Which supermarkets best for organic?

[OliBlom]

I think im "different", im so fed up with this "organic" or "luomu" that i choose power fed meat, unhappy chickens eggs, non fair bananas, non healthy grease and such
Luomu cant feed current population.

Nothing wrong with being different.................just don't be fooled by the propoganda from research funded by "big food" (ie. Monsanto et al) such as Alex Avery's "The Truth about Organic Food" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Avery_(researcher)<)

IMO the fewer chemicals sprayed and hormones injected into the food I eat the better........but that is just my preference!

[Rosamunda]

Well, my neighbours have a garden full of produce and many of the rintamamiestalo in Friisilä have vegetable gardens (though the tendency is for them to be sold off for development). Of course people in the city don't have that possibility (you can rent an allotment from the council; it is not necessary to buy them) but a lot of Finns do live in rural areas and grow their own. And everyone I know picks berries when they get the chance. Maybe it's a generation thing and I just know older people than you do who are more likely to fish, hunt, grow and pick. Not sure.

With lamb and beef at SILLY prices (just for the regular stuff from Ostrobothnia) it is unlikely that organic will take off as most people simply can't afford it. Which is why Stockmann doesn't always have it but will order it for you. It is not economically viable for farms to go organic in Finland as they just can't produce and sell the quantities necessary to make a profit. Eggs and milk are exceptions but this is more likely due to labelling rules and regulations than economics.

Sure, there is more organic produce available now in the UK than there used to be (not difficult) but it is not cheap (unless you convert it to € at the current exchange rate ). OTOH it is easy enough to buy organic food from the internet in the UK and have it mail ordered to your door. I didn't notice any organic supermarkets, I'm sure there are a few dotted around but they haven't got as far as the south-west. As for importing organic food.... that seems slightly weird to me. One reason I would eat organic food is because it is local and fresh, I try not to buy fruit and veg, meat or fish that has flown half way round the world.

As for Finland. The best way to eat organic is to go get it yourself. If you don't hunt, fish, grow or pick your own then you need to google for the organic farms and spend a weekend driving around the countryside (beautiful in the autumn) and fill up your freezer/cupboards. http://www.luomu.fi/linkit/

[carolinemaher]

Its great that your neighbour has a garden full of produce and Friisila have vegetable gardens, but I live in an urban area in Helsinki which has nearly 100% flats and there are no gardens - that was my point - pop out to your local store if you live in the city and the only organic meat available will be beef mince and in the veg section at best organic carrots/swede/apples/pears maybe - not a great selection. I didn't know you can rent allotments though, I'll look into that.

I know organic produce in the UK is not cheap, but, it is there if you are prepared to pay for it. If there are no specific organic shops in the South West you know you can walk into a Tesco or a Sainsburys supermarket and they will have a fantastic range of organic fruit and veg and the full range of organic meat, there is no comparison. I'm not slagging off Finland here, I'm simply pointing out that the availability and range of organic produce here is poor compared to other places in Europe where I have lived (UK/Germany). I do know lots of Finns that pick berries, I am also a recent convert and try to do that as often as I can, my little girl loves strawberries and picking her own, nice thing to be able to do for sure.

Anyway, some good news - I went to Stockmann in the city centre today (I usually go to the one in the Itakeskus where they only have organic beef mince) and they have started selling organic beef and pork, not the little off cuts that you find in the K market but proper pork chops/tenderloin and beef steak, the (very friendly) butcher said they are now getting a delivery of this (Finnish) meat every Wednesday afternoon. I spoke to him about organic chicken and he said they tried to sell it 3 years ago but there wasn't a demand for it, but they will maybe try again next year as there seems to be a demand for it, all good news ..

[Kupcake]

Anyway, some good news - I went to Stockmann in the city centre today (I usually go to the one in the Itakeskus where they only have organic beef mince) and they have started selling organic beef and pork, not the little off cuts that you find in the K market but proper pork chops/tenderloin and beef steak, the (very friendly) butcher said they are now getting a delivery of this (Finnish) meat every Wednesday afternoon. I spoke to him about organic chicken and he said they tried to sell it 3 years ago but there wasn't a demand for it, but they will maybe try again next year as there seems to be a demand for it, all good news ..

Thanks for letting us know. I'll check it out myself next time i'm in there, and i'll be sure to ask about the organic chicken too. If they're sure of the demand they might bring it in earlier. Did you ask if they would order it in for you as a separate order?

[carolinemaher]

No, I didn't ask about a separate order, I just sort of presumed it wouldn't be possible as no-one would be producing just a few organic chickens - but, you are right, the more people ask for it the better.

[sazzie]

caroline---excellent news! Does the beef taste better? I've had a hard time with finnish beef so far, just tastes weird.

[carolinemaher]

Sazzie, you know before I moved to Finland I used to eat mostly lamb or chicken and never really ate any beef, but saying as you can't really find organic chicken or lamb I've started to eat beef, so I can't really compare which is better, all I can say is I made chargrilled steak with some herb butter and chips and it was a nice meal!I think I paid about EUR 12 for 3 steaks which isn't that bad..

[sazzie]

Thanks. Stockman in Itakeskus now sells luomu ground beef and pork chops FYI. The ground beef made excellent burgers.

[Tiwaz]

I know organic produce in the UK is not cheap, but, it is there if you are prepared to pay for it. If there are no specific organic shops in the South West you know you can walk into a Tesco or a Sainsburys supermarket and they will have a fantastic range of organic fruit and veg and the full range of organic meat, there is no comparison. I'm not slagging off Finland here, I'm simply pointing out that the availability and range of organic produce here is poor compared to other places in Europe where I have lived (UK/Germany). I do know lots of Finns that pick berries, I am also a recent convert and try to do that as often as I can, my little girl loves strawberries and picking her own, nice thing to be able to do for sure.

It all depends on definitions.

What you should do is to take requirements for "organic" food in UK, "regular" food in UK and compare them to Finnish versions.
At least it has been tradition that all standards and requirements over here have been far more strict. Thus it might be possible that what you would get from your average store, if you purchase Finnish, is closer to UK organic than UK regular.

[inkku]

I know organic produce in the UK is not cheap, but, it is there if you are prepared to pay for it. If there are no specific organic shops in the South West you know you can walk into a Tesco or a Sainsburys supermarket and they will have a fantastic range of organic fruit and veg and the full range of organic meat, there is no comparison. I'm not slagging off Finland here, I'm simply pointing out that the availability and range of organic produce here is poor compared to other places in Europe where I have lived (UK/Germany). I do know lots of Finns that pick berries, I am also a recent convert and try to do that as often as I can, my little girl loves strawberries and picking her own, nice thing to be able to do for sure.

It all depends on definitions.

What you should do is to take requirements for "organic" food in UK, "regular" food in UK and compare them to Finnish versions.
At least it has been tradition that all standards and requirements over here have been far more strict. Thus it might be possible that what you would get from your average store, if you purchase Finnish, is closer to UK organic than UK regular.

Tiwaz, if you do not know what organic is, choose another thread. Organic is certified.

[carolinemaher]

Tiwaz -I don't know how you figure out that land is somehow 'purer' in Finland than in the UK, but the bottom line is food that is not organic anywhere in the world is sprayed with chemicals and organic is not.. In the UK I looked for food certified by www.soilassociation.org

[Tiwaz]

[

Tiwaz, if you do not know what organic is, choose another thread. Organic is certified.

And certified means? Hmm?

Oh gosh! If you had thought you would understand that certificate equals definition!
"If you fulfill criterias 1,2 and 3 you get to use our certificate!"
They have DEFINED certain criteria which will qualify for certificate.

Organic does not necessarily mean same thing everywhere. In EU right now, yes. But not everywhere, as what passes for organic is question of definition.

And caroline, Finland has had far more strict laws and regulations on what kind of content food may have. For example the infamous use of hormones to make cattle grow faster, denied in Finland. And so forth and so forth. So while average Finnish farm has used chemicals, it has used them far less than average UK farm. Thus, it may be closer in content to UK organic than UK regular.

Because of this, whole organic has never caught really fire in Finland.

[Pursuivant]

my dad grew potatos and onions and marrows and carrots and whatnot... back in the 70's he used "apulanta" I still got a few bags of (whatever chemical guano is)... after he read some books he devised a system he rot nettles to get the urea out and used that as a nitrogen fertilizer... and of course composting....

so that was "organic" and you are welcome to take your certificates and shove them up your arses.

[Rosamunda]

Everything I grow is pesticide free and herbicide free and watered with lake water and picked by hand. But it is not certified organic.

Getting a certification stamp costs money.... the farms have to pay for the registration and the logo and for the privilege of being inspected regularly. I guess a lot just can't be bothered because the marginal price difference is not enough to offset the hassle.

[Meresjeva]

>>>What you should do is to take requirements for "organic" food in UK, "regular" food in UK and compare them to Finnish versions

Huh! Agree!

Btw in Southern Korea all Finnish food is sold as "organic", since Finland uses only about 10% of the EU chemical spray allowance. I guess most of the bugs die by themselves here:)

As far as the organic versus non-organic - I interviewed Rose Gray from London River Cafe while writing an article about organic food and she stated that in current conditions she would not necessarily go organic, since organic, say, chicken in the UK are grown as quickly as possible to feed the newly acquired fashion. They do not have much taste.

Fergus Henderson from St John restaurant does support this point of view, too, sticking to the idea of happy-go-lucky pigs:).

While in the UK, at some point I made an experiment: bought 7 different products (meat, fish, veg, fruit), each of them in organic, free-range/"garden" and non-organic version. I made sure that they are the same breed/type/variety. Then I tried them raw or cooked them as simply as possible in order to preserve natural tastes. There were different taste results for different versions, and some organic stuff, alas, tasted of nothing.

It probably is a personal point of view, but I find quite a lot of average Finnish ingredients tastier than those in the UK. I would not touch supermarket (non free-range) pork or broileri here, though. Recently I found myself unable to eat 20 broiler eggs that someone left in the cottage where I am staying now... Wonder if I can feed them to foxes?:)

Anyway, talking practice, there is a free-range Hereford/Aberdeen Angus farmer/beef supplier on Wattkast (off the island of Korppoo in the Arhipelago where I currently live), they do very good (Åaland-like?) lamb, too, and sell "unwashed":))) chicken eggs:) Their names are Johanna (tel.050 30 80 265) and Thomas (tel. 0400 89 35 96) and beef packages normally start from 10kg, - but go and talk to them.

There's a free-range pork stand at the market in Turku as well as the sausage casings supply. Will post exact names once I'm there again and take a note.

Sorry if it's an old topic, - I've been off the forum for quite a while.