Siwa clerk sells beer after 10pm right in front of vartija?

[justaguy]

I went to my local Siwa today. Been living in this area for over a year and probably been to this particular Siwa over 100 times.

So as I walked in I noticed one particularly 'spurgu' looking guy talking to the vartija in a very secretive manner in the back corner of the store. I figured that the 'guy' was just wasting the vartija's time with some nonsense talk.
I picked up what I needed quickly and went to the cashier where I was met with a myyjä I had never once seen before in the entire time that I have visited this store, so I figured she was just a fill-in.

I turn to my right and see that the spurgu dude and his spurgu friend are carrying in a somewhat 'concealing manner' some bottles of 'Koff' beer. I said to my friend "It's 10 past 10 what are these guys thinking?" and I looked over their shoulder to double check that the Siwa employees had indeed locked up the alcohol section.. or well.. almost. The metal grate wasn't locked to the floor like normal, it was only partially pulled down.

So I'm standing there about to pay, in front of these guys as I'm watching them put what looks like 10 to 12 bottles of @#$% Koff beer to buy at 10:10pm and I watch the Myyjä just scan the bottles without asking for any ID. I can see from the computer screen behind her that it is indeed after 10pm and I double checked my watch at the same time. So I ask the vartija who is now standing next to the exit door parallel to the checkout "How are they buying alcohol past 10pm?"

The vartija just looks up at the ceiling and blatantly ignores me! So I ask again, louder this time "Hey it's past 10pm I thought you couldn't sell alcohol to people after 9pm" and he's still looking at the ceiling ignoring me whilst I'm standing literally 2 feet from this guy! At the same moment the cashier is starting to look paranoid and she mumbles something to the vartija that I couldn't hear to which he (still looking at the ceiling) simply says "Mmm".

So...

What the hell did I just witness? Some sprugu dude quietly asks the vartija if he will overlook him and his alcoholic mate buying a couple of beers well after 9pm? To which he AND the cashier actually comply?
Unless I am mistaken this is quite against the law and such an offence could/should warrant BOTH people losing their jobs, and the right to work in either of those positions in the future.

Unfortunately I didn't get a picture of the ordeal happening, but my friend was a witness and there were at least 2 other people walking into the store who may have seen what was going on.

Maybe I am mistaken about the law in speicfics and am making a fuss about nothing, but the manner in which this whole thing went down seemed super suspicious and last time I checked (which was 10 minutes ago) the law still states that the times for selling alcohol are from klo 9-21, after which they must be securely locked away from the public.

Anyway, what should I do about this? Should I inform Siwa? Would they even do anything, would it even be worth the trouble? Could they even tell from the cash register or something showing proof that they sold the alcohol past 21:00? I saw the woman scan the items, is there some sort of electronic record in the machine?

Thanks.

[rinso]

I would inform Siwa. They could loose their license over such incidents so they will take action.

[Beep_Boop]

Meh. I think it's a silly law anyway.
Just forget what you saw and continue your day. There's no benefit for you or society if you tell on them.

[FinnGuyHelsinki]

All the transactions of the cashier system are recorded, including the person who was operating it. It's your own decision what you do or if anything, the result may be that the cashier, possibly also the security guard (sometimes they are employees of the same store), will get fired. For the store it really is a serious matter, as already said, they could lose their alcohol license for a certain period if caught (by the officials) selling outside the regulated hours.

[Karhunkoski]

Laws (whether people agree with them or not) are there for a reason. Could also be that there is some low-level corruption/bribery here too (maybe they slipped the guard a tenner to look the other way). Bribery isn't good for society, it's the thin end of the wedge. Give the devil you little finger and he'll take the whole hand.

As a responsible citizen, you should report this, both to the police and to Siwa head office. My only question is why you haven't done this already.

[betelgeuse]

As a responsible citizen, you should report this, both to the police and to Siwa head office. My only question is why you haven't done this already.

Indeed one should do a crime report online to the police since this classifies as "alcohol crime":

https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/ ... 39001#L50a

There won't be any penalty since the cops didn't see it happen but yeah, I'd still be calling SIWA corporate.

This is !"#¤%. A police witnessing a crime is no requirement for penalty. The combination of cashier records and a witness should be enough for a judge.

[masao]

Well, if I were you and what you have told us were true, I, too, would write to
Siwa head office and mention that if an action were not taken, I would write to Helsingin Sanomat readers' opinion page.
I am sure that Siwa will respond to you quickly.

The cashier and the guardman should be replaced.

t, masao

[Londonchris]

Maybe best keep that to yourself, you might just want some beer after 10pm one day....

[rinso]

Maybe best keep that to yourself, you might just want some beer after 10pm one day....

If the shop loses its license you'll see no beer at all.

[Londonchris]

Maybe best keep that to yourself, you might just want some beer after 10pm one day....

If the shop loses its license you'll see no beer at all.

Quite, that would be a disaster!
You don`t want to go spoiling the local store & upsetting the wrong people..what exactly are you gaining by whistleblowing?

By all means be a law abiding citizen, but for goodness sake use your brain abit.

[Upphew]

You're correct it is the law. They can't even scan/sell that at 9.01 if he has been in the queue half an hour. But it's not the vartija's problem it's the cashier's. Did you get a name? There won't be any penalty since the cops didn't see it happen but yeah, I'd still be calling SIWA corporate.

No. The store can't let people take beer after the 21 cutoff. But if you get your dachshund before that, they can sell it to you.
"Jos myyntipaikka suljetaan kello 21, ennen tätä liikkeeseen sisään tulleille asiakkaille voidaan myydä myös alkoholijuomia.

Jos liike saa jatkaa aukioloa vielä kello 21:n jälkeen, tulee mahdollisuus alkoholijuomien haltuunottoon lopettaa kello 21. Alkoholijuomien myyntiä ei saa aloittaa ennen kello yhdeksää."
http://www.sttv.fi/alkoholi/alkomyyov.htm

[Marsh04]

I would report it not because I'm against selling the beer after a certain time but because of chances of corruption involved. Corruption is a cancer must be treated at the earliest possible stages.

If the time ends at 22 then the person might have picked them before ten .

[justaguy]

Laws (whether people agree with them or not) are there for a reason. Could also be that there is some low-level corruption/bribery here too (maybe they slipped the guard a tenner to look the other way). Bribery isn't good for society, it's the thin end of the wedge. Give the devil you little finger and he'll take the whole hand.

As a responsible citizen, you should report this, both to the police and to Siwa head office. My only question is why you haven't done this already.

I agree 100% but the reason I didn't already report it, is because 1. It only just happened last night and 2. because I wasn't sure if it was against the law and if I was making a big deal out of it. 3. I figured even for a few minutes that it could have been daylight savings that day and that I hadn't adjusted my clock. i.e. I wanted to give both the cashier and the varija the benefit of the doubt. Lastly my friend hasn't lived here too long and he said that maybe they changed the law. But I didn't think that was the case. I checked on my phone afterwards and it turns out that the law hasn't just 'changed overnight'. I did say something to the vartija twice but he totally ignored me to my face and I figured that either I was in way over my head or that I was mistaken and there wasn't any law/problem. What was I supposed to do? Demand something?

I do want to report this because the way that it happened was totally unprofessional and highly suspicious and that's no exaggeration. I could understand maybe even a little if the vartija was a friend of the two guys or if the cashier was but it looked pretty obvious that they were just 2 alcoholics in the middle of getting wasted and they had run out of booze and it was past 9pm so they couldn't buy any more. I go to that Siwa really often and there's usually a really nice old lady who's behind the counter who's been working there for at least over a year (ever since I started visiting the store). I had never seen this younger early 20s woman in my life who sold the beer after 10pm.

How should I report this? Do I actually have to physically walk into a police station and file a criminal report or something, or can I just email Siwa directly and tell them what I saw and ask them to check the cash register history past 10pm on August 6th to see that I am telling the proof. Some people here seem to think that because I didn't call the cops or get evidence that there's no point in doing anything. I also thought the same too which is why I wanted to ask for a bit more info on the matter.

Maybe best keep that to yourself, you might just want some beer after 10pm one day....

If the shop loses its license you'll see no beer at all.

Quite, that would be a disaster!
You don`t want to go spoiling the local store & upsetting the wrong people..what exactly are you gaining by whistleblowing?

By all means be a law abiding citizen, but for goodness sake use your brain abit.

Are you @#$% serious? I made this thread for SERIOUS responses, not utter horsesh!t replies. I couldn't care less if the store loses its right to sell alcohol if they want to allow 2 people in a position of authority to sell alcoholics some booze after 10pm so they can pass out at 3am. Besides I am moving in a month anyway and I somewhat doubt that the store will lose its license in favour of firing the 2 people who didn't follow proper conduct.

Anyway I want to report this, so what's the easiest way to do that? Do I have to go to the cops directly, or can I just inform Siwa and perhaps threaten them a little with going to Hesari, if they don't take it seriously?

[rinso]

Anyway I want to report this, so what's the easiest way to do that? Do I have to go to the cops directly, or can I just inform Siwa and perhaps threaten them a little with going to Hesari, if they don't take it seriously?

I would write to Siwa head office and ask for a feed back on their action. Don't threaten them, it will make your story weaker (personal vendetta?). If they don't respond you can inform the police (copy of your mail) and Hesari.
Don't expect that the people will be fired. It's still a minor offense and it happened once (as far as can be proven). They probably get a warning and can't do evening shifts anymore.

[Rip]

I'd contact SIWA (Suomen Lähikauppa Oy) first too. (BTW, my belief is that the guard did not do anything wrong. He was not the one doing selling, nor did he have the authority over person at the cashier desk (I doubt he was employed by the same company, but rather had uniform of some guard company, right?). )

If the reply you get is not satisfactory, police should do, though I would have probably picked the 'Aluehallintovirasto' ( https://www.avi.fi/web/avi/vahittaismyy ... cWSgPm2EuC ).

While criminal sanctions for these kind of things must be possible, I think they are rare. AVI is the authority that distributes licenses to sell alcohol, and can also take them away.