"Into The Wild"

[Ravvy]

A couple years ago in a discussion about what people were reading, I posted that I was reading Jon Krakauer's book, "Into The Wild", the true story about a young man who rejects his rich parents and, idealistic to a fault, bums his way around the USA and Canada with the saga ending in Alaska.

The most recent issue of "Outside" magazine (Here in the USA) has a front cover + article about this story, because after 10 years of negotiations with his family it has now been made into a movie (by Sean Penn). The movie opening is set for the latter part of September, and I will be standing in line to see it. Engrossing, tragic story.

[Hank W.]

Many Alaskans react with rage to [McCandless'] stupidity. You'd have to be a complete idiot, they say, to die of starvation in summer 20 miles off the Parks Highway.

Sounds like a lot of people moving to Finland.

McCandless apparently is an icon to follow in carlwebb's school of positive thought

[Ravvy]

Many Alaskans react with rage to [McCandless'] stupidity. You'd have to be a complete idiot, they say, to die of starvation in summer 20 miles off the Parks Highway.

Sounds like a lot of people moving to Finland.

McCandless apparently is an icon to follow in carlwebb's school of positive thought

He certainly was not a stupid person, but was very inexperienced and got in way over his head (pun intended ). He went in early in the Spring, before the thaw, and got stuck on the wrong side of some rivers which had turned into raging torrents. And he was ill-prepared with no maps so he had no clue how to get out when he wanted to exit. At one point in time he was actually quite close to a river crossing, but did not know it was there and he turned around before getting to it.

[Hank W.]

Finnish and Alaskan definition of "stupidity" differ from the mainstream USA one.

Being inexperienced and doing stuff that goes over your head, as well as ill-prepared = stupid... being so dumb you don't realize you are being dumb.

[enk]

I think the proper term is "absolute dumb-f*ck". Geezus, how
on earth do you starve to death in the dead of summer in
Alaska unless you're an "absolute dumb-f*ck"?
And I don't care what anyone has to say about the guy being
intelligent, he doesn't seem to have had a shred of common
sense. Anyone who brings a 10-lb sack of rice, which is totally
devoid of any nutritional value, to survive on is a down and
outright imbecile.

-enk

[Ravvy]

Semantics aside, I agree with you folks. He clunked around in the lower 48, getting by and seemingly clueless as to how much help he was actually getting from the society he was trying to reject. His parents said that when he was younger, he was nearly unteachable/ untrainable. Any time someone tried to tell him something, even as helpful advice or coaching, he checked out. Sadly some young people think they are bulletproof, right up to impact.

[Rob A.]

Many Alaskans react with rage to [McCandless'] stupidity. You'd have to be a complete idiot, they say, to die of starvation in summer 20 miles off the Parks Highway.

Sounds like a lot of people moving to Finland.

McCandless apparently is an icon to follow in carlwebb's school of positive thought

He certainly was not a stupid person, but was very inexperienced and got in way over his head (pun intended ). He went in early in the Spring, before the thaw, and got stuck on the wrong side of some rivers which had turned into raging torrents. And he was ill-prepared with no maps so he had no clue how to get out when he wanted to exit. At one point in time he was actually quite close to a river crossing, but did not know it was there and he turned around before getting to it.

I would have to agree with the other posters....going into the wilderness and dying of starvation is "stupid"...There are things that can happen...grizzly bear?? But not starvation... But then everyone has their own definition of "stupid"... There's a whole recent thread on the subject, isn't there??...

A couple of years ago I was collecting acorns....near a supermarket in a rather wealthy part of town... (west side... near W16th and MacDonald, for those who care...)...a surprising number of people, mostly middle aged, stopped and asked what I was doing and what these nuts were (yeah, it's not Finland...unfortunately strangers talk to you here... ) I was astounded at the lack of knowledge.... I thought, "How can people go through life not knowing about oak trees and acorns???"..... But it really is like that...many city people and that now includes most North Americans, are "stupid" when it comes to nature...

[littlefrank]

'A couple of years ago I was collecting acorns'

Are you a squirrel?



*Anyone who brings a 10-lb sack of rice, which is totally
devoid of any nutritional value, to survive on is a down and
outright imbecile.'

Sorry Enk but...

http://www.pechsiam.com/allabout_nutrition.htm.

There are stories every year of people having to be rescued in Britain because they think they'll have a jolly jaunt in the Lake District or up Ben Nevis dressed in trainers, t-shirt and shorts, then the weather changes...

[Ravvy]

Not debating the stupidity factor, but there were some additional circumstances. He was barely getting by and then inadvertently gave himself some sort of alkaloid poisoning from eating seeds, which sent him into a rapid spiral of decline. The book likened it to a cow eating locoweed. He did not have enough fat and glycogen reserves to shed the poison, so it remained in his system and blocked proper processing of the little bit of food he was barely able to still collect in his poisoned state. So the poison accelerated starvation conditions even while he was still eating food.

[Karhunkoski]

On the point of nutrition, there are documented cases of trappers in Canada having a plentiful supply of rabbit to eat, but still starving to death. They filled their bellies daily, but unfortunately lacked many essential vitamins and minerals to keep their organs working properly. The fools.

[littlefrank]

'He was barely getting by and then inadvertently gave himself some sort of alkaloid poisoning from eating seeds, which sent him into a rapid spiral of decline.'

According to wiki,

*Jon Krakauer believes McCandless died from eating the seeds of the wild potato (Hedysarum alpinum), which McCandless wrote about eating and blamed for his debilitating final illness. Although they are not commonly known to be poisonous, and the root of the plant is edible, there is evidence that the seeds contain an alkaloid which prevents glucose utilization. (Note that this is the theory that Krakauer presents in his book on McCandless, and differs from the earlier theory he related in his article for Outside magazine, about a second plant — Hedysarum mackenzii, a wild sweet pea plant — resembling the wild potato and known to be poisonous.)[1]*

He also failed to heed the warnings of a local and and has you pointed out, never carried a map either, the latter just proves how foolish he was.



**documented cases of trappers in Canada having a plentiful supply of rabbit to eat, but still starving to death... The fools.** The stupid meat eaters.

[Rob A.]

On the point of nutrition, there are documented cases of trappers in Canada having a plentiful supply of rabbit to eat, but still starving to death. They filled their bellies daily, but unfortunately lacked many essential vitamins and minerals to keep their organs working properly. The fools.

Yes...I've heard that too...though I think that was in the 1800s... I think the solution to this problem has been known a long time...though I imagine there are still people who don't realize this...

And..without using the "loaded word" anymore...the one starting with "s", I'm sympathetic alright... McCandless took a chance and it didn't work out...and no way to get help... I guess you might call that "poor risk management", then.

And this reminds me of my Australian cousin...she was up visiting several years ago...we were walking around in my father's garden.. she suddenly picked some red berries, stuck them in her mouth and immediately spat them out, with a disgusted look on her face...I don't know what they were. My father and I looked at each other with surprise, wondering why she would do that...

I didn't use the "s-word"...but I thought it...

[Rosamunda]

The movie opening is set for the latter part of September, and I will be standing in line to see it. Engrossing, tragic story.

...any idea what the certificate is on that film?

The book is available from the book depository £5 P&P to Finland is free. Looking forward to reading it. Is it suitable reading for a 15 yr old?

[Hank W.]

McCandless took a chance and it didn't work out...and no way to get help... I guess you might call that "poor risk management", then.

As I said - sounds like a lot of people aspitring to move to Finland.

BTW having worked in an opposite environment - Death Valley National Park, went on a few hiking trips, never "out of vicinity alone" and "never without telling anyone so I could "check back in" - as the desert in the summer is quite unforgiving. I just wish I had had my Yashica back then (though I'd blown all my money on film ) One place I yearn to visit. BUT - just like the hippies on those desert ranches you need to figure out a few things... (no, I don't put my bed legs into tin cans filled with lamp oil, nor have a water bottle with me always, but I am known to knock my shoes together to drop the scorpions out )

[Hank W.]

Is it suitable reading for a 15 yr old?

Dunno, but at 15 I was devouring "Papillon" (they sell a paperback in Finland with both Papillon and Banco, picked mine up in Suomalainen's sales bin)