Bad news for international students(tuition fees fr masters)

[mumbi]

And Cory I havent complained about paying.I will if they start charging.People underestimate foreigners.We were told about possibilities of fees before coming and we still came coz we know what we want and we are ready for anything. Read what I write carefully before throwing words around.

[kimster46]

its funny many non-FIN's ( some are non EU ) have strong opinion against free education to people from Non EU .Finland offered Free education on Merit, so several people came here , done / doing studies ...and i believe who came here, were on merit ....
Now FI want to be one among the crowd , so only people who capable of paying those will come here and do there studies ...no big deal .... but i am bit sad about the people who were planning to study over here in coming years

[pierrot]

@Cory, next time we need you to tell us why your forefathers killed aborigins to pave the way for your self-proclaimed whitish Canada and not emphasize on other blah blah.
You don't even see the cost incurred by taxpayers for Finnish troops in Afghanistan.

And how exactly is the history of Canada related to Finnish education system or this topic?

[Pursuivant]

Now FI want to be one among the crowd , so only people who capable of paying those will come here and do there studies

And you imagine they'll drop the entrance examinations and lower the standards?

[Pursuivant]

Your mind is closed and your attitude will give you depression in the long run

.
Your mind is so open your brains fell onto the floor. Do you know how much it costs to educate one degree student? Average is about 50K. Thats money the taxpayers are paying and you have think you have some right to talk about attitude, you should say "thank you" instead.

[Pursuivant]

I came here because Finland has the best education in Europe and statistics show that.This is a longterm investment and if I can get the best with minumum costs then why not take the chance.

So why should *we* be paying for it?

[sammy]

And Cory I havent complained about paying.I will if they start charging.People underestimate foreigners.We were told about possibilities of fees before coming and we still came coz we know what we want and we are ready for anything. Read what I write carefully before throwing words around.

If you'd actually carefully read the original bit about tuition fees, you might have noticed that fees will not be charged from those who "have started [their] studies in the Master’s programme in question before the introduction of tuition fees" - so no bad news for you eh?

A few words in general...

As always, there's so much hot air in the discussion when money is at stake, because ultimately we're all selfish b@stards who think only of our own precious self Anyway, if you look at the tuition fees issue more closely, before succumbing to total mental disarray and panic you may actually note several things that have not yet been highlighted in this thread:

a) not ALL Master's programmes will charge a fee
b) those that will, are obliged by law to offer scholarship options (which, I presume, will be based on merit and the financial background of the student - gifted non-EU students from poor countries may thus have an opportunity for a Master's scholarship.)
c) it's a trial period, and no-one knows yet whether tuition fees will be charged after it's over in 2014...

Another thing is, the government has rather shoved the responsibility of organising these non-EU Master's tuition fees (as well as the actual amount of the annual fee and the required institutional scholarships) to the higher education institutions themselves - so different universities may have different policies, scholarship systems and timetables in this issue. Therefore if anyone's REALLY interested about the details of this issue - turn to the university of your choice and ask what their policies are regarding tuition fees...

[rinso]

a) not ALL Master's programmes will charge a fee
b) those that will, are obliged by law to offer scholarship options (which, I presume, will be based on merit and the financial background of the student - gifted non-EU students from poor countries may thus have an opportunity for a Master's scholarship.)
c) it's a trial period, and no-one knows yet whether tuition fees will be charged after it's over in 2014...

It shows that they consider changing a policy and that they are careful about it.

Since education becomes more and more expensive all over the world, it is important to spend the money wisely.
Tuition fees will form a threshold against gold diggers and the scholarship system will help the ones that really need it.
Since education is not free in most countries, Finland has to adept otherwise the Finnish taxpayer will finance an ever growing group of foreign students.

[sammy]

It's also partly a question of the recent university reform... and actually, I'd presume the Min of Ed has also kept an eye on what the dear neighbours across the Western Shores have been thinking...

Tuition at higher education institutions in Sweden is free of charge. This means that all Swedish students and students from the EU/EEA are educated free of charge, as well as students from outside this area.

This situation is currently under review by the Government and a decision is expected shortly. The likely outcome is that tuition fees will be introduced for students from outside the EU/EEA from the autumn term of 2011.

http://www.hsv.se/highereducationinswed ... 02436.html

[sammy]

Tuition is likely a drop in the bucket for one person in the grand scheme things. Maybe a couple extra thousand per year added to their educational budget? Does anyone know what the range of proposed tuition charges are going to be, btw?

The previous time the fee question was brought into public discussion (in 2005) - see this piece of old news - tuition fees were suggested to be "between EUR 3,500 and EUR 12,000" per year ...

However, this was several years ago (=a different government) and AFAIK the reformed university legislation does not actually specify how much these fees could be under the current scheme... I'd suppose this has also been left for the individual institutions to decide. Anyway I had a quick peek at some of the university Master's that have been "given permission" to partake in this trial period, none of the Master's programme pages I visited yet showed any info on forthcoming tuition fees. But then again, according to the Min of Ed listings, the universities aren't supposed to start collecting tuition fees until 2011... so perhaps they're still undecided / working on it...

Some UAS Master's are also partaking in this trial period of tuition fees. Some of them have already introduced fees for 2010-2011. See e.g. this programme at Haaga-Helia ... 3750 euro per semester.

A scholarship scheme which covers the tuition fee for the second semester will be introduced. The scholarship will be meant for non EU or non EEA students who show good results in their studies during the first semester. Further details will be announced later.

...one example of how the scholarship scheme may be arranged. Again, note that the above is just one example. In other UAS's/universities/programmes - it can be different. You have to ask the institutions!

For example, the University of Helsinki is not partaking in the tuition fee trial at all (bar three programmes which are Erasmus Mundus Master's so they're a different ballgame altogether - hefty scholarships available from the Mundus scheme to start with...)

[seja]

As a foreigner who benefited from getting my Master's for free from Finland, I am very grateful for the system here. I felt that the education that I received was better than the one I received during my first degree in the states. And for those of you wondering, I graduated, I do work a full-time job in my field, and I do pay taxes.

I believe that tuition fees are a good thing, but they need to be treated correctly. I have seen many overseas students come here, never to attend classes or go to exams, yet they just go an work. These people have taken the places of other applicants who would have greatly benefited from such a system. I think that if tuition fees are charged, it will deter abusers of the system from coming in the first place and allow only those who have the right intentions to come. But my idea isn't that simple. Many foreigners do intend on making a home in Finland, working and paying into the system. My belief is that the fees paid should be refundable for those who stay in Finland after graduating AND pay taxes into the system. For example, a €2500 per year tax credit can be given, up to the total amount paid for tuition, for those foreigners who stay in Finland and work. This will help to keep the educated immigrants, encourage people to work, along with helping to alleviate the notion that many Finns have, that once foreigners are charged tuition they will be next. Since they are all tax payers, they can be excused from the system.

What about those student who can't afford to come in the first place? That is what scholarships are for.

[MC Deli]

I don't think playing the colonial guilt card is really going to resonate with the Finns. If anything Finns should be encouraged to get on the ferry and bleed those Swedes' generous public funds dry in return for years of forced oppression and the trauma of perceived inferiority.

[EP]

If anything Finns should be encouraged to get on the ferry and bleed those Swedes' generous public funds dry in return for years of forced oppression and the trauma of perceived inferiority.

Make it 600 years.

"Slussenin sissit" (Slussen´s guerillas) made a good try in 1960´s. Mostly they were war veterans – who like so many war veterans even today – could not find their place anymore. Sweden had welfare, Finland didn´t.

[sammy]

What about those student who can't afford to come in the first place? That is what scholarships are for.

Well, yes - let's face it - there are hordes of bright and potentially successful students "out there", who could not -even if they are/were provided a completely free education- come to study in Finland just because they can not afford to live here, can not afford to travel here, can not even afford the visa / residence permit costs.

I know it sounds harsh, but... no matter how right your intentions, no matter how badly you need it... sometimes you just have to accept that if you can't afford something, then you can't have it

My belief is that the fees paid should be refundable for those who stay in Finland after graduating AND pay taxes into the system.

Actually, the Norwegians have a system which operates a bit like that for students from developing countries - the Quota scheme - http://lanekassen.no/Toppmeny/Languages ... ta-Scheme/ - but in fact it goes so that if the student who has been given a loan returns to his/her home country and becomes resident there, can have the debt completely cancelled! (I'd suppose this is because the Quota scheme targets to prevent "brain drain" from the poorer countries... rather than attract these students to stay in Norway - if they do the latter, it's ok but they need to repay the loan).

Then again, Norway is not easily comparable to Finland (or to Sweden for that matter). They eat wadges of cash for breakfast instead of Weetabix

[Pursuivant]

Swedes' generous public funds dry

We have, apparently http://www.iltalehti.fi/uutiset/2010080 ... 3_uu.shtml