English test for admission

Useful advice relating to undergraduate and postgraduate studying. Find information on admission, study permits, universities, polytechnics, courses and student life in Finland
User avatar
rinso
Posts: 3949
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 7:22 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by rinso » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:47 pm

The finnish Government should try and include other countries in this their narrow list
Why?
It means more checking of standards, value of certificates, levels of fraud and corruption.
When people have an adequate education in English, they can do the test and show the results.



Re: English test for admission

Sponsor:

Finland Forum Ad-O-Matic
 

User avatar
Pursuivant
Posts: 15089
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:51 am
Location: Bath & Wells

Re: English test for admission

Post by Pursuivant » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:10 pm

everyone from Nigeria as in other West African Country colonised by the britons like Ghana send us nice 419 spam oil millions letters. however we have not been sent any 419 spam letters from countries like Great Britain, Ireland, the United States, Canada, Australia or New Zealand. we get oil from Russia. maybe Sweden is interested in oil.
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."

User avatar
Rabs
Posts: 424
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:56 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by Rabs » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:20 pm

kalusam wrote: Well, personally i think the English test is just a way of scaring people away from applying....
that's true, it does scare people without adequate english and that's the purpose my friend.
Here in Nigeria as in other West African Country colonised by the britons like Ghana, English is the means of Education tution from Nursery to primary,seconadry and even at the University level..
it can be a valid argument for lobbying nigeria into an elite club such as Great Britain, Ireland, the United States, Canada, Australia or New Zealand etc. as an english speaking country.
The big question is that how many people who are citizens of the above countries apply for study in finland ?
well... finland tries to attract eligible students irrespective of their countries, i think so.
The finnish Government should try and include other countries in this their narrow list ...
valid arguments are wanting ! that's for sure

sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by sammy » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:55 am

kalusam wrote:Here in Nigeria as in other West African Country colonised by the britons like Ghana, English is the means of Education tution from Nursery to primary,seconadry and even at the University level, even if you are been taught a language Course like Yoruba, Ibo or Hausa, you will be tutored in English first before you are familiarized with the Language.
That may be true, but despite this the fact seems to be that not all prospective students from Nigeria know English even half as well as you do. And while "knowing English" does not as such make anyone a better human being, or a more intelligent one, it is very important for the UAS's to make sure that their future students have adequate language skills.

As for why other ways of showing language proficiency than IELTS & TOEFL are not currently accepted (like the GCE O-level in English for example), I'm guessing that it is because of the combination of reasons rinso already mentioned - and sad & inconvenient as it is from the point of view of honest applicants (IELTS & TOEFL do not come for free), the fraud issue is a really big one. In an ideal world of course it would be nice if someone who has completed his/her secondary e. in English in any country could just shove the said certificate into the application, but I have a hunch that in the real world there are some Real Bad Experiences of misplaced trust.

If it's any consolation to you, coming from a "true" English-speaking country won't in itself save anyone's a$$ - even if you apply from the UK and know how to correctly spell RHODODENDRON you can still be quite thick :D

zam
Posts: 609
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:35 am

Re: English test for admission

Post by zam » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:12 am

It's true that both IELTS and TOEFL cost money, so does the Finnish National Certificate of Language Proficiency, too. And in a matter of fact, Finnish matriculation examination is not entirely free of charge, either...
On the other hand, if you cannot afford the language test that will anyway cost way below 200USD, how could you afford to financially support your studies in Finland? The immigration authorities will require a proof of adequate funding (500 EUR/month, 6000 EUR/year).

Rosamunda
Posts: 10650
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2004 12:07 am

Re: English test for admission

Post by Rosamunda » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:58 am

And there are countries where although English may be an effective vehicular language (for example in some African and Asian countries where there are multiple other languages and dialects spoken) not so many people are able to write it fluently and accurately. I have tested students who speak at almost native English speaker level, but have done really badly in the writing and reading comprehension tests. Speaking good English is important but, for a student, being able to write extended essays in good academic style is crucial. That is why most universities specify they want the IELTS academic English score (not general English).

By the way, I thought only people my age had GCE O levels? Nowadays isn't it GCSE or IGCSE ?

sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by sammy » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:32 am

penelope wrote:By the way, I thought only people my age had GCE O levels? Nowadays isn't it GCSE or IGCSE ?
The GCE O-levels were mentioned on the Swedish page provided earlier on... https://www.studera.nu/studera/1672.html

Based on some Unesco info...
The Senior School Certificate is awarded after three years of senior secondary education. It replaced the West African GCE "O" level in 1989.
I believe it's mentioned at Studera.nu just in case there are older applicants who hold those certificates. But current school leavers would hold the SSCE/WASSCE it seems.

kalusam
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:21 pm
Contact:

Re: English test for admission

Post by kalusam » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:45 pm

Pursuivant wrote:everyone from Nigeria as in other West African Country colonised by the britons like Ghana send us nice 419 spam oil millions letters. however we have not been sent any 419 spam letters from countries like Great Britain, Ireland, the United States, Canada, Australia or New Zealand. we get oil from Russia. maybe Sweden is interested in oil.
Well sir,to be more frank there are still other bad people in these countries mentioned above, their are russian hackers hacking into Online bank accounts of people, i have been a victim once, my egold account was hacked by a russian. I was swindled also by a Swiss FOREX broker in my Live forex trading account, to say the least the problem is just tht people tend to easily pick on Nigerians when they commit crime,but the fact is that without the help of some of other Nationals of other countries, Sitting the example of the case where it was discovered that a Nigerian forged different documents for other People to enter finland,it was also dicovered that some Finnish Nationals (This time, not just Nigerians/Ghaninians or Africans) were also linked to this Scam,so tell me are not also Finnish Citizens Scammers.
Iam not in anyway supporting Scam but the fact is that Scam,419, and other internet crime is bad and the Goverment of Nigeria through The ECONOMIC and FINANCIAL CRIMES COMMISSION,EFCC is stamping this Cyber crime/Fraud gradually. But it is a balant falsehood that everyone in Nigeria is a Fraudster, we have graet men in Nigerai that have made the world a better place We have someone like Philip Emeagwali from the same part of Nigeria with me, he is termed today as the father of the internet you and i are using today.
Confirm from http://www.emeagwali.com/
He is just one of the examples of intelligent Nigerains, anyway they say that Gold does not have a hidding place so if a Nigeria commits something Bad he is termed to be the Devil, yet there are people who from other Nationals mostly in the Americas or Europe that commit such crime and its is termed a "Mistake".
Well everyone reading this should know that there are indeed more than 140 Million Nigerians living in Nigeria and there are still good and honest Nigerians who will not think of Scam or forgery, Nigeraians are really brilliant and talented People and they are the Best anywhere they are, if you doubt go to all the Schools in Finalnd with Nigerains who know the reason why they came to Finalnd and you will see that they do better than other Nationals.
Finally sir, i expect you should give an apology to all Nigerians/ Africans by callling everyone from Nigeria, Ghana or Africa Spammer or Scammers.
Cheers :D
You can never be made inferior without your consent.
Iam proudly Nigerian.

kalusam
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:21 pm
Contact:

Re: English test for admission

Post by kalusam » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:50 pm

Pursuivant wrote:everyone from Nigeria as in other West African Country colonised by the britons like Ghana send us nice 419 spam oil millions letters. however we have not been sent any 419 spam letters from countries like Great Britain, Ireland, the United States, Canada, Australia or New Zealand. we get oil from Russia. maybe Sweden is interested in oil.
Well sir,to be more frank there are still other bad people in these countries mentioned above, their are russian hackers hacking into Online bank accounts of people, i have been a victim once, my egold account was hacked by a russian. I was swindled also by a Swiss FOREX broker in my Live forex trading account, to say the least the problem is just that people tend to easily pick on Nigerians when they commit crime,but the fact is that without the help of some of other Nationals of other countries, Sitting the example of the case where it was discovered that a Nigerian forged different documents for other People to enter finland,it was also dicovered that some Finnish Nationals (This time, not just Nigerians/Ghaninians or Africans) were also linked to this Scam,so tell me are not also Finnish Citizens Scammers.
Iam not in anyway supporting Scam but the fact is that Scam,419, and other internet crime is bad and the Goverment of Nigeria through The ECONOMIC and FINANCIAL CRIMES COMMISSION,EFCC is stamping this Cyber crime/Fraud gradually. But it is a balant falsehood that everyone in Nigeria is a Fraudster, we have great men in Nigeria that have made the world a better place We have someone like Philip Emeagwali from the same part of Nigeria with me, he is termed today as the father of the internet you and i are using today.
Confirm from http://www.emeagwali.com/
He is just one of the examples of intelligent Nigerians, anyway they say that Gold does not have a hidding place so if a Nigeria commits something Bad he is termed to be the Devil, yet there are people who from other Nationals mostly in the Americas or Europe that commit such crime and its is termed a "Mistake".
Well everyone reading this should know that there are indeed more than 140 Million Nigerians living in Nigeria and there are still good and honest Nigerians who will not think of Scam or forgery, Nigerians are really brilliant and talented People and they are the Best anywhere they are, if you doubt go to all the Schools in Finalnd with Nigerains who know the reason why they came to Finalnd and you will see that they do better than other Nationals.
Finally sir, i expect you should give an apology to all Nigerians/ Africans by callling everyone from Nigeria, Ghana or Africa Spammer or Scammers.
Cheers :D
You can never be made inferior without your consent.
Iam proudly Nigerian.

Upphew
Posts: 10748
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:55 pm
Location: Lappeenranta

Re: English test for admission

Post by Upphew » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:02 pm

Father of the internet... He seems to be "father of the internet" like Linus Torvalds is father of the UNIX... as in not at all.
http://google.com http://translate.google.com http://urbandictionary.com
Visa is for visiting, Residence Permit for residing.

User avatar
Pursuivant
Posts: 15089
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:51 am
Location: Bath & Wells

Re: English test for admission

Post by Pursuivant » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:21 pm

kalusam wrote:Nigerians are really brilliant and talented People and they are the Best anywhere they are, if you doubt go to all the Schools in Finalnd with Nigerains who know the reason why they came to Finalnd and you will see that they do better than other Nationals.
yes we know
http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Suspec ... 5238336262
they get longer jail sentence
kalusam wrote: Finally sir, i expect you should give an apology to all Nigerians/ Africans by callling everyone from Nigeria, Ghana or Africa Spammer or Scammers.
they need to apologize first for they have lost their honor and insulted my intelligence by sending me their spam
Last edited by Pursuivant on Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."

sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by sammy » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:38 pm

kalusam wrote:we have great men in Nigeria that have made the world a better place We have someone like Philip Emeagwali from the same part of Nigeria with me, he is termed today as the father of the internet you and i are using today.
Albert Einstein was born in Germany wasn't he, so that proves they're all honest geniuses. Eh? :)
kalusam wrote:everyone reading this should know that there are indeed more than 140 Million Nigerians living in Nigeria and there are still good and honest Nigerians who will not think of Scam or forgery
Honestly I don't think anyone objects to that. But like it or not - your word on this issue, or what any single applicant him/herself believes or says just simply is not enough, that is why we have the "official" requirements, with entrance exams, language testing and all.

kalusam
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:21 pm
Contact:

Re: English test for admission

Post by kalusam » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:47 pm

Pursuivant wrote: you apologize first for you have no honor.
Well if there is anyone who should apologize here that person is you how can you be in finland or God knows where and conclude totally that all Nigerians are Fraudsters. I can also conclude that the seven Finns quoted in the article you referenced above that conspired with this Nigerians are seven greedy fraudsters who due to the money involved about a paltry 3,500 - 4,500 euros decided to betray their Country in order to sign Invitation Letters when they knew that those Nigerians forged those papers, that brings us to the big Question : Are finns really honest as they are shown in this forum? Lets face reality everyone has a tendency of greed both Nigerains, finns and other Nationals alike, aside from that the Nigerian scammers only succeded because they had those Finns who were their conspirators if the Finns informed the police then the Nigerians will have been arrested long time ago.Now the Nigerians recieves long Jail terms while the real criminals the finns who gave the Nigerians the morale to act because without them the letters of Invitations would have been signed will recieve less jail terms. I really smell a rat here, even the finnish authority are fraudulent and corrupt.
cheers :lol:
You can never be made inferior without your consent.
Iam proudly Nigerian.

sammy
Posts: 7313
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:38 pm

Re: English test for admission

Post by sammy » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:12 pm

kalusam wrote:I can also conclude that the seven Finns quoted in the article you referenced above that conspired with this Nigerians are seven greedy fraudsters who due to the money involved about a paltry 3,500 - 4,500 euros decided to betray their Country in order to sign Invitation Letters when they knew that those Nigerians forged those papers, that brings us to the big Question : Are finns really honest as they are shown in this forum? Lets face reality everyone has a tendency of greed both Nigerains, finns and other Nationals alike, aside from that the Nigerian scammers only succeded because they had those Finns who were their conspirators if the Finns informed the police then the Nigerians will have been arrested long time ago.Now the Nigerians recieves long Jail terms while the real criminals the finns who gave the Nigerians the morale to act because without them the letters of Invitations would have been signed will recieve less jail terms.
Just for your information - if you actually read the story posted by Pursuivant, you'll notice that the "invitations" in the following...

"Another way that the suspects are believed to have arranged illegal entry into Finland was by providing invitations. Seven Finns provided signatures for the invitations. The main suspects are suspected of having threatened one Finn with bodily harm, and of blackmailing another."

...had nothing whatsoever to do with the educational institutions & their invitation letters to the accepted students. The invitations here refer to those annexed to "ordinary" visitor visas. (Also pay close attention to the friendly means of asking for these signatures...)

The educational institutions, on the other hand, sent out their invitation letters in good faith, since the forgeries were so brilliantly done :? And please read the original news story again - you'll also come to notice that the 3200-4500 Euro fees that the Nigerian fraudsters asked for were not "prizes" paid to Finns, they were money taken by this group of Nigerians from their fellow Nigerians wishing to come to Finland, capiche?

No offence to Nigerians in general, but if you ask me, that sort of "services" stink to high heaven.

Of course there are bad and dishonest people here in Finland, too, but please do get your facts straight from what you read. If that had been a reading comprehension test, you'd have flunked. See now why they ask for good language skills?

-

An afterthought - you wouldn't have a paltry 4000 euros lying about, by any chance? Send them to me please, if it's no trouble :D

User avatar
Pursuivant
Posts: 15089
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:51 am
Location: Bath & Wells

Re: English test for admission

Post by Pursuivant » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:27 pm

kalusam wrote: Well if there is anyone who should apologize here that person is you how can you be in finland or God knows where and conclude totally that all Nigerians are Fraudsters.
because I have no connection to Nigeria and no interest and you still send me spam. nobody with any intelligence has approached me from Nigeria for any valid reason. I conclude you think we fall to trust you? you think we are stupid?
kalusam wrote: I can also conclude that the seven Finns quoted in the article you referenced above that conspired with this Nigerians are seven greedy fraudsters
I conclude you are illiterate, as it says they were blackmailed and threatened. besides which they were probably stupid women also with no honor and they get what they deserve.
kalusam wrote: I really smell a rat here
wash with some water and soap, that usually helps
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."


Post Reply