finland needs workers

[vincebel]

http://yle.fi/news/id88573.html
im there and waiting

[Tiwaz]

Which fails to take into account loss of jobs which is almost epidemic these days.
Single factories shutting down and shipping to China mean hudreds if not thousands of lost jobs, effectively releasing workforce.

And there is still problem of language. You can try, but you can't make average finn accept service in languages beyond finnish and swedish.

If you can't communicate with client, you are worthless. If communicating with you annoys client, you are worthless.

[shrecher]

Being very close with Finnish business, I can confirm, this publication says true. There is demand for qualified workers and job market is overheated. Unlikely, it will very much down soon, unless bad recession. However, there is keyword here qualified. To find the work here and be needed the person should invest something in him- or herself. Like to get the education, experience, good references, have good English.

[sinikettu]

Jobs with the likes of Nokia are not what this is all about.
The main need is in the Service Industries and Health and Social Services.
I read somewhere, probably the Hesa, that over 40% of current Social Services managers are due to retire in the next 5 years, normal rate is closer to 25%.

Richard B mention in another thread that Sokos Hotels and Restaurants are running open days trying to find more potential staff..Nation Wide.
By the end of this year (September) there will be new BIG Hotel out near the airport, and at Tapiola the renovated double size hotel will re-open.
There is a new Hotel Health Resort complex opening in one of the Lapland resorts in September..
Staffing is a nightmare for Sokos management..
Because Finnish and English are a must have..forget Swedish..that is a "nice but not essential"..but if you also have Russian...

[Hank W.]

The problem is to match those who want the job and those jobs who need something to do them. What the problem is the employers are "too picky" - of course they "want" but they're not satisfied with who they "get" asking for those jobs. I think publishing this kind of news is irresponsible as then theres all of a sudden the 100 000 people asking "so where are the jobs"... the employers should "stop whining" and employ the people in the country first, many of which are integrated but still have a problem finding a job because they are named Mohamed instead of Juha-Matti...

[Tiwaz]

Or are called Juha-Matti, but employer just insists on getting Pertti 25yo who has 10 years of experience in similar position. (and is cheap)

For some odd reason, persona like Pertti tends to be rare find in job markets everywhere.

[shrecher]

the employers should "stop whining" and employ the people in the country first, many of which are integrated but still have a problem finding a job because they are named Mohamed instead of Juha-Matti...

I think we live in different Finland. Possibly, Finland outside of Kehä 3 is very different, but inside the companies would be glad to hire any nationality, as long as a person meets the expectation on the qualification. They are very tolerant. I even can't imagine if HR worker is braining like "I won't make offer to this Mohamed even so he is good, but I'll still struggle to search for Juha-Matti", this is impossible. Can you give at least one company name in Finland who would potentially express such vision on HR? No such companies here, NO.

[Hank W.]

Yes well then either the Mohamed's thern arent "good enough" or whats this high unemployment rate and discrimination hogwash presented all the time?

[rinso]

Possibly, Finland outside of Kehä 3 is very different,

Yes definitely.

I even can't imagine if HR worker is braining like "I won't make offer to this Mohamed even so he is good,

It is probably even illegal to say such a thing. So nobody will admit to it. But I'm convinced that it is still in the back of the mind of many recruiting officers (unfortunately).
They are often looking for someone who can do the job and fits in best, not who does the job best and maybe fit in.
In my personal experiences, looking for "the best in the class" doesn't always give the best results for the company. Social aspects are often just as important as knowledge.

[shrecher]

Yes well then either the Mohamed's thern arent "good enough" or whats this high unemployment rate and discrimination hogwash presented all the time?

One of these is Zion Umukoro, from Nigeria. He works as a cleaner, even though he has degrees in engineering and computer science.

I have no idea what is the quality of Zion's degree and his experience, but if you look at at this then you see, clearly there are a lots of opportunities to work in IT at all levels. Even at this forum, I see sometimes IT job ads from companies saying "no Finnish needed" or similarly. So, such example is not looking relevant.

[shrecher]

Social aspects are often just as important as knowledge.

I have never seen at work any social conflicts caused by nationality. What I do wrong?
Why a recruiter should have back mind like this: "she/he is not Finn and, thus, it will cause social disbalance at the teams".

Yes, Finns are picky for foreign education system. Actually, I'm too. But in Finland there is nice OPH.fi, where degree could be legalized officially. This guy from Nigeria could legalize diploma and the fortune might turn him by bright side

[rinso]

I have never seen at work any social conflicts caused by nationality.

I have seen many, based on race, age, nationality, gender,...
And of course most were no open conflicts, but small things that made the discriminated person less efficient.

Why a recruiter should have back mind like this: "she/he is not Finn and, thus, it will cause social disbalance at the teams".

I don't know if their fear is justified. But many don't want to take the risk if they can avoid it.

[Hank W.]

I have no idea what is the quality of Zion's degree and his experience, but if you look at at this then you see, clearly there are a lots of opportunities to work in IT at all levels. Even at this forum, I see sometimes IT job ads from companies saying "no Finnish needed" or similarly. So, such example is not looking relevant.

So why doesn't Zion then have a job? After all he's now got Finnish education and everything? Or is the truth that the companies want to just hand-pick the raisins out of the pulla? And why do we then have to import 100 000 workers more, when theres several Zion's here already without a job? I think they should come forth in saying what kind of qualifications exactly they're looking for - and then stop complaining they have a "shortage" if they're wanting the moon from the sky. Same thing they don't hire "old people"...

[Tiwaz]

Yes well then either the Mohamed's thern arent "good enough" or whats this high unemployment rate and discrimination hogwash presented all the time?

One of these is Zion Umukoro, from Nigeria. He works as a cleaner, even though he has degrees in engineering and computer science.

I have no idea what is the quality of Zion's degree and his experience, but if you look at at this then you see, clearly there are a lots of opportunities to work in IT at all levels. Even at this forum, I see sometimes IT job ads from companies saying "no Finnish needed" or similarly. So, such example is not looking relevant.

And of course IT and those 2-3 companies you know of is the whole Finland!

Get your head out of your arse and realise that situation is not that simple. Most jobs are NOT in huge corporations, they are in small to midsize businesses which have far more invested in their recruit than Nokia. They want person they know is not going to get nerve breakdown come first winter and run to sunshine, one who can communicate with both local and foreign clients and do not cause unnecessary tensions/problems in workforce through their odd behaviour. Basically they want someone who fits into finnish work culture without problems, generally this is not same as immigrant.

THESE are the companies which do most of hiring because there are so many. But they also avoid risks in hiring. Unknown foreigner tends to be risk.

And that is IT business, one of the most liberal ones when it comes to hiring immigrants. In any service task you need fluent finnish, because asking your clients to change language because you could not get off your lazy ass to learn local lingo is not going to make you huge success in service business.

I have seen guys of italian, indian and turkish origin in service industry (off the top of my head but most likely others as well). Guess what was the language each one spoke, at least decently...

Finnish.

And most other industries are much like service industry. Odd ones like construction where workers do not have contact with clients are different thing. But even then there has to be enough language skills to communicate what is needed along with understanding on how building goes in Finland. Even though quality of building is going down (mainly due to hurry), inspectors still expect some things to be done right.

[shrecher]

So why doesn't Zion then have a job? After all he's now got Finnish education and everything?

This publication doesn't say that Zion got got Finnish education. Moreover, he is working as cleaner, which is not contributing his IT specialty experience. Then "he began studying construction engineering here in Finland". Well, again the article doesn't say anything has he completed it or not. Finally, what we know, he is neither IT engineer nor construction worker yet. So, what job he should ask for?

Beside this, YLE wrote

"We have a tendency in Finland of not recognizing skills from other countries,"

I totally agree. Being foreign I saw some other countries and level of education sometime is far from Finnish one. However, nobody prevents to legalize the diploma at OPH. I did it for Master of CS. No problems, just 6 months and paper work.