sandiego, usa to tampere, finland

net_bh · Post by **net_bh** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:44 am

Hi all,

This is my first post here. I have had a great time reading through oodles of advice in the archives on every aspect of life in Finland.

I noticed a lot of people have moved from bright, warm, sunny places (like the one I am living in) to the not-so-spectacular weather in Finland. What were the tradeoffs you had to make?

I am considering an offer from a large telecommunications company. I have read a lot of good about Finland and wanted to know what you thought was bad besides the taxes

What do people think about the savings potential of the country when compared to nations like the US, UK, etc.

Thanks for your time.

Regards,
Amit

**Sponsor:**

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:18 am

net_bh wrote: What do people think about the savings potential of the country when compared to nations like the US, UK, etc.

Do you mean saving money?

Then I would say close to zero, compared to a similar lifestyle in the UK or USA. If you want to save money here you have to eat like a Finn and spend all your spare time Nordic walking in the forests.

I don't think we are saving any hard cash here on a monthly basis BUT we have bought a house and AT THE MOMENT the housing market is buoyant ie: house prices are rising and interet rates are very low - so I guess we are sort of saving money that way. However, about 10 years ago there was a crash in the housing market here and real estate prices plunged almost overnight. So you have to be careful about investing (where,what, how much, how long) especially if you are only staying in the country temporarily

Handsome · Post by **Handsome** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:28 am

net_bh wrote:I am considering an offer from a large telecommunications company. I have read a lot of good about Finland and wanted to know what you thought was bad besides the taxes

So you're coming to work for Nokia, then?

net_bh wrote:What do people think about the savings potential of the country when compared to nations like the US, UK, etc.

That depends on what kind of lifestyle you like to live. Do you like to eat at restaurants every night, or live on bread and water and invest every spare penny you have?

Not everybody's good points and bad points about Finland are the same; somethings I dislike, others may like, and vice-versa. The only way you'll know if you'll like it or not is by trying it. Give yourself a trial year over here and see how things go. At the end of the day, your home country will always be there.

Stu

Hank W. · Post by **Hank W.** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 10:31 am

net_bh wrote:What do people think about the savings potential of the country when compared to nations like the US

In the USA you don't pay hardly any taxes, your gas is ridiculously cheap and all prices are like the end of sales season here...

dusty_bin · Post by **dusty_bin** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 10:50 am

Savings, are you real.

Saving is illegal in Finland. (or it seems so)

I remember an advert from one of the large banks a few years ago. It was advertising a savings account. The details escape me but it was something along the lines of
...save with us, for your convenience, we will pay you a rate of interest so low that you will not have to pay tax on it.

The system is designed such that the governement takes all the money that would be disposable income in other societies and 'saves it' for you so that when somebody else fall ill there is a hospital, when somebody else gets old, they get a pension. The people are left with 'pocket money', just like kids.

Oh and you still have to pay to see a doctor or go to hospital and there is a good chance that there will not be a pension for you when you get old!

Savings, my arse!

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 11:14 am

dusty_bin wrote:
Oh and you still have to pay to see a doctor or go to hospital

This is actually NOT true. I have seen doctors and been to hospital within the last few months and have not had to pay any cash.....

Re: pensions. Every country in W.Europe is facing a pensions problem, nothing special about Finland and the contribution rates in France, for health and pensions (including the CSG), are higher than here.

But dusty_bin is right in that there is no incentive to save money here and most people just don't have spare cash to save anyway.

sayx · Post by **sayx** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 11:58 am

I moved from SD a few years back to Helsinki, the trade offs are all worth it, well it was more like upgrading from 0.2V to 2.0V.

I lived in Santee for a few months when I moved from Canada to there, and in that short time I witness the school shooting they had. When you have kids, Finland is a great place, it’s not perfect for them no place will ever be but it’s much better. The medical coverage here is good as well, but not as good as the US, that’s if you have insurance. 15,000$US bill for my son when he got hurt and I paid only a couple of hundred, think of the people that don’t have the coverage, bottom rate medical care and maybe the county will pay for it if they cant. unemployment coverage is good here, I spent almost two years unemployed was taken good care of by the government, now I have no problems paying the high taxes, I’m just putting back what I took from the system.

You will not have all the toys that you are use to in the US, take my old boos for example 45 foot motor home used two times a year, two seadoos used a few times a year, Doon buggy used a few times a year… and it goes on.

For a safe and relaxing life were you don’t feel you have to one up your peers I find Finland to be the place.

Andrew_S · Post by **Andrew_S** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:17 pm

penelope wrote:
dusty_bin wrote:
Oh and you still have to pay to see a doctor or go to hospital
This is actually NOT true. I have seen doctors and been to hospital within the last few months and have not had to pay any cash.....

Who paid then? I haven't paid to see a doctor but my employer paid.

The Finnish health service unlike the British NHS is not free, unless somebody is on income support from the Social Office.

It seems to me that workers get to pay loads of tax (with the employers non-payroll taxes as well which are still a tax on the value of a worker's work) and then have to pay again if they get sick (or have health insurance).

Like Hank says, why work?

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:22 pm

Andrew_S wrote:Who paid then?

???????

If I get sick I go to my local health centre tervysasema (or something like that) and show them my Kela card, no need to make an appointment, I then take a seat and wait (last time it was about 30 minutes) and then I get to see a doctor (who usually speaks fluent English). She may or may not give me a prescription or whatever (on last occasion my son was given a cortisone injection and some tablets and was under observation for 6 hours), then I go home.

Did I leave without paying?

sayx · Post by **sayx** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 3:15 pm

With kela you pay a 10€ fee for the first three or forth visits you make in a year, children dont have to pay as many times per year.

SediaAmore · Post by **SediaAmore** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 12:24 am

adios

net_bh · Post by **net_bh** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 2:34 am

Thank you all for responding.

Handsome wrote:

Give yourself a trial year over here and see how things go.

Thats exactly what I am thinking too: give myself a year or two

Hank wrote:

In the USA you don't pay hardly any taxes, your gas is ridiculously cheap and all prices are like the end of sales season here

So maybe I should buy more stuff here in the US. The company is paying the costs of shipping and the shipping container would be half empty anyways. Been wanting to buy a bike, some more furniture, etc. for a while now.

From what I have read elsewhere in the forums, I have tried to come up with the cost of living for 2 people in Tampere. Please help with the question marks (?) and suggest what I might have forgotten to account for. I am trying to figure out whats left to actually go out shopping or travelling with all the 4-5 weeks of vacation that are available.

Code: Select all

Item                     Monthly (Eur)
-------------------------------------
Rent                    500
Petrol                    50
Food                   600-700   (16-20/day and restaurants once a week)
Electricity              ?
Gas (heating?)      ?
Garage parking     ?

Item                     Yearly (Eur)
------------------------------------
Car tax               200-300   (2004 VW Passat)
Car insurance         ?

Thanks.

Regards,
Amit

bohica · Post by **bohica** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:56 am

Car insurance is realitively cheap, lots of other things aren't, so it adds up. If you want make a quick buck, stay away. If you want to travel a bit while you can, etc. go for it. What do you have to lose?

But you might still be there 20 years later. Or hate it. You never know. But nothing worth doing is easy in my opinion, and when you're done you can say you've done something that many people haven't done or would be afraid to try.

net_bh · Post by **net_bh** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:46 am

bohica: I am not considering this opportunity to make a quick buck....i truly feel this might be a good opportunity to further my career and do some traveling at the same time.

Just trying to understand the ground realities, since I will be dragging my fiance into this too

Hank W. · Post by **Hank W.** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:50 am

net_bh wrote: Been wanting to buy a bike, some more furniture, etc. for a while now.

Just remember in Finland bedrooms are the size of a queen-size bed, and a flat consists of 2-3 such rooms so make sure your furniture fits...

Rent 500

Optimism of a studio flat in Hervanta? 600-700 more likely. Check http://www.oikotie.fi

Petrol 50

So that buys you a full tank... once. If you live anywhere in the environs double it.

Food 600-700 (16-20/day and restaurants once a week)

Going Lidl and jumping the kebab house trashcan on Fridays? Feasible.

Electricity ?

Say 40/mo

Gas (heating?) ?

We don't use gas for heating unless you buy a lot of beans and have 10 guys to the room as in army barracks. Gas is sometimes in some houses used for cooking. Very rare. If you rent, heating is in the price. Unless you rent a house and then you have to buy oil. Thats about 400-500 a year

Garage parking ?

Where?

Car tax 200-300 (2004 VW Passat)

Be sure to own it 6 months before shipping it over...

Car insurance ?

ballpark:
2004 VW passat 1,8 engine in Tampere,
mandatory traffic 600,-
full (collision,moose,theft) insurance w/bonuses liability 150,- = 1100,-
w/o bonuses, liability 550,- = 340,-

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