Conflicting information about milk for babies

[raumagal]

I've gotten some conflicting information about giving milk to babies. Some health care professionals here recommend fat free milk for over 1 year. Others say full fat is better from 1 year to 2 years old because the extra fat and calories are needed for brain development. Then they say from 2 years on to switch to fat free because full fat milk can contribute to health problems later in life (because of the saturated fat).

I was just wondering if this has happened to anyone else? What milk did you use?


And I was just curious, do Finnish milk producers use Bovine Growth Hormones?


thanks!

[smilesalot]

Absolutely give them the full fat, this fat thing has gone overboard. Our bodies need fat and the energy it provides as the building blocks for cell membranes and a variety of hormones and hormonelike substances. Fats also act as carriers for important fat-soluble vitamins A, D, E and K. Dietary fats are needed for the conversion of carotene to vitamin A, for mineral absorption and for a host of other processes. I could go on and on. The big hype is cholesterol, what they dont tell you is every cell in our body is made from cholesterol and our body can make its own cholesterol.
The big thing is the quality of fats, one of the down falls of modern milk is pasturization, this has destroyed the important enzymes found in milk that help in its digestion. Ive seen the diffrence of people drinking raw milk (which you cant get from finland) to drinking pasturized in people who are lactose sensitive its just amazing.
Another interesting observation is people who are allergic to milk here in Finland have go to Switzerland or other places on holiday and drank milk and ate ice cream without reactions whatsoever. oops I got side tracked

The point Im making I wouldn't worry about what they say, because they don't know why, when or what type of fats to limit, just like they used to push breast milk is not good for infants(of course now they've changed their minds) The type of fat is the important thing

Smilesalot
Hmm speaking of fats I have one word Chocolate

[raumagal]

Absolutely give them the full fat, this fat thing has gone overboard. Our bodies need fat and the energy it provides as the building blocks for cell membranes and a variety of hormones and hormonelike substances. Fats also act as carriers for important fat-soluble vitamins A, D, E and K. Dietary fats are needed for the conversion of carotene to vitamin A, for mineral absorption and for a host of other processes. I could go on and on.

Smilesalot
Hmm speaking of fats I have one word Chocolate

Thanks.

My gut feeling was that I would give the full fat milk and then switch after a year but I wondered why some recommended the fat free (they had said it was a new recommendation that had changed from the old one of 2%). It was funny because I was also told to give 9 teaspoons of vegetable fat "kasvisrasva" per day (margarine on bread or porridge) which I thought was funny after being told to give fat free milk!


Oh yeah, I forgot...chocolate mmmmm. Finland has sooooo many good chocolates.... too bad they don't have a drool emoticon...

[scoobymcdoo]

In the UK the HV (neuvola) say full fat milk until the child is 2 and then switching to half or fat free milk.

Here in Finland it seems to be very different, my neuvola told me at 1 year to put Sophie on fat free milk...now I wouldn't drink that flavoured water so she went onto full fat milk for 6 months. At 18 months we put her on the dark blue carton milk (1.5%). At her 18 month check up neuvola decided that she was seriously underweight (she isn't) and that I should add extra oil to her food and give her the blue milk (which I already was). They then asked me back at 21 months for an extra check up on her weight.

Nowadays, Sophie (nearly 2) drinks the dark blue milk before bed and sometimes some first thing in the morning.

Hannah and the tall skinny one

[raumagal]

Maybe since Finland has such a high death rate from heart disease they want to try to encourage drinking fat free milk from birth? If I remember correctly there were higher rates of heart disease for people who had high milk consumption.

Our daughter is skinny too but she eats really well and always has been a good eater.

[EP]

And I was just curious, do Finnish milk producers use Bovine Growth Hormones?

Growth hormones are forbidden in Finland.

[EP]

OK, it seems that they are forbidden in all EU:

"The European Union has criticized the use of hormones in meat production since the 1980s due to strong concerns about their safety. The EU prohibited the use of hormones for non-therapeutic purposes in 1985, and banned the importation of U.S. beef in 1988 to avoid importing hormone-treated meat. Since then, there has been a heated dispute between the United States and the EU over the ban, and, in a 1999 ruling, the World Trade Organization (WTO) decided in favor of the US. However, in April of that year, the EU's Scientific Committee on Veterinary Measures relating to Public Health (SCVPH) released a report indicating that the use of the six growth hormones posed a risk to consumers. The EU ban remains in place. "

http://www.centerforfoodsafety.org/rbgh_hormo.cfm

[smilesalot]

Maybe since Finland has such a high death rate from heart disease they want to try to encourage drinking fat free milk from birth? If I remember correctly there were higher rates of heart disease for people who had high milk consumption.

Our daughter is skinny too but she eats really well and always has been a good eater.

My point exactly its the quality fats that are important, the reason milk is mentioned so often is its a common source.
I would also watch out about the vegetable fats, especially rapeseed(canola) oil. Finland is the only country in the world so far that Ive seen pushing the benefits of this oil if it was so good there would be a greater push throught the world.
The problem with the vegetable oils is all the healthy factors have been eliminated when they processed the oils thats why you see some vendors marketing cold pressed but even some of the cold pressed processes are at a to high a temperature and kill the enzymes and their cofactors. Another interesting thing I learned in chemistry is that oil oxidizes(breaks down and goes bad) by light. Its always funny to see all the clear bottles of oil at the store, this just tells me these oils would go rancid faster if they were not heat filtered and cleaned (all the healthy things in fat removed)
Tips to finding healthy oils, they will be in dark bottles and really healthy oils will be found in the refridgerator section.
Another misinterpretation is how unhealthy butter is vs margarine, I totally disagree, its the way things are made to have a long shelf life that decreases the health value.
I would be giving you child all the butter they want and never margarine.
Do you know the history of margarine, the alternative to butter during the war. From that point on its been a marketing hype to sell more margarine than butter. Why do they have to color it to look like butter, why to they try to compare it to butter?

Interesting thoughts,
Its good to hear you question the health advisor (who spout whatever the goverment wants them to) Im a firm beliver in moderation and in going with your gut feelings. You had a gut feeling that what they were telling you wasn't right and now as you delve into it you understand it a little better. Remember this gut feeling next time it comes along, you don't have to argue and tell neuvola their wrong, but look into it further and make an educated decision. That way you know what your getting into and why and you can teach others what you have learned

smilesalot

If we're not perfect, let us at least be progressing

[bntp02]

Growth hormones are forbidden in Finland.

Yep, there goes all the flavor for the beef...

As far as full fat milk, basically its recommended up until the age of 2yrs, and then switch to a lower fat milk. I think most people don't need the full fat, they just enjoy the flavor. I would be more concerned about fruit juices that are sugary. I dilute my daughters juice, 50% water, and then she also gets plain water during the day. Actually at her 2 yr. checkup, the doctor told me she wasn't drinking enough milk or getting enough calcium, so I have her on a multivitamin.
The fact of the matter is, that as parents we are in charge of giving them healthy choices.

[smilesalot]

Maybe since Finland has such a high death rate from heart disease they want to try to encourage drinking fat free milk from birth? If I remember correctly there were higher rates of heart disease for people who had high milk consumption.

They've already proven that its not the fat its the type of fat and even then their on shakey ground. The only thing they do know is these people drank large amounts of milk, but if you increased their fiber, the amount of fat can be cut in half. Thats where the hype about oatbran in the diet came from.

smilesalot

People will follow your footsteps quicker than your advice.

[raumagal]

Thanks EP for the info about the hormones!

[raumagal]

Another misinterpretation is how unhealthy butter is vs margarine, I totally disagree, its the way things are made to have a long shelf life that decreases the health value.

Interesting thoughts,
Its good to hear you question the health advisor (who spout whatever the goverment wants them to) Im a firm beliver in moderation and in going with your gut feelings. You had a gut feeling that what they were telling you wasn't right and now as you delve into it you understand it a little better. Remember this gut feeling next time it comes along, you don't have to argue and tell neuvola their wrong, but look into it further and make an educated decision. That way you know what your getting into and why and you can teach others what you have learned

thanks for all the info.

We don't eat a lot of butter (or margarine) so it feels a bit funny to give it to the baby! But I would imagine that butter is fine in moderation - like just about everything else!

We really like our neuvola lady and she's a great neuvola nurse. Even so I like to check if I have heard something different just to be sure.

[Wheely]

If you want a nutritionist's point of view then give your baby full fat milk. Give everything as nature intended as much as possible.

The nutrition society here is just discussing now why nutrition has got such a low profile in Finland and what they are going to do about it.

M

[Rosamunda]

If you want a nutritionist's point of view then give your baby full fat milk. Give everything as nature intended as much as possible.


M

Quite, because nature never intended human babies to drink cows' milk.


... from the mother of a 13 yr old boy who has never drunk cows' milk in his life and is tall and strong and healthy without it.

Valio rules OK!!!!

I really don't think it makes tuppence difference what kind of milk you give your child. I give mine (the other two) organic milk, which is I believe semi-skimmed. The rationale behind skimmed milk is that, gramme for gramme, the calcium content is higher. But if your child is eating a well-balanced diet the difference is not significant.

[smilesalot]

We don't eat a lot of butter (or margarine) so it feels a bit funny to give it to the baby! But I would imagine that butter is fine in moderation - like just about everything else!

We really like our neuvola lady and she's a great neuvola nurse. Even so I like to check if I have heard something different just to be sure.

I make a healthy butter, by mixing 1/2 portion softened butter with a 1/4 portion of flax seed oil and 1/4 portion of either grape seed or olive oil.
This way I reduce the amount of saturated fats and introduce other healthy fats into my diet.

As penelope said one doesn't have to use cows milk, I know others that used carrot juice and fresh oils. Theres also Almond milk, some use soy milk but Id stay away from that(95% of the worlds soy is gmo besides soy has been shown to increase estrogen and affect calcium absorbtion into the bones) Ive also made Cashew milk or mixed nut milk. Another interesting one Ive recently tried is Avocado milk(latest research is showing how great avodados really are) Oops Im running on again if you want more ideas just ask.

smilesalot


A smile is a curve that can set a lot of thing straight.