In middle-schools- creationism or evolution in sciences?

[CH]

*and* with the creationists' theory in science classes?

Whaaaaaaaat???????

Is it in law that both must be put forth?

NO!!!!! (I assume you are talking about Finland and not some backwater place like... um... apparently Tennessee.)

I sense there is some issue behind these questions. Is there some teacher that is trying to teach creationism and is claiming something??? The only place creationism has any stand is in a religion class (and even then not taught as it actually being science). Otherwise the person should point out where exactly in the national curriculum creationism is found.

[Rosamunda]

http://www.oph.fi/english/sources_of_in ... _education

Science is science: Part III chapter 7.7; 7.8 and 7.9

The fuzzy stuff is in Part IV chapter 7.11 and 7.12

(and there are some updates in http://www.oph.fi/download/132551_amend ... cation.pdf )

The curriculum is presented by subject and then by grade within each subject. It only stipulates what the students should have accomplished by the end of that subject/grade in order to score an 8. It doesn't say how it should be taught (that's up to the teachers). I have no idea what happens in schools where there are, for example, large numbers of Laestadians, but presumably the kids follow the same curriculum as everyone else, at least while they are inside the classroom.

[Rip]

Creationist "theory" was thought as well, in the suitably named classes ("religion").

[CH]

I have no idea what happens in schools where there are, for example, large numbers of Laestadians, but presumably the kids follow the same curriculum as everyone else, at least while they are inside the classroom.

Ahh, yeah true, I didn't think of the bible belt here in Finland. I wouldn't swear on what is happening in those schools, I've heard enough of stories from people who were the few non-Laestadians in schools to believe anything.

Also, like said previously, creationism and even intelligent design could be brought up at a religion class, but as even the religion classes are now supposed to be taught as "ei tunnustuksellinen" (yeah, right... sure...) it shouldn't be taught as something that is a fact but as something that some people believe in. Flat earth would also be something that could be taught about here.

[Pursuivant]

Jebus only rides dinosaurs in schools in Tennessee, in Finland science is science.

Besides which - "everybody knows" that the World was created from the Seven Eggs the Goldeneye laid on the bosom of the Air Maiden !

[Pursuivant]

And that was taught in Literature class btw

[jahasjahas]

Also, like said previously, creationism and even intelligent design could be brought up at a religion class, but as even the religion classes are now supposed to be taught as "ei tunnustuksellinen" (yeah, right... sure...) it shouldn't be taught as something that is a fact but as something that some people believe in. Flat earth would also be something that could be taught about here.

The word you're looking for is "non-confessional". Of course, there are bound to be RE teachers here and there who let their beliefs get the best of them, but hopefully parents know to complain in such situations.

I don't remember anything related to creationism and/or evolution being actively discussed in my RE classes. We must have gone through Genesis at some point, but I mostly remember Jesus stuff from ala-aste. The only obviously religious RE teacher I had was a RE / philosophy teacher who taught me on my first philosophy course in lukio. We were assigned to discuss several ethical problems, one of which was "beating carpets during Sunday mass"*. She made it very clear that it's wrong

(EDIT:*Outside your house, not in the church, that is.)

[Jukka Aho]

I don't remember anything related to creationism and/or evolution being actively discussed in my RE classes. We must have gone through Genesis at some point, but I mostly remember Jesus stuff from ala-aste. The only obviously religious RE teacher I had was a RE / philosophy teacher who taught me on my first philosophy course in lukio. We were assigned to discuss several ethical problems, one of which was "beating carpets during Sunday mass"*. She made it very clear that it's wrong :evil:

Our RE teacher warned us against ever trying spiritualism (the Ouija board.) He had played with that thing with his pals and, according to his story, felt the presence of something really sinister and evil which had made him very upset and nervous for a long time thereafter. Or so he told us. On the other hand, he also told us a story about reading porn mags in a barn in his youth. I no longer recall what his point was telling us about that.

(Not trying to make you feel concerned about the state or content of Finnish RE, or anything!)

[Jukka Aho]

I had read about the new law passed in Tennessee and it got me to thinking about how the more religious of science teachers here deal with science curriculum and whether the curriculum keeps religion inside the religion classes.

At least I never had any teacher (outside the RE classes) who would have even tried to pit religious beliefs against scientific theories or present alternative theories to the scientific ones. This was back in the 1980s and early 1990s, but I have no reason to believe things would have gotten any more religious since then. On the contrary, schools seem to be toning down the religious practices that used to feature as part of everyday school life.

[Upphew]

I had read about the new law passed in Tennessee and it got me to thinking about how the more religious of science teachers here deal with science curriculum and whether the curriculum keeps religion inside the religion classes.

At least I never had any teacher (outside the RE classes) who would have even tried to pit religious beliefs against scientific theories or present alternative theories to the scientific ones. This was back in the 1980s and early 1990s, but I have no reason to believe things would have gotten any more religious since then. On the contrary, schools seem to be toning down the religious practices that used to feature as part of everyday school life.

Ylä-aste or lukio and s/he would be laughed out of classroom. Or would have been during my time, 90s that is. We did have one overly religious teacher of religion, but she spent half the year in the psychiatric wards...

[CH]

Our RE teacher warned us against ever trying spiritualism (the Ouija board.)

I think this at least was pretty common. I got warnings about not doing any spiritualism as it was black magic both in school during the religion class and in a confirmation class. Took me years before I suddenly realized that they are by that saying that magic actually exists. Hmm... and that would deter kids exactly how from being curious and trying it out? My1st & 2nd grade teacher said that men have one rib bone less (not true) due to how humans were created, so that would be teaching creationism... but again, it was during a religion class and the very same teacher did also teach about evolution during another class without mentioning creationism in any way. So... RE can mean a lot of mumbo jumbo being taught, depending on the teacher, but I guess that goes with the territory.