Applying for Citizenship 2024

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oct.2023.RU.IT
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:21 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by oct.2023.RU.IT » Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:26 am

aurinkokukka wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2024 7:36 pm
Huh so I had the interview tuesday, wednesday was 8 057 people before me, yesterday 8036 and today 5609..how did it drop so much.
What is your Diary number?
All Diary numbers that has Queue number 8036 on 21.02 are 16***/310/2023, and I don't see any of them become 5609 on 22.02.

I have some Kamu chatbot data save, not all of that.


27 y.o female, C++ developer

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

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another_one
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2023 9:37 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by another_one » Fri Feb 23, 2024 12:44 pm

jcsmartin wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 1:50 am
I have one question to the forum, has anyone heard anyone granted citizenship while abroad? I am travelling quite frequently due to my work and I’m wondering what happens if they grant you the citizenship abroad and cancel your residence permit. How is the way back to Finland, through embassy?
Yes, the rule is to notify Migri if you travel abroad, especially on long trips.
While you are abroad they will not grant you citizenship. Or at least they try not to do that.

I heard about cases where people were abroad and did not notify Migri about it and Migri sent those people a message like "According to our data you are abroad, please notify us when you return to Finland". I would assume that it is possible to get such a message if Migri knows that you are abroad and if they start processing your application.
After they returned to Finland and sent a notification to Migri about that, their application was processed in a few weeks.

I remember that someone in this forum told that they were granted the citizenship while they were abroad and those people returned back to Finland using residence permit without any problems. AFAIK, at this point you are already a Finnish citizen and Finland can not deny your entry to the country.

TUserFin
Posts: 131
Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2023 6:59 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by TUserFin » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:03 pm

This morning one person from Finnish YKI Test 2021 facebook group scared me, as he found something in the new law which says that it should be applied to pending applications, also several people looked engaged in the direction of his view. Upon further invesitation, it looks like he is wrong, but I don't engage in Facebook to answer, sorry. Here is my answer

What he was saying is this

"According to the Citizenship law draft/proposal, the new law will affect pending applications, if it is passed in this way.
Tämä laki tulee voimaan päivänä kuuta 20 . Tämän lain voimaan tullessa vireillä olevaan kansalaisuushakemukseen sovelletaan tämän lain voimaan tullessa voimassa olleita 13 §:n 1 momentin 2 kohtaa, 14 §:n 1 momentin 3 kohtaa, 15, 16, 18, 18 a, 20 ja 22 §:ää, 23 §:n 2 momenttia ja 24 §:n 3 momenttia.
https://api.hankeikkuna.fi/asiakirjat/9 ... 6m267xY5Ic"

Asked ChaptGPT to translate this
"When this law enters into force, the provisions of Section 13(1) paragraph 2, Section 14(1) paragraph 3, Sections 15, 16, 18, 18a, 20, and 22, Section 23(2), and Section 24(3) at the time of entry into force of this law shall apply to pending citizenship applications."


and asked ChaptGPT translate this to simpler English
The text states that when the new law comes into effect, certain sections of the previous law will be applied to pending citizenship applications. So, even though there's a new law in place, it's specifying that certain provisions from the old law will still be used for processing applications that were already in progress when the new law took effect

I haven't studies this secions in details, but the law still has this statement as well
"Tässä esityk-
sessä ehdotettuja muutoksia on siten perusteltua soveltaa niihin hakemuksiin, jotka tehdään
tässä esityksessä ehdotettujen muutosten tultua voimaan."

which means pending applications will not be affected. so, if someone has time to study it... but right now it doesn't look like pending applications will be affected.

TUserFin
Posts: 131
Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2023 6:59 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by TUserFin » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:25 pm

Ah, one more ChatGPT try

There is a new law coming, tell me what this says in Finnish, will the change apply to people in process who applied for a citizenship already?

Tämän lain voimaan tullessa vireillä olevaan kansalaisuushakemukseen sovelletaan tämän
lain voimaan tullessa voimassa olleita 13 §:n 1 momentin 2 kohtaa, 14 §:n 1 momentin 3 kohtaa,
15, 16, 18, 18 a, 20 ja 22 §:ää, 23 §:n 2 momenttia ja 24 §:n 3 momenttia.

ChatGPT
"When this law enters into force, the pending citizenship application shall be subject to the provisions of sections 13(1)(2), 14(1)(3), 15, 16, 18, 18a, 20, and 22, subsection 2 of section 23, and subsection 3 of section 24, as they were in force at the time this law enters into force."


The text in Finnish translates to:

"When this law enters into force, the pending citizenship application shall be subject to the provisions of sections 13(1)(2), 14(1)(3), 15, 16, 18, 18a, 20, and 22, subsection 2 of section 23, and subsection 3 of section 24, as they were in force at the time this law enters into force."

This means that for individuals with pending citizenship applications, the law that will be applied to their case is the one in effect at the time the new law comes into force. So, if there are changes in the law regarding citizenship applications, those changes would not apply retroactively to applications that were already in process before the new law took effect.

aurinkokukka
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:08 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by aurinkokukka » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:27 pm

oct.2023.RU.IT wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:26 am
aurinkokukka wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2024 7:36 pm
Huh so I had the interview tuesday, wednesday was 8 057 people before me, yesterday 8036 and today 5609..how did it drop so much.
What is your Diary number?
All Diary numbers that has Queue number 8036 on 21.02 are 16***/310/2023, and I don't see any of them become 5609 on 22.02.

I have some Kamu chatbot data save, not all of that.
Nooo I was too hopeful haha It dropped but not by so much. I mistakingly left one number out in the beginning.

aurinkokukka
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:08 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by aurinkokukka » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:30 pm

jcsmartin wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 1:50 am
aurinkokukka wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2024 7:36 pm
Huh so I had the interview tuesday, wednesday was 8 057 people before me, yesterday 8036 and today 5609..how did it drop so much.
is there anyone else in your family who applied before? This happens usually when they combine applications with family members.

I noticed my queue number has been dropping much faster than previous months during february. dropped almost 700 in 4 weeks, which is about 1.5 faster than the normal speed. The sweet spot on 5000’s seems to have increased to around 5500 as well.

I have one question to the forum, has anyone heard anyone granted citizenship while abroad? I am travelling quite frequently due to my work and I’m wondering what happens if they grant you the citizenship abroad and cancel your residence permit. How is the way back to Finland, through embassy?

I know some people said that we must notify migri when we are travelling but what if they just give the decision? I’m just thinking the worst scenario.
No, it was just a mistake on my part. I missed the first number in the case number.
My husband is Finnish and my son has triple citizenship from birth (1 from dad, 2 from me), so only I applied.

From their website, you need to inform them youre travelling and they cant grand a positive decision while youre youre abroad.

aurinkokukka
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:08 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by aurinkokukka » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:45 pm

TUserFin wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:03 pm
This morning one person from Finnish YKI Test 2021 facebook group scared me, as he found something in the new law which says that it should be applied to pending applications, also several people looked engaged in the direction of his view. Upon further invesitation, it looks like he is wrong, but I don't engage in Facebook to answer, sorry. Here is my answer

What he was saying is this

"According to the Citizenship law draft/proposal, the new law will affect pending applications, if it is passed in this way.
Tämä laki tulee voimaan päivänä kuuta 20 . Tämän lain voimaan tullessa vireillä olevaan kansalaisuushakemukseen sovelletaan tämän lain voimaan tullessa voimassa olleita 13 §:n 1 momentin 2 kohtaa, 14 §:n 1 momentin 3 kohtaa, 15, 16, 18, 18 a, 20 ja 22 §:ää, 23 §:n 2 momenttia ja 24 §:n 3 momenttia.
https://api.hankeikkuna.fi/asiakirjat/9 ... 6m267xY5Ic"

Asked ChaptGPT to translate this
"When this law enters into force, the provisions of Section 13(1) paragraph 2, Section 14(1) paragraph 3, Sections 15, 16, 18, 18a, 20, and 22, Section 23(2), and Section 24(3) at the time of entry into force of this law shall apply to pending citizenship applications."


and asked ChaptGPT translate this to simpler English
The text states that when the new law comes into effect, certain sections of the previous law will be applied to pending citizenship applications. So, even though there's a new law in place, it's specifying that certain provisions from the old law will still be used for processing applications that were already in progress when the new law took effect

I haven't studies this secions in details, but the law still has this statement as well
"Tässä esityk-
sessä ehdotettuja muutoksia on siten perusteltua soveltaa niihin hakemuksiin, jotka tehdään
tässä esityksessä ehdotettujen muutosten tultua voimaan."

which means pending applications will not be affected. so, if someone has time to study it... but right now it doesn't look like pending applications will be affected.

We will see what happens, as last time they did enforce the new law retroactively on the pending applications.
So, hard to say what will happen.
The first part of the new law (residence) should probably come into effect before the summer or during summer.

TUserFin
Posts: 131
Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2023 6:59 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by TUserFin » Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:58 pm

aurinkokukka wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:45 pm

We will see what happens, as last time they did enforce the new law retroactively on the pending applications.
So, hard to say what will happen.
The first part of the new law (residence) should probably come into effect before the summer or during summer.

Hi. This is not true. Last time they changed law in 2011 and it was advantageous to applicants in queue

Here how it was in 2011

The Act will be applied as of 1 September to all applications, including pending ones
The new Act will be applied as of 1 September 2011 to all applications, even those that were filed before the Act entered into force
However, the good character requirement and language skills requirement in the previous version of the Act shall be applied if they are more advantageous for the applicant.


https://migri.fi/-/finnish-nationality- ... ember-2011

aurinkokukka
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:08 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by aurinkokukka » Fri Feb 23, 2024 4:16 pm

TUserFin wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:58 pm
aurinkokukka wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 2:45 pm

We will see what happens, as last time they did enforce the new law retroactively on the pending applications.
So, hard to say what will happen.
The first part of the new law (residence) should probably come into effect before the summer or during summer.

Hi. This is not true. Last time they changed law in 2011 and it was advantageous to applicants in queue

Here how it was in 2011

The Act will be applied as of 1 September to all applications, including pending ones
The new Act will be applied as of 1 September 2011 to all applications, even those that were filed before the Act entered into force
However, the good character requirement and language skills requirement in the previous version of the Act shall be applied if they are more advantageous for the applicant.


https://migri.fi/-/finnish-nationality- ... ember-2011
Yes, well, that means that they did enforce the new law onto the pending applications. Last time it was good, this time will be much worse if they decide to do so. Ive already submitted paper work all the way back to 2015 but not the vacation (that I only informed until I think 2017), so will have to add those missing days (not that i was much abroad).

About the criminal records, etc, do they also check from abroad, or just FInland? It doesnt matter in my case as I dont have anything, but asking cause its additional time for checking. I know that they get from Slovenia automatically but from Serbia will be a different matter (as not in EU) so wondering if I should tell my brother to take the statement for me there and get it translated already to speed up the process.

applicant2024
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2024 9:21 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by applicant2024 » Fri Feb 23, 2024 7:46 pm

that's what I asked 2 weeks ago that if the new law affects on the old pending applications and someone had explained that it according to what it i s written in the proposal it won't be applies ( page 22 or 23 on Forum ): Kansalaisuushakemusten käsittelyajat
vaihtelevat muutamista kuukausista yli kahteen vuoteen. Ehdotettujen muutosten tullessa voi-
maan on siten vireillä sellaisia kansalaisuushakemuksia, joiden tekijät ovat jättäneet hakemuk-
sensa siksi, että he ovat arvioineet täyttävänsä edellytykset voimassa olevien kansalaisuuslain
säännösten ja Maahanmuuttoviraston verkkosivuilla olevien tietojen perusteella. Tässä esityk-
sessä ehdotettuja muutoksia on siten perusteltua soveltaa niihin hakemuksiin, jotka tehdään
tässä esityksessä ehdotettujen muutosten tultua voimaan.

I hope it is true! otherwise it is so unfair. I do really hope that someone who has more information with a good knowledge of Finnish language confirms it! Though nothing has been approved yet, no one knows what's going to but I just know it doesn't make any sense if someone has applied for citizenship already after 4 years according to the current law and then they change it and say your case has been canceled, go and return after 5 years! I hope they are reasonable authorities behind this!

aurinkokukka
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:08 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by aurinkokukka » Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:18 pm

applicant2024 wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2024 7:46 pm
that's what I asked 2 weeks ago that if the new law affects on the old pending applications and someone had explained that it according to what it i s written in the proposal it won't be applies ( page 22 or 23 on Forum ): Kansalaisuushakemusten käsittelyajat
vaihtelevat muutamista kuukausista yli kahteen vuoteen. Ehdotettujen muutosten tullessa voi-
maan on siten vireillä sellaisia kansalaisuushakemuksia, joiden tekijät ovat jättäneet hakemuk-
sensa siksi, että he ovat arvioineet täyttävänsä edellytykset voimassa olevien kansalaisuuslain
säännösten ja Maahanmuuttoviraston verkkosivuilla olevien tietojen perusteella. Tässä esityk-
sessä ehdotettuja muutoksia on siten perusteltua soveltaa niihin hakemuksiin, jotka tehdään
tässä esityksessä ehdotettujen muutosten tultua voimaan.

I hope it is true! otherwise it is so unfair. I do really hope that someone who has more information with a good knowledge of Finnish language confirms it! Though nothing has been approved yet, no one knows what's going to but I just know it doesn't make any sense if someone has applied for citizenship already after 4 years according to the current law and then they change it and say your case has been canceled, go and return after 5 years! I hope they are reasonable authorities behind this!
I hope so too, as the biggest problem for most people will be meeting the salary requirements since they will set it pretty high I bet in order to avoid immigration (or just have highly educated engineers and such).

quillcentaur
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:00 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by quillcentaur » Fri Feb 23, 2024 9:59 pm

The person in yki group already deleted his post because many pointed out to him, including native finns, that his interpretation was wrong. The new drafted bill that he shared will not affect people who submitted application and already met the requirements of old law.

Anyway everything is a draft at the moment so no one really knows for sure. We will know what they debate and pass as a law at some point.

just_passing_by
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:44 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by just_passing_by » Sat Feb 24, 2024 9:38 am

Latest stats:
Total processed: ~121
Total processed with queue number > 4000: ~79
Processing median: ~10608/310/2023
New applications created: ~139

Migri is less productive this week. Last week they processed ~190 applications in total.

Image

mamutti
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2023 2:22 pm

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by mamutti » Sat Feb 24, 2024 1:42 pm

just_passing_by wrote:
Sat Feb 24, 2024 9:38 am
Latest stats:
Total processed: ~121
Total processed with queue number > 4000: ~79
Processing median: ~10608/310/2023
New applications created: ~139

Migri is less productive this week. Last week they processed ~190 applications in total.

Image
Hi! I would love to know, what kind of tool do you use to collect this data? Just out of curiosity, I would love to know 😀

just_passing_by
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:44 am

Re: Applying for Citizenship 2024

Post by just_passing_by » Sat Feb 24, 2024 6:51 pm

mamutti wrote:
Sat Feb 24, 2024 1:42 pm
Hi! I would love to know, what kind of tool do you use to collect this data? Just out of curiosity, I would love to know 😀
Any modern programming language will suit for collecting the data


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