K-Mart and Prices

[Hank W.]

Well, I have to say after being able to compare Finland to London and California

How about comparing equal places.Why do people always compare us to some megacities? Compare with Greenland, Iceland, Alaska. Some place with equal population density. Finding "stuff" in Anchorage for example. Not to some city that has the population ten times the whole goddamn country. The amount of merchandise is a fraction of that in more densely populated areas, so demand and supply maths alone make some items quite more expensive than others. Especially specially imported luxury items

[raamv]

Well, I have to say after being able to compare Finland to London and California

How about comparing equal places.Why do people always compare us to some megacities? Compare with Greenland, Iceland, Alaska. Some place with equal population density. Finding "stuff" in Anchorage for example. Not to some city that has the population ten times the whole goddamn country. The amount of merchandise is a fraction of that in more densely populated areas, so demand and supply maths alone make some items quite more expensive than others. Especially specially imported luxury items

The problem is that places like those that you mention and more in the genre of comparison ( e.g. Paris, Texas, ) DONT bother to carry any other items that are alien to the local population..they live happily in the 16th century..while the cities progress to the 22nd..

[Marié]

How about comparing equal places.

I don't see how the fact that London or California have a much higher population would make my point less valid, since the point is that finding certain foods that do not have a high demand (such as may be the case for many foreign foods in Finland or Fenno-Scandinavian foods abroad), can be difficult even in places where you might expect to find them more easily, such as London or California, with their large and diverse populations. So why wouldn't foreign foods be difficult to come by and expensive in Finland with its small population and very low number of immigrants. I mean finding, say, Indian food at a reasonable price in every store in London is hardly surprising considering there are quite a lot of Indian immigrants in the UK and many non-Indian people like Indian food too. It has therefore become a high demand food. However, finding rye bread in London or California can be quite a bit more difficult - and expensive. Although I don't disagree with you that the selection of foreign foods is often quite small or the prices are quite high in Finland, low demand products are not likely to be dead-cheap anywhere.

[superiorinferior]

None of the regular supermarkets stocked any organic food at all.

I beg to differ, but having read what you wrote below, I can understand how you got this impression about the US.

But the only decent meal I had in Florida 2006 was the couscous royale I ordered in the Moroccan pavillion at Disney. I was very disappointed. Good food is not cheap. Bad food is very cheap... too cheap. No wonder half the population of Florida is clinically obese. Good, healthy food is beyond the financial means of most people.

I wouldn't go around advertising your shock at being unable to find an organic carrot at Walt Disney World (who would go to Disney for healthy anything? In the real world of the US there are farmers markets and cooperatives and large sections of supermarkets are set aside for organic foodstuffs. http://www.wholefoodsmarket.com is the world's largest whole foods retailer in the world, with more than 265 locations in North America and the United Kingdom. Whole Foods employs 54,000 people (nearly as many as Nokia )

Additionally, the organic produce in the States is plentiful, broad in variety and not wilting and bruised like it so often is in the tiny Finnish version of "luomu" sections.

Even Walart has gotten into the organics racket http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnf ... 9_6971.htm , to the chagrin of more than a few organic farmers.

This subject about the arbitrary pricing schemes in Finland has been pounded into the ground. To deny that KKKK stores are among the most expensive out there is just denial of math figures. There is no reasonable reason for a body of water the size that separates Tallinn and Helsinki to raise mayo by five-fold. Kesko has had a long, fun, rich ride but eventually their cartel will be brought down by the EU (I hope).

[Hank W.]

My rant is about the BLOODY KESKO company! And I damned well not alone. They take every opportunity to screw people to the wall with prices.

Ah yes, theyre quite the rip-off centre.

Look what happened to Bauhaus - great prices to start, similar to rest of Europe. They noticed K-Rauta only burped in reaction and within 6 months Bauhaus had 'Finnish' prices.

Honestly, I still cannot fathom who buys anything from K-rauta. Its one of those places you buy stuff with "daddys money".

On the other hand Estonia's reaction to 'opening up' has been fantastic. In jusy 17 years Tallinn offers tremendous variety and the choice of restaurants, IMO, far surpasses Helsinki.

So does the amount of beggars.

[Hank W.]

Kesko has had a long, fun, rich ride but eventually their cartel will be brought down by the EU (I hope).

Well that was what we thought in 1995...

[Hank W.]

S-group is made up of co-ops, so you "buy in" into the co-op to get the membership card.

[CH]

Saw a 200 ml jar of Wishbone Spritzer dressing in K for 6,39!!!!!! That is $9.40 or £4.75. Simply Outrageous!

You know, you would make a much better point if you didn't take something that is a very niche market here as an example. The Spritzer was on the "US/UK Ethnic Foods" shelf, right? Or that's at least where I saw it in Iso Omena Citymarket. So, it's probably imported in small lots (not by Kesko), and sold in small lots, so it's going to be expensive. It's not there for the big masses but for home sick expats and people who have been abroad and want some specific stuff they enjoyed there. So you pay for the service. Same for the Hellman's Mayo. It's not like most Finns here even know what it is or want to even try it out. To me it tastes more like a sallad dressing, while those used to Hellman's (or generally US mayos) seem to complain about the Finnish mayo.

If you want to compla... compare prices in Finland vs abroad, pick something that is sold here in large quantities too. Like a kilo of flour, eggs, potatoes, well heck even something like a Mars bar (although they might perhaps be of different sizes). I wonder what you have to pay for Mämmi in the US...

[karen]

I wonder what you have to pay for Mämmi in the US...

Pay for mämmi? I'll bet they couldn't give it away.

[ajdias]

If you want to compla... compare prices in Finland vs abroad, pick something that is sold here in large quantities too.

Or something that is sold for 5 euros in Hakaniemi and almost 15 at CM Sello. There's an old thread on the subject on this board...

[raamv]

S-group is made up of co-ops, so you "buy in" into the co-op to get the membership card.

That was in Kekkoslovakia times... Now They have transformed ( and trasnferred the S Kortti ) into a Bank!!!
The S korti is now a Bank card also!!

[Rosamunda]

Of course we could go back to the basic Finnish diet - turnips, potatoes, beets - and see what the price is. Bah!

Which, let's face it, is what this is all about.

It doesn't make sense to import Hellmann's mayo, or melons, or butternut squash when Finland has an abundant supply of local ingredients, sufficient for a well-balanced diet. What is the carbon footprint of a jar of Hellmann's? Anyway most Finns prefer the taste of rapeseed oil (to genetically modified soyabean oil, which is used to make Hellmann's mayo).

I don't understand your problem with the price of imported food. Just eat local produce. The likes of Kesko must be laughing their heads off, "Ha ha ha! There are people out there now who are willing to pay 6€ for a jar of majo "

PS: You sound like dustybin.

[Hank W.]

Maybe you are aware but this is REALLY how the Finnish license office (lisenssivirasto) operated in the 70's.

Of course. You don't need luxus-luxus imported products if there is turun sinappi.

Which brings us to the catch-22. Why would anyone import Hellmans mayonnaise IF THERE IS NOBODY BUYING IT? Of course I could claim the Estonians buy anything as they didn't even have mayonnaise coupons 17 years ago - but there is a fact of life. If you go to Estonia they sell about a dozen varieties of mayonnaise. Mayonnaise is ubiquitous in Estonian cuisine. So of course Hellmann's is sold in Tallinn like beer - AS PEOPLE BUY MAYONNAISE.

One big obstacle of finding Hellmann's anywhere else than imported luxus-luxus specialities is a fact of life - FINNISH CUISINE DOES NOT USE MAYONNAISE. Look at salad dressings in the two countries? Estonia=thick white gunk; Finland = thin oily gunk.

Same thing with smetana - why is smetyana in 200g and 500g bags in Estonia costing a dime, while they're in 2,5 dl jars in Finland? SALES VOLUME. Estonians have every dish with hapukoor (almost). Finns don't use it except in certain dishes and even then very little. Hence - marginal interest product = expensive.

[Rosamunda]

"It doesn't make sense to import Hellmann's mayo, or melons, or butternut squash when Finland has an abundant supply of local ingredients, sufficient for a well-balanced diet."

Maybe you are aware but this is REALLY how the Finnish license office (lisenssivirasto) operated in the 70's. And have PLENTY of personal experience with it.

There are plenty of countries in Europe where "foreign" food ingredients are not popular. Ever bought Dutch cheese in France? I happen to believe that a REAL West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (from Somerset, England) is one of the world's best cheeses. But it is not generally sold in French supermarkets (except maybe in ex-pat enclaves in the Dordogne), and if you can find it, it is hugely over-priced. The French eat French cheese and the Italians drink Italian wine and the Finns prefer Finnish cucumbers, Oltermanni and drink Finnish beer. Which is fine. I was gob-smacked in the UK at Xmas when I saw the huge amounts of imported food for sale in the supermarkets. Apples from New Zealand.... in Somerset!!!! Criminal.

I don't have a problem with price premiums on imported food.

[Hank W.]

I'm still a bit puzzled over New Zealand onions sold in Pirkka bags. But atleast compared to the 1970's - there is a lot more than just onions as "winter fruits" these days.