Fiorenza from Italy! one more job seeker! ;)

[Fiorenza]

Hello to everyone!
this morning I was feeling bit down because I can't find not even one job in Helsinki, so desperatly I searched on the net and I found this forum where I hope i can share my feelings and hopefully receive some nice words from some new friends or some strenght to keep on going!
My name is Fiorenza, I'm 25 years old and I come from Italy. Almost 1 month ago I moved to Helsinki where I'm living permanently with my Finnish boyfriend. As many others I'm looking for a job and I don't talk fluent Finnish.
I know I must learn it as soon as possible but let me say that I don't understand how it's possibly so hard to get a very basic job even without the Finnish. I mean I hard that Finnish society is looking for new workers even from abroad because are needed but then once u are here even to be a cleaner you must have a fluent Finnish! I know is the mother tongue, but it's also true that almost everyone in here talks english very well. Anyway I especially angry with the recruitment agencies! none of them offered any job, it felt I was bordering the assistents when i went to ask for jobs.
I don't talk fluent finnish but I have already studied so I've some basics, but still isn't enough even to clean dishes!
I mean If they need workers how can they aspect them to talk fluent Finnish which is one of the most difficult language in the world! it takes years!

then in the other hand I hard from a lot of foreigns who don't speak at all Finnish working as waiter/waitress, cleaner, wash disher etc etc......

So, I wondering what am I doing wrong? or if I'm contacting the wrong recruitment agencies because as I said I know some basic Finnish but by now the only answers I got from the angecies are they need a fluent language skills!!

Sorry for this "outburst"
Maybe I said silly things but It's just that I'm very kicking to start to work hard and it's frustrating to see that nobodies wants to give me the chance to. A society which is in a way "wasting" a lot of work power coming from the foreign as me who moved here very willing and motived to work and learn and increase = increase also the proficts of the companies. That's my opinio, which could be totally wrong..

Thank you

I hope to hear some good suggestions or other exeperiences
Fiorenza

[Pursuivant]

*sigh* this is a story heard all too often. meanwhile the politicos claim "we need immigrants" and the industry laments their "need for workers". I don't understand but then again theres a lot I don't understand

[kghp2006]

Hi Fiorenza,

Like yourself I have moved to Finland to be with my girlfriend and I am encountering the exact same problems as you. From what I hear the best time to get a job will be January. In the meantime I have been forced to work side by side with my GF and believe me thats not easy She runs a tight ship!
All I can say is dont give up!!! The job will come maybe just not as soon as you would like.
I dont buy into this fluent Finnish BS. Yes I will try my utmost to learn the lanuguage but for godsake give us a break!! Its nigh impossible. Nearly every person I have met speaks great English and communication has not been a problem thus far.
As for the job agencies....forget about them. Lying trolls is all they are.

KG

[Tiwaz]

So who here thinks that Finns are happy to use English to get you do your job in Finland?

If they can get someone else to do the same thing without need for English....

That Finns speak English does not mean that Finns want to or like speaking English. You, as employee without any critical skills, are the one who is begging.
Not the employer.

By the way, giving a break is not necessarily common trait in Finnish society. You either swim or drown.

[Kylie]

Same here- Came to live with my boyfriend and haven't been able to find a decent job its so disheartening I mean I haven't even had replies from cleaning companies.

I just keep hoping that someone will come up

do you mind me asking why you say January is a good time to find a job?

[Fiorenza]

Thank you all for the nice replays. And yeah, as I understood as well the work situation should change by January-Febraury cause now seams to be low season....though we are close to PikkuJoulut.
But anyway. I totally understand that you can't move to Finland and require them to talk English otherwise I should have moved to England or Irland. What I don't understand is that, as someone said, the governement says"we need immigrants" and the industry is in need of workers, but obviously immigrants don't talk Finnsh and seeing that is such a difficult language takes long time to learn it meanwhile the need workers; but still the industry requires the fluent finnish. It sound as a contradiction.That's what makes me wonder!....but not blaming anyone. Plus, I heard that some recruitment agencies imported immingrats from Philippine to come here to work. So, did they chose them casue they can pay them less? or we Philippine? why if I apply to the same recruitment agency they tell me there are no jobs available for me?

I just don't fully understand. Or maybe I just arrived in the wrong moment. But well, I know i should learn Finnish as soon as possible. and I will.

I won't give up!

[Pursuivant]

its easier to screw people who have lower expectancies - they think they get a good deal.

[blaugrau]

There's only one thing in your post I think was not quite right. You don't "need" Finnish in order to mop a floor. When you apply for these jobs, it's not that you aren't good enough to mop a floor. It's that it's just simpler to go with the Finn.

So you aren't doing anything "wrong". In the meantime, sign up for all the Finnish classes you can find. Approach the churches in your area too because many of them have volunteer English tutors. There are community centres that allow you to drop in and practice your conversation skills. And in every other spare second have the tv on absorbing even just a couple of words in each sentence.

In my experience, the main reason why you need a working knowledge of Finnish in manual jobs is -- that the other people working there, or the bosses there, do NOT speak English. The impression that everyone speaks English in Finland stems mainly from being a tourist in customer-service oriented surroundings where people are especially recruited to be multilingual (to being able to serve tourists), but that's a specialized industry only and doesn't represent the spectrum of Finnish work life, and especially not manual jobs. The ones who do speak English in these jobs are more likely to be your other foreign co-workers (those who've lived here long enough to also speak quite good Finnish though), but hardly will the bosses speak English and hardly will they want to employ someone who they can't communicate with.. so I think that's why I think it's so difficult especially in manual jobs.

My advice: do try to get over the threshold of using your imperfect Finnish in as many everyday life situations as possible. Write job applications in FINNISH only. Practice certain sentences that are useful in everyday life (make sure you understand what you're saying and why you use the words in precisely that form). Experiencing that saying stuff in Finnish "works" (has effects in real life) even if it's basic will most probably increase your self-confidence in speaking and learning Finnish etc. I believe it's crucial you develop a certain boldness to speak and don't be ashamed about your Tarzan-Finnish.

My impression is, that as long as you speak in English and apply for jobs in English, they'll tell you you'll need fluent Finnish.
But if you simply try as much simple Finnish as you can (and not use English at all), cleaning agencies might end up to be more flexible than they themselves thought (and give you the job although your Finnish is basic as opposed to fluent, providing they are desperate enough to find workers).

Of course it's always a matter of luck as well, but I think refined strategies might have some degree of effect.

[EP]

Does anybody remember that Italian girl who came to live with her Finnish boyfriend in Tampere? What was her name?

I remember when she came she found it impossible to find a job, and she really tried a long time. Then she finally got a job as a hotel cleaner. She did that quite a long time, and some time ago (last spring?) she wrote here that she has found an interesting job that is like made for her.

So it is possible.

[Pursuivant]

In my experience, the main reason why you need a working knowledge of Finnish in manual jobs is -- that the other people working there, or the bosses there, do NOT speak English.

which is if they had learned languages they wouldn't be in those jobs... the thing is then when you get a "critical mass" then it gets easier. the hotel housekeeping is one example.

[blaugrau]

Does anybody remember that Italian girl who came to live with her Finnish boyfriend in Tampere? What was her name?

I remember when she came she found it impossible to find a job, and she really tried a long time. Then she finally got a job as a hotel cleaner. She did that quite a long time, and some time ago (last spring?) she wrote here that she has found an interesting job that is like made for her.

So it is possible.

Sure it's possible (my case was just like that described), but to some extent you have to have the right strategy in order to improve your odds. What worked for me is to keep the business of jobseeking completely in Finnish despite being at a very very basic level at the time and having a hard time understanding what people said. But if you prepare yourself for these situations linguistically, and keep all communication with employers in Finnish, they might end up to be more flexible than they thought, and their standards of "fluent finnish" might be less high in the end than they thought. My personal theory is that asking whether English is ok is more psychologically threatening to them than speaking crap Finnish.

Also think of multiple job avenues, you could try to get the hygieniapassi (which is a food safety test you can pass in English and is a prerequisite for e.g. some factory jobs or even sometimes dishwashing jobs) in order to increase the number of jobs you can apply for in terms of "credentials".

[jas_rho]

I have found that it opens way more doors when you know Finnish. After getting my first job in Finland, way back in the day whenever that was, I have found it rather easy to get a job, and I have to admit I feel that its because I could also communicate in Finnish. I came here not speaking a word of it but now even though the company I work for has English as their official business language, I use Finnish every day with my coworkers. I am actually soon leaving this company to go work for yet another company that has English as their official business language but one of the main reasons I got the job was because I could also do things in Finnish, that meant a lot to them. So knowing Finnish is a big advantage. But well, I think that's what most people are trying to say here

[penelope_s]

Hi to eveyrone,
Iam soon going to deal with the same situation in few months.
Iam greek and my bf is finnish. He tried in Greece for over a year to find a job
so we can stay here but unfortunately with no greek language he couldnt find
not even as a cleaner-and we considered to be one of the most touristic places-
So it is my turn to try my luck there. Iam already learning finnish but reading
most of the posts on this forum make me feel really bad.
I have read many people saying "be realistic" or "situation with economy is hard now".
I would like to say that iam not a dreamer, i am realistic and for sure any employer
would prefer to have a finnish person than any foreign.
Just remember to say also a good word for all of us that we come in Finland willing to try.
Obstacles and difficulties will come anyway and i dont mean to "pat" us, it just cant be
only negative.

Thanx all and Good luck Fiorenza

[che77]

Plus, I heard that some recruitment agencies imported immingrats from Philippine to come here to work. So, did they chose them casue they can pay them less? or we Philippine? why if I apply to the same recruitment agency they tell me there are no jobs available for me?

I just don't fully understand. Or maybe I just arrived in the wrong moment. But well, I know i should learn Finnish as soon as possible. and I will.

I won't give up!

Maybe you heard about the group of nurses from Philippines that were recruited. i dont think they came here coz they will settle for lesser pay than their finnish counterparts. they were recruited coz finland has shortage on medical workers. on the other side, i know how you feel. i was like you 5 yrs ago. i've been living in finland for 7 yrs now and still i cant have a conversation in finnish. i do understand alot of words and basic sentences but its not good enough to land me a job in a finnish speaking environment. but i am lucky enough to have found a decent job with a decent pay without the need to speak finnish and been on this job for 4 yrs now. more often than not, finding a job in finland without being able to speak finnish can sometimes be a matter of luck.

[Pursuivant]

Finland has a "shortage" of medical workers because they don't get any decent salary nor tenures. the shortage is only illusionary - theres 3000 nurses educated yearly - within 5 years they are either moved to Norway or UK or then switched a career. the Philippinos are getting !"#¤% money and they think they are getting a good deal.