....
Learning a language is useless unless you know how to use it...!!! (in a good or bad way)....

Manazir · Post by **Manazir** » Sat May 08, 2010 10:06 am

raamv wrote:Many find it dificult cos they dont try to "speak" it...and "USE" it....
Learning a language is useless unless you know how to use it...!!! (in a good or bad way)....

second that

Brynne · Post by **Brynne** » Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:10 pm

If someone studied to be a nurse for 3,5 years in a Finnish institution, but still can't get a job because of the language, that just means they studied in English (which is possible in quite a few schools). I've been living in Finland now for about 2 years and 3 months, and I passed the ammattikorkeakoulu's Finnish test just recently. Learning Finnish just takes lots and lots of practice. That's why I waited to learn Finnish before going to school (as opposed to studying in English), because I know that by the time I get out of school and even way before then, I'll be speaking Finnish like any Finnish person. But if you don't practice on a daily basis, you'll never be able to speak it fluently. Even if you understand pretty well.

I've got a friend who studied International Business in a Finnish institute and has lived in Finland for 6 years or so, but can't get a job because of the language. The reason is because she didn't start dedicating her time to learning Finnish until just recently. I also knew a guy who was working in an English-speaking daycare and had lived in Finland for 6 years. He had picked up on a lot of single words, but couldn't really form sentences, except for simple phrases that you use a lot with kids, like "Go to the bathroom" and "Put your slippers on." But he just never really tried that hard because he didn't need to. He wanted to learn, but it wasn't a priority to him, so he was learning slowly.

My advice to anyone trying to learn Finnish, and who can afford to do so, is go to Finnish courses that are all day, 5 days a week. KELA will pay you for up to 3 years as an immigrant (though you don't have to be in Finnish language courses). That's not really possible for people who are already doing full-time jobs, but for those who aren't, I highly suggest doing that first. I remember when I was first planning to move to Finland I read someone's post saying they had been here for 10 years and were so so lonely and still hardly spoke a word of Finnish, and that scared me half to death!

It's actually kind of fun to learn, though, as long as you have some kind of teacher to make things seem more simple (even if it's just evening classes). I remember trying to learn new grammar rules from a book I have and the explanation was so confusing that I just couldn't get it in my head. We did the same thing in school a couple weeks later and the way the teacher presented it made it seem about 100 times simpler.

*Edit: Also, I didn't get into my first Finnish course till about 7 months after I moved (cause others had been waiting longer), so I would bet that if you get lucky enough to get in right away, you could be at my skill level in less than 2 years. Just trust yourself, work hard, and take every chance you get to practice!

Rob A. · Post by **Rob A.** » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:23 pm

Brynne wrote:....
*Edit: Also, I didn't get into my first Finnish course till about 7 months after I moved (cause others had been waiting longer), so I would bet that if you get lucky enough to get in right away, you could be at my skill level in less than 2 years. Just trust yourself, work hard, and take every chance you get to practice!

Yes....and in the meantime...just keep trying....just soak up the embarassment of not being able to speak properly...

I've just returned from several weeks in the French Alps and so had some interesting "experiences" trying to communicate in French....my French isn't that bad....but speaking it is still a real "bear"..... though it was getting easier and easier with each passing day. I think it's well worth remembering that while you, as a foreigner, are in a new "environment", most of the people you are going to be speaking with in a non-social context are just going about their daily "grunt" and have little interest in wasting time trying to communicate with you...

I remember one experience well.... buying tickets for a bus trip.... the guy behind the counter was a rather gruff, middle aged man.... I asked something like, " À quel quai pour le bus?", ="Which platform for the bus?"...in rather clumsy French, I would guess; the response was something like "Devant le bill....mumble, mumble, mumble"...with a loud, machine gun-like delivery....I guessed he was saying, "In front of the ticket office.", but I didn't dare ask for clarification.....

But I did notice his delivery style was exactly the same for anyone who asked him something, foreigners and native speakers alike....a man happy with his job, no doubt...

And another time, a request of a very nice old lady serving in a restaurant at the top of the Alpe d'Huez, for..."Poisson...pas de viande"... "Fish...not meat" ...resulted in far too much food...a beautiful, Salade au Saumon...["Salmon Salad"] AND Truite aux ...something...probably amandes...["Trout with Almonds"]....which, at first, I confusingly, and wrongly, thought had been intended for someone else... but before I could say anything further she took the dish away... I would have paid for the confusion, but didn't get the chance...and so I felt a bit bad about this... Oh well, so it goes.....

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