About elative and the word se

johnlarson · Post by **johnlarson** » Sat Jun 19, 2010 6:49 pm

If I want to say "He is unhappy...Is it because of his wife?" in Finnish, could I say "Näytä hän on surkea...Se on hänen vaimosta?" ?

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Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:08 pm

Of course you could say, but do you want to say: Show me he sucks, it came out of his wife?

Hän näyttää surkealta, johtuuko se hänen vaimostaan? johtua, derives, is the "phrase word" used for something being caused by something. The word order in the first phrase is crucial, as surkea means unhappy but also worthless... maybe like feeling worthless, but if something sucks and blows chunks thats surkea as well. Tämä kakku on ihan surkea. So thats one of those tricky words, a bit like he is sorry vs. he is a sorry ass...

johnlarson · Post by **johnlarson** » Sat Jun 19, 2010 8:11 pm

So why is it vaimostaan, instead of vaimosta?

laa · Post by **laa** » Sun Jun 20, 2010 1:53 pm

johnlarson wrote:So why is it vaimostaan, instead of vaimosta?

Possessive suffix

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Sun Jun 20, 2010 1:58 pm

Well, it needs the possessive if you use "his" and here the "his" is used to emphasise his wife instead of say my wife or a wife (which would most naturally be his). Colloquially though you do drop the ending, so as to why - so the teacher won't whack your knuckles for the grammar abuse.

johnlarson · Post by **johnlarson** » Mon Jun 21, 2010 2:16 am

Oh, okay. Dude, thank you so much.

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:06 pm

Finnish is a language you have to learn the rules to break them

Otseli · Post by **Otseli** » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:59 am

He is unhappy...Is it because of his wife?

I came to think other possible options to say that. This versions is more difficult (and thus such a important thing to andvanced), but commonly used in, for instance, in literature.

Liekö hän apea vaimonsa takia/tähden? If you put it this way, you can understand the sentence in two ways. Something may have happened to her which makes the husband feel sad either something has made the poor fellow sad and you wonder if this "something" is due to her.

JimmyBang · Post by **JimmyBang** » Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:48 pm

hän ei ole illoinen, onks hän vaimo koska? i know its really bad, but i have a very hard time NOT translating straight across

kalmisto · Post by **kalmisto** » Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:10 pm

The Google translator almost gets it right :
http://translate.google.com/#en|fi|He%2 ... %20wife%3F

kalmisto · Post by **kalmisto** » Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:17 pm

JimmyBang wrote:hän ei ole illoinen, onks hän vaimo koska? i know its really bad, but i have a very hard time NOT translating straight across

because is "koska" in Finnish but "because of" is not "koska".

Is it because of me ? = Johtuuko se minusta ?

Did you do it because of me ? = Teitkö sen minun vuokseni ?

"Sinun silmiesi tähden" ( Because of your eyes ) :

"sinun silmiesi tähden laulan laulun kauneimman, sinun silmiesi tähden taivaan tähdet tavoitan" ( Because of your eyes I will sing the most beautiful song of all, because of your eyes I will reach the stars in the sky )

( A less literal but much better translation would be "To praise the beauty of your eyes I will sing ....." because that is of course what the song text means. )

"tähden" and "vuoksi" both mean "because of".

Why is "tähden" used and not "vuoksi" ? The word "tähden" is more poetic and therefore it fits perfectly in the song text. "Sinun silmiesi vuoksi" would be too clinical and in a song like that it would sound silly.

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:33 pm

JimmyBang wrote:hän ei ole illoinen, onks hän vaimo koska? i know its really bad, but i have a very hard time NOT translating straight across

he isn't happy, is he the wife? I think thats not straight

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