Talents and skills, but no certificates?

annanymous · Post by **annanymous** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:33 pm

Hi all,

I'm a 24 years old German, currently living in Iceland with my (Icelandic) boyfriend. I finished my undergraduate geography studies in Germany, before going to Iceland to study earth and environmental sciences for two semesters. After that, I was going to take the "Vordiplom" exam back in Germany, but for health and love reasons I decided to take a break and continue my studies abroad later.
So now both health and love are excellent and my boyfriend and I are going to move to Helsinki, we'll have an apartment from September... Oh well, just two more idiots coming to Finland without any professional perspective - but at least I've been reading in this beautiful forum for months, so I know it's not going to be easy.

Here in Reykjavik I've been serving breakfast at a ****-hotel for 10 months, people like me and want to write a reference letter for me. I also have a little experience as a bartender, as a sales person in a bakery and as a volunteer youth worker, but no proofs whatsoever of that.
My English is very good, my German is excellent even compared to other natives, my French is good enough for prolonged discussions and I'm an intermediate learner of Icelandic, Swedish and (yay) Finnish. In fact I think Finnish is great fun, I've progressed from nothing last August to about B1 level now (according to Dialang), and I want to prove C1 skills this winter so I can apply for university.
I'm very interested in environmental issues, research, and ecotourism (took related courses at university) and I'm probably at least as good as many certified dietitians by now, because I've had to learn a lot about healthy nutrition for my own purposes (severely restricted diet). Oh, I can cook and bake excellent gluten-free and even starch-free food (according to myself, my omnivore boyfriend and other people). I've been traveling through most European countries and I know a lot about the different transportation options and special fares there, I'm good at internet research in various languages... yada yada...

Ok, in case anyone cared to read all that... what do you think I'd be able to do from September until next summer? Should I bother with applications for semi-decent jobs at all, should I try and present my skills on a personal homepage (oh yeah, I know a little html and webdesign and image processing, too..), or rather go to that big cleaning company right away? I wouldn't really mind the latter, as long as I'd be able to save some more money (I can get by with very little).

And bonus question: What about my boyfriend? Will his Nordic-ness be of any use, if he only has an excellent school-leaving certificate and very little job experience? He still hasn't managed to learn much Finnish.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Uli

**Sponsor:**

Hank W. · Post by **Hank W.** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:46 pm

Should I bother with applications for semi-decent jobs at all, should I try and present my skills on a personal homepage (oh yeah, I know a little html and webdesign and image processing, too..), or rather go to that big cleaning company right away?

Go to that big cleaning company (or the hotels) right away, send the applications for the semi-decent jobs (you never know if the blind grain finds the chicken) and make your webpage if you got time, but the only emails will be from spammers with oil millions...

Will his Nordic-ness be of any use

Don't have much banana growing happening in these parts, nor aluminum factories, so what else can he do? The only usefulness is as a Nordic he gets directly on KELA due to certain agreements.

interleukin · Post by **interleukin** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:50 pm

And bonus question: What about my boyfriend? Will his Nordic-ness be of any use, if he only has an excellent school-leaving certificate and very little job experience? He still hasn't managed to learn much Finnish.

No, probably not. My boyfriend is Finnish, but Swedish speaking, and even he is finding it hard to find jobs due to lack of Finnish.

You will both look very much like Finns (people stop and ask me directions all the time so I obviously fit in), so no problems with being treated well, but without language skills and acting Finnish, finding a job is quite hard.

BUT nothing is impossible, so I wish you luck.

I think Icelandic and German people have in common a complex grammar in their native languages, making the Finnish grammar not so scary. I know it is like that for me, I have not encountered any Finnish grammar that is even close to the Icelandic one, it is the vocabulary and puhekieli that is hard for me. (I have heard that it is the opposite for most other people, they can talk and understand things, but do not bother with the grammar).

The Icelandic banks Kaupþing (known as Kaupthing here) and Glitnir and maybe other Icelandic companies have offices and business here in Finland. If he knows anyone on the Icelandic side, maybe they can help him get a job in Finland?

Another thing could be if he (and even you) could find a job where Swedish is used. Swedish is a mix of Icelandic and German and French (in my "unbiased" opinion), so your boyfriend at least should have no problems there. Not so easy to find, but maybe easier while improving the Finnish skills. If nothing else, make sure to be registered as Swedish-speaking at the Maistratti (=Þjóðskrá) when you move here, and then at least official papers you get sent will be in Swedish. It makes it a lot easier to deal with the bureaucracy.

/interleukin

interleukin · Post by **interleukin** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:53 pm

but the only emails will be from spammers with oil millions...

Yes, that is something that I and others have been surprised at. You apply and apply for jobs, and they don't even bother to reply to tell you they don't want you. It is important not take the lack of replies personally, this is how it is.

annanymous · Post by **annanymous** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:22 pm

Wow, thanks for your replies.

I was just thinking that, since Finnish employers are such racists (as everyone in this forum knows), they might prefer the Viking race

So does it make sense to apply at those cleaning etc. companies before arrival, or do we even just show up there in person, like in Iceland?

And yes, interleukin, there's nothing like Icelandic grammar *shudder* but I can learn 50 or more Finnish words a day, too. It's like I used to speak Finnish in a previous life

Hank W. · Post by **Hank W.** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:00 pm

annanymous wrote: they might prefer the Viking race

Not after Björk cancelled, untrustworthy - good ice he'll go fishing

So does it make sense to apply at those cleaning etc. companies before arrival, or do we even just show up there in person, like in Iceland?

More or less - you can send a CV before but I'd just check all the places and addresses. If you're not adverse to hotel room cleaning I can give a few pointers.... and while you are at it, they do need "linguistic" persons as French is rare here and we still get loads of Germans so get the nice papers from the hotel. You can get in through the laundry room door so to speak.

annanymous · Post by **annanymous** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 11:19 pm

Hank W. wrote: Not after Björk cancelled, untrustworthy - good ice he'll go fishing

Haha right, I read about that - hey, in Finnish and without a dictionary, by the way (just with some educated guessing)...

If you're not adverse to hotel room cleaning I can give a few pointers.... and while you are at it, they do need "linguistic" persons as French is rare here and we still get loads of Germans so get the nice papers from the hotel. You can get in through the laundry room door so to speak.

Well, I know that hotel room cleaning is no fun (I know some Polish and Thai girls here who do it), but I guess I'd be alright with it for a while.
French, you say. None of my favorites any more, but I was once asked by natives what part of the country I was from, so I should brush it up, would be a waste to lose it anyway.

Hank W. · Post by **Hank W.** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 11:47 pm

I was asked with my french "where is the big black man that was here?" -I speak Martiniquan and creole accents

Really I have the Icelandic "i know someone" in Finnish in the hotels, but really its just a few randoms.

hackoff · Post by **hackoff** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:14 am

good to mention that sometimes ( if not all the time ) they ask if you have a cleaning certificate ( a degree lol )

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:42 am

a hygiene pass - racial hygiene pass

easily-lost · Post by **easily-lost** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:08 pm

If you have got talents and skills (including the ability to find the right people to talk to and the knowledge of where your major can be used), I don't think certificates matter that much. I just don't understand why people would jump to the cleaning job directly no matter what their major or degree is. If all graduates would do things which are not related to what they learned in universities, why bother studying it then?!

One thing I wonder why you won't try is, if you two already decided to MOVE to Finland, to study here as a start? It will make your life much easier in Finland with a Finnish degree afterwards as well as finding a part-time job during studies. Good luck anyway!

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:27 pm

ecotourism in kusamo in polytech, eräopaskoulutusta - languages are good to have

annanymous · Post by **annanymous** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 7:41 pm

easily-lost wrote: I just don't understand why people would jump to the cleaning job directly no matter what their major or degree is.

Because you get the impression that as an immigrant without native fluency in Finnish, you must be happy about -any- kind of job.

If all graduates would do things which are not related to what they learned in universities, why bother studying it then?!

Because I was seriously interested in it...

One thing I wonder why you won't try is, if you two already decided to MOVE to Finland, to study here as a start?

Because I don't have a degree, so I can't apply for a Master's programme, and everything else is in Finnish. That's why I'm planning to take that language test in winter.

Good luck anyway!

Thank you =)

easily-lost · Post by **easily-lost** » Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:36 am

annanymous wrote: Because you get the impression that as an immigrant without native fluency in Finnish, you must be happy about -any- kind of job.

That's a myth.

If all graduates would do things which are not related to what they learned in universities, why bother studying it then?!
Because I was seriously interested in it...

I don't believe your major is completely useless in Finland. And if you already prepared (other than merely "wanted") to move here, (which means longer than 1 year at least, I guess?) haven't you contacted any company or people that may be interested in hiring you beforehand? How brave you two are to decide moving to a place that you barely even know without any contact!

rauginta_kojine · Post by **rauginta_kojine** » Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:39 am

annanymous wrote:Because I don't have a degree, so I can't apply for a Master's programme, and everything else is in Finnish. That's why I'm planning to take that language test in winter.

No, you are not right. This autumn I am going to apply to Haaga Helia Bachelor degree in Business Administration, you can check there what else they have in english. Also Helsinki School of Economics provides some degrees in english. Then Metropolia University (Stadia)...then Sibelius Music Academy...and maybe some Art Polytechnic.. you just have to search a little.

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