Racist Comments on this board could = a Fine.

[Ktulu]

I think it should of been prejudice against Americans and not racist towards them. Doesn't Americans, Germans, Kiwi's, Brits etc all come under the caucasian race?

I'm only going to address kiwi's here. Kiwi's aren't a race (see above)... and we only call white New Zealanders "caucasian" when they've done something bad.... here's some real life examples from a major news paper here.

"Thursday November 15, 2007
A woman about to get into her car in central Hamilton last night was pulled into a waiting van, driven off and raped, police said today.
.....
The driver was Caucasian, with curly hair, and the rear passenger was also Caucasian, in his 20s, clean shaven, about 1.8m tall, strong and wearing a beanie and dark clothing."

"Friday November 02, 2007
...
The woman's attackers were described as a Maori aged 20 to 25 with longish hair, unshaven and with tattoos on his arms, and a Caucasian aged about 21 with short mousey blond hair and acne all over his face"

"Monday September 03, 2007
Police have named a man they believe shot at two officers with a pistol early this morning.
....
Duthie is a Caucasian of medium to solid build, has sandy-coloured hair and a mole on the right side of his nose. He is 175 cm tall."

... I can give you plenty more examples if you want.

Now, when a white New Zealander is a victim.... they call them European.

"Monday July 24, 2006
Police are appealing for information on a Northland man believed to be hitchhiking to Whangarei.
...He is described as European, with light brown short hair, a small beard, of light build, with blue eyes, and 170cm tall."

"Sunday July 9, 2006
...
The victim, a European man believed to aged more than 60, was partially clad
and his hands were severed at the wrist."

But my favorite is when a brown skinned New Zealander does something... they're pretty clear on who they are...

"Thursday April 03, 2008
...
Detective Sergeant Greg Cottam, of Papanui police, said the Maori man, possibly riding a bicycle, grabbed the girl from behind and sexually assaulted her as she walked through Bishopdale Park, northweastern Christchurch, about 8.20pm

"Sunday March 09, 2008
....
The offender is described as Maori or Polynesian, aged between 30 and 40, of a fat build and 6ft 4 inches tall."

"Sunday January 13, 2008
...
He said the man had described his attackers as Maori or Pacific Islanders, all of heavy build."


... even when they're not completely sure

"Sunday March 23, 2008
Police are hunting a driver who sexually attacked a 16-year-old woman who accepted a lift from him overnight.
...
The man was described as olive-skinned, possibly Maori, a smoker, of fattish build and aged between 19 and his mid-20s."

"Wednesday November 15, 2006
The Dutch couple abducted at gunpoint by two men and assaulted and robbed have thanked New Zealanders for their support.
....
Police are looking for two men with dark complexions, probably Maori, and aged between 20 and 40"

... and my favorite...

"February 03, 2007
WELLINGTON - Police are seeking two people after a man was stabbed in the face at Orewa, about 40km north of Auckland, early today.
....
Police are looking for a Maori or olive-skinned Caucasian man, aged 25 to 35 years, or solid build and 1.72m to 1.78m tall. He was wearing long dreadlocks, blue jeans and was bare-chested."

[antstar]

Ah yes i must correct myself were all so mixed these days its not simple, for an example in UK there are many "British Asians" which goes against my comment. But i think you understood what i was getting at with the prejudice bit.

[Hank W.]

Police are looking for a Maori or olive-skinned Caucasian man, aged 25 to 35 years, or solid build and 1.72m to 1.78m tall. He was wearing long dreadlocks, blue jeans and was bare-chested."

So, did they catch you?
/get me coat

[Ktulu]

So, did they catch you?
/get me coat

I'm statistical anomaly... brown skin and never been to prison (well not yet anyway)

[Hank W.]

Well, the Finnish press has been tightroping in describing the perpetrators. Sometimes you read the news from two papers, and you wouldn't know they're discussing the same event. There are a few "code words" though... like "national costume" sends flying colors... the Minority Ombudsman has been growling against the news of revealing ethnic implications unless it has "relevance" to the case... usually a persons language is revealed, if they spoke Finnish or not and if they spoke with an accent... another word they have started using lately is kantaväestöön kuuluva which... hrm.. translates as aboriginal population I think another one I've seen is kansalliseen vähemmistöön kuuluva which I think was wearing the national dress... I'm waiting for the press to start using some nice euphemism such as "EU national practicing his free right of movement next.

[Ktulu]

the Minority Ombudsman has been growling against the news of revealing ethnic implications unless it has "relevance" to the case... usually a persons language is revealed, if they spoke Finnish or not and if they spoke with an accent...

Well this one might tickle your fancy then

"Monday August 27, 2007
Police believe a robber who has targeted Post Banks in South Auckland has struck again, this time in Hamilton.
The latest robberies were committed after detectives spoke to Steven Kurt Peri by phone last week telling him to give himself up.
Detective Sergeant Geoff Baber said the 28 year-old, who speaks with a distinctive Canadian accent, is armed and dangerous.
Mr Baber said Peri was believed to be responsible for at least three Post Shop robberies in the Auckland region since mid August and was now believed to have struck twice in Hamilton last week.
Peri is a Maori of thin to medium build, about 186cm tall."

[MTB]

Nice topic.
I saw some interesting topic (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=27098) on this forum, and personally I don't like its title and I suggest a change (Romanian beggars=thieves). Because I hapen to know some romanian beggars who are not thieves (usually old men/women working in agriculture. Can you imagine a pension less than 10 euros per month after some 25-30 years of hard work in the fields?). Yes, they are usually begging at home, because they don't have money to fly to other countries. But in this case, is either beggars or thieves, probably the latter (and please try do differentiate them when giving money!). And I would bet that there are thieves of different nationalities everywhere.
Otherwise, easy to say the standard cliches, like americans=something or somebody from somewhere=rednex.

[littlefrank]

Of ourse Americans are a race, just like the German race, the British Race, the New Zealand race ...

I hope you're not serious.
German race I can accept... there's enough homogeneity of specific genetic markers that make them unique.
British people = combination of Anglo, Celt, Saxon and Jute races
The main races in New Zealand people are Maori, polynesian (Samoan and Tongan), Chinese and European (Anglo, Saxon, Celt and Jute). There is no New Zealand race acknowledged here... we take a more pragmatic view to the logical assignment of race based on genetic heritage... probably because we don't have the baggage that Europeans have (ethnic cleansing and extermination camps probably make you a bit gun shy when it comes to defining people by their genetic heritage).

Stereotyping people by race was popular in the Victorian period onward and was used to justify discrimination and exploitation of certain 'races' not necessarily black,brown or yellow...


'In much of the pseudo-scientific literature of the day the Irish were held to be inferior, an example of a lower evolutionary form, closer to the apes than their "superiors", the Anglo-Saxons. Cartoons in Punch portrayed the Irish as having bestial, ape-like or demonic features and the Irishman (especially the political radical), was invariably given a long or prognathous jaw, the stigmata to the phrenologists of a lower evolutionary order, degeneracy, or criminality. Thus John Beddoe, who later became the President of the Anthropological Institute (1889-1891), wrote in his The Races of Britain (1862) that all men of genius were orthognathous (less prominent jaw bones) while the Irish and the Welsh were prognathous and that the Celt was closely related to Cromagnon man, who, in turn, was linked, according to Beddoe, to the "Africanoid". The position of the Celt in Beddoe's "Index of Nigrescence" was very different from that of the Anglo-Saxon. These ideas were not confined to a lunatic fringe of the scientific community, for although they never won over the mainstream of British scientists they were disseminated broadly and it was even hinted that the Irish might be the elusive missing link! Certainly the "ape-like" Celt became something of a malevolent cliche of Victorian racism. Thus Charles Kingsley could write ". . . I am haunted by the human chimpanzees I saw [in Ireland] . . . I don't believe they are our fault. . . . But to see white chimpanzees is dreadful; if they were black, one would not feel it so much. . . ." (Charles Kingsley in a letter to his wife, quoted in L.P. Curtis, Anglo-Saxons and Celts: A Study of Anti-Irish Prejudice in Victorian England, 1968, 84).'

But luckily civlised people have moved on from this attitude and now the majority of anthropologists, social scientists look on race has 'socially constucted' i.e. a common history etc.

'According to Jonathan Marks,

By the 1970s, it had become clear that (1)most human differences were cultural; (2) what was not cultural was principally polymorphic - that is to say, found in diverse groups of people at different frequencies; (3) what was not cultural or polymorphic was principally clinal - that is to say, gradually variable over geography; and (4) what was left - the component of human diversity that was not cultural, polymorphic, or clinal - was very small.
A consensus consequently developed among anthropologists and geneticists that race as the previous generation had known it - as largely discrete, geographically distinct, gene pools - did not exist.[85]
In the face of this rejection of race by evolutionary scientists, many social scientists have replaced the word race with the word "ethnicity" to refer to self-identifying groups based on beliefs concerning shared culture, ancestry and history'

The pictures were ridiculous by the way, I could post a picture and say which are members of the British race or the German race? Or is there some way you could identify them by genetic differences?


Edited due to the fact I should never reply to a post when I'm in a bad mood.

[bullacc]

Nice topic.
I saw some interesting topic (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=27098) on this forum, and personally I don't like its title and I suggest a change (Romanian beggars=thieves). Because I hapen to know some romanian beggars who are not thieves (usually old men/women working in agriculture. Can you imagine a pension less than 10 euros per month after some 25-30 years of hard work in the fields?). Yes, they are usually begging at home, because they don't have money to fly to other countries. But in this case, is either beggars or thieves, probably the latter (and please try do differentiate them when giving money!). And I would bet that there are thieves of different nationalities everywhere.
Otherwise, easy to say the standard cliches, like americans=something or somebody from somewhere=rednex.

Actual beggars do not fly to other countries.

Professional beggars though, do.

[Karhunkoski]

On the subject, someone said to me today, "hating someone or being violent towards them because they are from somewhere else is absolutely sick, but not choosing to mix with them or preferring to work with someone who has a similar background to your own is just natural".

[bullacc]

On the subject, someone said to me today, "hating someone or being violent towards them because they are from somewhere else is absolutely sick, but not choosing to mix with them or preferring to work with someone who has a similar background to your own is just natural".

Does sound quite a bit hypocritical, doesn't it ?

"Well, no, see, i don't hate Finns, and i wouldn't harm any of them, but i wouldn't really like working with them, or going at a pub where there are many of them."

[Hank W.]

As someone said: "I'm no hypocrite - I just hate racism & n*rs..."

[bullacc]

As someone said: "I'm no hypocrite - I just hate racism & n*rs..."

Exactly my point.

[MTB]

Actual beggars do not fly to other countries.

Professional beggars though, do.

Now it depends what you understand by "professional beggars". There was one "statue" in Pohjoisesplanadi, interesting to see, I even took a pictures and he asked for money. It was ok by me. There's the guy in railway station, producing some recorded sounds with some glasses, interesting to hear. There was a "tenor" on Aleksanterinkatu last summer, he was singing rather good. Their are different nationalities, none of them is romanian. And what you might call romanian beggars, they are actually not always able to speak romanian correctly, but they are able to speak other language, more international one (not english, french or german either). My opionion is that people should be very carefull when giving money. I refused several drunks here asking for money to buy another beer (they were even saying they want money for alcohol). Much better to deposit and giving them to people who are actually in need. There was an old man at a metro station near romanian governemnt building selling postcards and pencils, and we used to give him money from time to time, but we were not able to get away without at least one pencil or postcard everytime. He was saying that he is not a beggar, he just wants to have some money to be able to live. You'll never see him abroad, though. On the other hand, it happend several times that young beggars were asking for money to buy bread, and we bought bread to them, and they refused it and start cursing. It is a good way to distinguish if somebody is really in need or not.

[bullacc]

Now it depends what you understand by "professional beggars". There was one "statue" in Pohjoisesplanadi, interesting to see, I even took a pictures and he asked for money. It was ok by me. There's the guy in railway station, producing some recorded sounds with some glasses, interesting to hear. There was a "tenor" on Aleksanterinkatu last summer, he was singing rather good. Their are different nationalities, none of them is romanian. And what you might call romanian beggars, they are actually not always able to speak romanian correctly, but they are able to speak other language, more international one (not english, french or german either). My opionion is that people should be very carefull when giving money. I refused several drunks here asking for money to buy another beer (they were even saying they want money for alcohol). Much better to deposit and giving them to people who are actually in need. There was an old man at a metro station near romanian governemnt building selling postcards and pencils, and we used to give him money from time to time, but we were not able to get away without at least one pencil or postcard everytime. He was saying that he is not a beggar, he just wants to have some money to be able to live. You'll never see him abroad, though. On the other hand, it happend several times that young beggars were asking for money to buy bread, and we bought bread to them, and they refused it and start cursing. It is a good way to distinguish if somebody is really in need or not.

I define actual beggars as being people with not enough money, or desire to work in 9-5 jobs.
Those usually either don't like begging very much, but have to do it, or try to provide some kind of service, to feel like they are not begging.

Professional beggars, on the other hand, usually do not work alone - they have fixed spots, or territories for begging, which they defend forcefully against anyone that might try to beg there.
They usually give the money they make to other people - children to their parents, and the parents to the people that brought them there, and who control the networks.

Most beggars nowadays are part of the latter category. They don't beg because they don't have anything to eat, they beg because of either being forced to by someone, or because begging, when done this way, is very lucrative for the people on top.