Military Service, Non-Military Service obligations.

[trossalba]

Hello,

Can I ask - about this compulsary military service on becoming a Finnish citizen, if there are compulsive reasons not to admit the person to military service, is there then an obligation to perform non-military service?

I.e. if I were to become a Finnish citizen before I am 30 and then I cannot do or am exempted from military service e.g. for a heart condition, then am I obligated to perform service in a non-military area?

Can somebody also point me to a definite source of information, e.g. an excerpt in the law or some official information sheet?

Or, then, where can I get definitive information?

Thanks.

[priki]

http://www.sivarikeskus.fi/english/basicseng.html

legislation in Finnish:
http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/1991/19911723
http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/1991/19911725
http://www.finlex.fi/pdf/normit/17116-O342003TM.pdf
http://www.finlex.fi/fi/viranomaiset/normi/455001/24677

http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siviilipalvelus

[Hank W.]

If you get a medical leave/too old whatever then you don't need to go. The non-military option is a third one in the row, military, non-armed in the military, civilian service, jail. So if you have a heart condition or are too old you don't have to go to jail either

The law is at http://www.mil.fi

[trossalba]

Hey y'all,

Thanks for the replies. Although, either I am unable to understand clearly or the answers still do not answer my basic question: If, for medical reasons such as a heard condition, one is unable to perform military service, does that make civil service obligatory.

??????

Thanks.

[GaryK]

Hey y'all,

Thanks for the replies. Although, either I am unable to understand clearly or the answers still do not answer my basic question: If, for medical reasons such as a heard condition, one is unable to perform military service, does that make civil service obligatory.

??????

Thanks.

I'm almost completely confident that they would not be able to put you into non-military service ("national service") if you did not want to go there, but that you would be relieved from your obligations if your health problems were severe enough. At least that is what quite a few of my Finnish friends have said about it, if I remember right.

(on a very off-topic note: I moved from Brighton to DC for an academic year and wouldn't mind tips (possibly through PMs) about the area!)

[sotka_]

Hey y'all,

If, for medical reasons such as a heard condition, one is unable to perform military service, does that make civil service obligatory.

I'm almost completely confident that they would not be able to put you into non-military service ("national service") if you did not want to go there, but that you would be relieved from your obligations if your health problems were severe enough.

Yes, that's the way it goes. First they check your health and classify you, A, B, C etc. based on the examination.

If you're an A or a B, then it's the "military, non-armed in the military, civilian service, jail"-options list. Otherwise the whole thing just doesn't apply.

I got an A. For a B, poor eyesight is enough, even if you're otherwise healthy and fit. Then there's the rest of the alpabet. Couple of my friends, one with a bad back, another one with epilepsy got C,D or E, so it was a get out of jail -card for them. I would think that a heart condition is the same. If they'll call you up, remember to mention it during your physical, if it would not be in the papers, for some reason. Actually one guy in my unit was relieved at one point, because it was found out (during the service) that he had a heart condition.

I don't really remember what the C, D and E classifications mean exactly, or even if it was C-E, but if it isn't war time, it does not matter service wise.

In short, if you're found unfit (for any reason) for military service, you don't have to do any other kind of service either.

[sammy]

I don't really remember what the C, D and E classifications mean exactly, or even if it was C-E, but if it isn't war time, it does not matter service wise.

Just for the record... in Finnish, I'm sorry - from the following "Union of Conscientious Objectors" pages:

http://www.aseistakieltaytyjaliitto.fi/

a) Vapautuksen hankkiminen

Vapautuksen hankkiminen on tavallisin tapa "totaalikieltäytyä", lisäksi se on täysin laillinen eikä johda mihinkään virallisiin sanktioihin. Vapautuksen rauhan ajaksi (C-luokka, "vihreät paperit") voi hankkia joko sotilasviranomaisilta tai siviilipalveluskeskuksesta, riippuen siitä onko hakenut siviilipalvelukseen. Täydellisen vapautuksen (D-luokka, "punaiset paperit") voivat myöntää vain sotilasviranomaiset ja sen saaminen on varsin vaikeaa. Vapautus rauhan ajaksi voidaan myöntää myös määräaikaisena (E-luokka), jolloin palveluskelpoisuus ratkaistaan lopullisesti vasta myöhemmin.

[oxford]

No, you absolutely do not have to do it. I actually volunteered to do it and was given a strong suggestion not to do it by both an officer in the military and an embassy official. The embassy official actually refered to me as a "foreigner" in saying "foreigners do not have to do it". The officer called me a foreigner too now that I think of it saying "foreigners usually go to the Helsinki (something) brigade".

So dont worry about it. Even if you want to do the service they'll do everything they can to prevent it. Damn foreigners.

[nirva]

The civilian service isn't actually a service at all, it's just a non-jail punishment for not going to the army. If we got rid of conscription, we'd also get rid of the civilian service. That's why you don't have to do any service if you're not fit enough for the army.

[Hövsgöl]

I'd like to become a Finnish national just so I could do the military service so I won't have to do the Turkish one! I downloaded a video from mil.fi and it all looks so ordered, well-run and catered to please eveyone. Well I am already a holder of dual-nationality, I don't think I can hold three passports!

I am liable for service in 1 year, what age is it in Suomi?

[Hank W.]

Well, you could always run to the UK and enlist
In Finland you get called up the year you have your 19th birthday.

Looking "ordered, well-run and catered to please run everyone" is credit to the propaganda unit :lol::lol::lol:

[Hövsgöl]

I would rather enlist in the armed forces of Burkina Faso than serve in her Majesty's army - I have my reasons...

Well the opinion I have of Finland when it comes to organisation is one of, well, organisation - things are marked, tabbed, kept track of and tept ticking over effectively - or at least this is the general picture I get.

I shouldn't forget that the Turkish army is actually very well organised, so on second thoughts I might do it here, especially since call up age is after Finland's 19, at 20.

[Hank W.]

things are marked, tabbed, kept track of and tept ticking over effectively

The only hurry there is in life is to wait for something.

[dar1us]

I'd like to become a Finnish national just so I could do the military service so I won't have to do the Turkish one! I downloaded a video from mil.fi and it all looks so ordered, well-run and catered to please eveyone. Well I am already a holder of dual-nationality, I don't think I can hold three passports!

I am liable for service in 1 year, what age is it in Suomi?

doing army service in finland compensates the army service of turkey, but i'm not sure if it's vice-versa.

check http://www.asal.msb.gov.tr/sikcasorulan2.htm

but you'd probably find yourself in this helsinki foreigner-brigade which sounds more like some exchange student party than army service.

[haahatus]

I am sure Santahamina is not just a party for exchange students. A full brigade for foreigners maybe not There aren't alot of brigades in this country

It is a another question what these people do there though