Citizenship Application 2023

[37yqp8098y5]

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[37yqp8098y5]

I had payment plan I am paying it manually every month.
They did not care about the payment plan.
I applied to court and lawyer They must pay attention payment plan I have an I am working full time.

All these years of complaining how migri is racist and you didn't even pay your bills...

They give you so many chances to pay them or explain yourself. Here is your post from October 2022 You got 6 additional months to pay off your loans and say "Ok. I paid them off". Didn't you say to me you were some big-dog PhD making good money? Why did you default on your payments then? They only go to Kela if you didn't pay them at the hospital or if you committed fraud and applied for money you shouldn't have and they caught you and told to pay it off. You also said you had been paying this a long time. Clearly you had also issues doing that too and the amount must have been massive.

You get so many chances. As another user said they consider:

• How large a sum is unpaid and how important the payment is
• Whether you have attempted to pay the sum
• Whether you have created a payment plan and followed it
• Failure to take care of your payment obligations may prevent you from becoming a Finnish citizen.

So you failed all of these. Either fraud (which they DO check WHY you even have the debt in the first place) or you aren't financially stable despite that full-time Wolt job, which is also grounds for rejection. The fact they gave you 6 more months to fix the situation and you didn't. Well you made your choice to sit on your hands and this is what happens. No more claiming they are "racist". You've been saying to everyone that your case was simple blah blah. Clearly it's not simple at all and the extra time taken was because you hadn't followed the rules.

Likely any lawyer will take your case, your money (which should go to paying off the bill which is clearly still not paid) and you will just embarrass yourself further.

Here's the best advice you are going to get. I'll give it to you for free. PAY YOUR DAMN DEBT!
Then later, when it is paid. Apply again. You will likely get a decision now within 6 months like everyone else is because of this new automation.

Your alternative? You waste money with lawyers and courts and anyone will happily take your money and try and argue your case. No one wins when it comes to trying to get Migri's decision overturned. Be prepared for a fight that is twice as long as it took for you to get your negative decision.

I just want point out some important information. Mamu waited 18 months until he got a reply from Migri which they asked him to prove he had either paid off his debt or shouldn't have his debts influence his application negatively. He failed to both pay off the debt(s) OR prove that he shouldn't have his debt(s) give him a negative result on his application. Despite all the complaining about Migri being racist, he got an answer from them in 18 months, which was right on the estimate that Migri had on their website, not longer even. He also got a FURTHER SIX MONTHS to pay off the debt and say "Hey, no problem anymore the debt(s) are paid". He didn't. Clearly despite what he says the debt(s) were likely so huge and his history of paying them off, so bad. That it was a clear reason for them to deny him also probably because it shows he isn't financially stable which is another requirement to getting your application accepted.

I have at least 4 friends with student loans who all got citizenship. Some were not asked yet to pay them off, others had been paying. The largest I knew of was one friend who had €14,000 euros still he owed. Not a single one of these friends was ever asked about their debts. Never asked. Decision was positive for all 4. Others here with student debt etc. should not worry. The situation with Mamu was completely different, that he had not only neglected to pay his debts over a long period of time, but there was enough past problems or concern that he couldn't financially support himself either and possibly the debt he got was related to lying to Kela in the first place because it was likely so large.

EDIT:

Yes part of it students loan and unemployment benefits.

Ok. So. You never have to pay back unemployment benefits unless you lied about being unemployed and they caught you. This is 100% the reason why you were declined. You lied, Kela found out, they asked the money back. Student loans are never the reason you get declined unless you neglect to pay them off and they go to debt collection (ulosotto) and even then you gotta STILL neglect to pay them, to which they garnish your salary or benefits. It's likely everything went to debt collection and Mamu is probably forced to pay them from his wages now (aka, he failed at every other normal step). So you were screwed the moment you applied and just threw your money away on the application (it should have gone to this debt). There is no way a lawyer is going to be able to help you. Take it as a learning experience for you and everyone else. Don't lie to Kela, make a plan before it goes to ulosotto and keep proof that you have been paying off. Migri will then never ask.

So really it's no mystery why the decision is negative. You should have paid up as soon as they asked, even if that meant living on noodles for a while.

Best decision you can make now is pay it all off. Apply again, and you'll probably get a response very quickly thanks to the new automation system. Otherwise waste 10x money and time in the courts. I would not be surprised considering the history of bad financial decisions you've clearly already made.

[37yqp8098y5]

I have kela debt overpayment made by kela 2017-18. They inform me that there was overpayment ,in that time I was unemployed. I ask them to for possible repayment and I made payment plan with Kela . it was 9000e and now I am less

Ok now I saw these posts.

This is actually comedy.

You have barely paid off 60% of your debt in 6 years... but you expected that they would give you citizenship? Mate that €400 citizenship application payment you made 2 years ago should have gone to this debt. Clearly if you had money to spend €400 on citizenship application, you can pay it off.

€9000 euro JUST in unemployment debt. Not including your student debt??? I have never in my life heard of someone being overpaid that much. Normally it's like 1 or 2 months. So knowingly you took taxpayer money, spent it (otherwise you could have just paid it back) and then when they caught you "Oh no, let's make a plan to pay it back". So you committed fraud. Unemployment is what... €800/kk? So you defrauded them for 1 whole year and every day thought you could get away with it.

If it was up to me, I'd not just decline your citizenship but throw you head first out of Finland and ban you for life. It's behaviour like this which is why our taxes suck so much and why there IS so much racism toward honest hardworking immigrants. I've worked my backside off in this country for 15 years before I felt like I deserved to even apply. I could have applied 10 years ago! In 15 years, I never pulled this kind of cr*p. You are literally part of the problem that people complain about all the time and part of the reason why Perussuomalaiset want to ban immigrants from having social security. At least if we did have laws here like Australia, US, Switzerland etc. you wouldn't have ever had a chance to even owe that €9000. People work hard to make that money that you stole.

If you weren't complete room-temperature IQ. You should have known straight away you had no chance of getting approved and nothing was ever going to change that. You wouldn't have wasted the money on the application. Thinking some "vague" interpretation of the law was ever going to save you. This decision is justice and the wake-up call you need.

Now make a smart decision for once and don't bother in the courts. They would love to take more of your money and simply say: "Your honor, he didn't pay even after 6 years and it's likely he'd take another 4 years to pay it off. Plus he lied to us for 1 year and had problems paying even during that 6 years". Yeah any judge is going to just laugh. If people on a forum can clearly see that you knowingly ripped Kela off and couldn't even pay everything off after 6 years. Then how do you think a solicitor is going to do? You won't last 5 minutes in a courtroom if this even ever makes it to one. Even if you took your story to YLE they wouldn't run this story. It's literally a joke and everyone reading it would say GOOD, at least the system is working preventing thieves and liars from getting in.

Anyone who recommends you take this ridiculous case to court has rocks in their head.

Pay off all your debts including the student loan. Then apply again and hopefully you get a fast answer in 6 months thanks to the new automation system. Let this be a lesson to every single person applying in the future. If anyone else has debts like this in Kela and ulosotto, pay them off NOW.

[Subzero]

Stage 2 in 1 week now , no request yet!!! Really stressful

Will add mine for some statistics as well, applied in 11.2021, now stage 2 for 3 weeks. Exhausting tbh

Hi Niia..I just want to ask if your country is on the Red list..?

[Subzero]

Stage 2 in 1 week now , no request yet!!! Really stressful

Edward which month and year did you apply..?

2021 March!! And you u?

Edward is your country on the red list....And I just want to know if you have live in Finland for more 10 years will the migri still need to check your identity even if your country is on the list when you present them with a valid passport

[kalaizanala]

Hello everyone!
Applied 25.5.2021
I got decision 22.05.2023.
The decision is negative.

F##k! !"#¤% situation. Sorry to hear that. Hope you will find justice in court.

[Edward35]

Edward which month and year did you apply..?

2021 March!! And you u?

Edward is your country on the red list....And I just want to know if you have live in Finland for more 10 years will the migri still need to check your identity even if your country is on the list when you present them with a valid passport

Almost 10years here!! No.
Your country on the list?

[Edward35]

Stage 2 in 1 week now , no request yet!!! Really stressful

Will add mine for some statistics as well, applied in 11.2021, now stage 2 for 3 weeks. Exhausting tbh

Understand . Soon it will be over!!

[Niia]

Stage 2 in 1 week now , no request yet!!! Really stressful

Will add mine for some statistics as well, applied in 11.2021, now stage 2 for 3 weeks. Exhausting tbh

Hi Niia..I just want to ask if your country is on the Red list..?

No, it’s not. Living here 10+ years

[pizzapasta]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

[boy30062021]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

That is a good idea and fair enough. I would even suggest the double 80k annual salary or more . The applicant should pass also all the 4 sections of the yki test. Not everyone is entitled to become citizen and if anyone wants that he has to secure very good income. Most of applicants are the one that are not working or on kela. Those are not bringing any value to Finland but Finland tax payers money goes to their pockets. The biggest cause of backlogs is that over 60% have less income or on kela. They need to make it harder and filter who become citizen here . No hard feeling just my opinion

[Auringon_kukka]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

It's a proposal, not reality. The PS don't dictate government policy or write laws. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the requirements for citizenship being tightened. The process for becoming a naturalized citizen varies widely across Europe. Check out the requirements in Switzerland and Austria, for example (up to 10 years of continuous residence necessary). Finland tolerates dual (or multiple) citizenships, which is not the case everywhere else. Imagine if you had to give up the citizenship of your country of birth? Some would have no problem with that, while others would fundamentally object.

The talk now is all about work-based immigration. If Finland does not import more workers, quality of life will decrease drastically--the birth rate is not high enough to sustain an increasingly top-heavy population of seniors. Recruiting IT and medical specialists is fine, but what about care workers? Who is going to look after seniors with increasingly complex needs? Will those jobs pay 40.000€ + annually? This quandry is not unique to Finland--many other countries are in the same boat but are much more adept at attracting people, for a variety of reasons.

So, it will be interesting to see what happens with the citizenship process here!

[Schmania]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

It's a proposal, not reality. The PS don't dictate government policy or write laws. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the requirements for citizenship being tightened. The process for becoming a naturalized citizen varies widely across Europe. Check out the requirements in Switzerland and Austria, for example (up to 10 years of continuous residence necessary). Finland tolerates dual (or multiple) citizenships, which is not the case everywhere else. Imagine if you had to give up the citizenship of your country of birth? Some would have no problem with that, while others would fundamentally object.

The talk now is all about work-based immigration. If Finland does not import more workers, quality of life will decrease drastically--the birth rate is not high enough to sustain an increasingly top-heavy population of seniors. Recruiting IT and medical specialists is fine, but what about care workers? Who is going to look after seniors with increasingly complex needs? Will those jobs pay 40.000€ + annually? This quandry is not unique to Finland--many other countries are in the same boat but are much more adept at attracting people, for a variety of reasons.

So, it will be interesting to see what happens with the citizenship process here!

I agree, it’s still a proposal by now. And it’s still possible that the government won’t be formed, since they seem to be having a hard time coming to an agreement

[Schmania]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

That is a good idea and fair enough. I would even suggest the double 80k annual salary or more . The applicant should pass also all the 4 sections of the yki test. Not everyone is entitled to become citizen and if anyone wants that he has to secure very good income. Most of applicants are the one that are not working or on kela. Those are not bringing any value to Finland but Finland tax payers money goes to their pockets. The biggest cause of backlogs is that over 60% have less income or on kela. They need to make it harder and filter who become citizen here . No hard feeling just my opinion

That decision would brush off, for example, all the potential nurses which might come to Finland to aid and already serious shortage, look at their salaries: https://sairaanhoitajat.fi/en/professio ... n-finland/#

This is grim

[Subzero]

This is what the requirement is going to be soon. A minimu of 40000e annual income.
https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-200000 ... BqlFgGS_wI

That is a good idea and fair enough. I would even suggest the double 80k annual salary or more . The applicant should pass also all the 4 sections of the yki test. Not everyone is entitled to become citizen and if anyone wants that he has to secure very good income. Most of applicants are the one that are not working or on kela. Those are not bringing any value to Finland but Finland tax payers money goes to their pockets. The biggest cause of backlogs is that over 60% have less income or on kela. They need to make it harder and filter who become citizen here . No hard feeling just my opinion

That decision would brush off, for example, all the potential nurses which might come to Finland to aid and already serious shortage, look at their salaries: https://sairaanhoitajat.fi/en/professio ... n-finland/#

This is grim

I have lived in Finland for more 10 years. I have worked all through out. Paid taxes and never been on Kela. I have applied since July still at stage one. I have accepted my faith of anything can happen in this process.

My only worry is why people I applied before have gotten their own decisions and I am still waiting