Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
I have a four year old daughter and a two year old son. Both are on the way to becoming fluent English speakers (though it is an uphill battle). After they attend Finnish language daycare, I would like to enroll them in a (free) international school. I always thought that these entrance exams would be a breeze for kids like mine (whose English is nearly as good as their Finnish), but lately I've been hearing about fluent English speaking kids who don't get in. I'd be interested to hear others experiences with the tests on both a primary and secondary school level. Is it naive to assume my kids would pass easily if they simply speak English very well? What are they actually looking for with these exams? Thanks in advance.
Last edited by Greg Kite on Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Hi...yes, I do realize that school starts at seven years of age. However, I've heard from about a thousand people that, with the English schools, you have to apply a few years in advance (don't know how true it is). As there seems to be time and money involved in the application, I would just like to know the reality beforehand. On top of this, I'm going through a divorce, and I actually have to think about these things years in advance.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Someone will a proper answer regarding english schools, pre-schooling or even english education in kindergarden. You're probably least interested in this program but this is what I know: Töölö compreensive school, lower stage.
They have a english- finnish bilingual program that students must apply and pass a test at the school to be selected to. The test does not require any language skills whatsoever but you must be a local resident or have a good excuse to have your kids there - just talk to the principal. I don't think that native english speaking children get any kind of advantage in this school, but I am not sure.
I think there is at least another one with a similar program, in Helsinki that is.
They have a english- finnish bilingual program that students must apply and pass a test at the school to be selected to. The test does not require any language skills whatsoever but you must be a local resident or have a good excuse to have your kids there - just talk to the principal. I don't think that native english speaking children get any kind of advantage in this school, but I am not sure.
I think there is at least another one with a similar program, in Helsinki that is.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
This page was hidden on Hel's pages, here's the full list and a brief description of the schools offering english language teaching.
(Check the page's sidebar for links to:
(Check the page's sidebar for links to:
- English-language teaching
French-language teaching
German-language teaching
Russian-language teaching
Estonian-language teaching
Chinese-language teaching
Spanish-language teaching )
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
All children who wish to enter a school that teaches in English need to take a language test. Children starting primary school (1st grade) also need to take the school readiness test which can be taken in English. The kids who you have heard about may have failed the readiness test rather than the language test. Children with any kind of special needs (eg dyslexia or ADHD) would probably be referred to a Finnish school where there are special classes available. The English speaking schools don't all have those resources.
I have written many posts about the tests so try using the search engine to find them.
Enrolment for public primary school happens in January in the year the child turns 7 (ie the year he starts school). You apply directly to the school you have chosen and they invite your child to the test day. There are no waiting lists as such and no money involved. All the schools in Helsinki, Espoo and Vantaa use the same test (and IIRC it is now on the same day).
OTOH I believe it is much harder to get into international daycare (for 3-6 yr olds) but these are usually privately run and they all have their own waiting lists etc. Contact them directly.
I have written many posts about the tests so try using the search engine to find them.
Enrolment for public primary school happens in January in the year the child turns 7 (ie the year he starts school). You apply directly to the school you have chosen and they invite your child to the test day. There are no waiting lists as such and no money involved. All the schools in Helsinki, Espoo and Vantaa use the same test (and IIRC it is now on the same day).
OTOH I believe it is much harder to get into international daycare (for 3-6 yr olds) but these are usually privately run and they all have their own waiting lists etc. Contact them directly.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
To the OP: on the other hand, have you thought that if you are remaining in Finland indefinitely, by placing your children in an "international school", you are automatically marginalizing them, at least a little. If they go to a Finnish school, they blend into Finnish society pretty much 100%, which is good, if it is to be expected that they will remain in Finland. If you send them to an International school, they don't get the same kind of "roots" as they would in a "normal school". Typically, the children change and rotate much more often in and International school because they are often the parents of ex-pats on company contracts who move around to different countries and have no choice but to place their kids in such schools. So, your kids might not make the kind of long-lasting friendships which other kids in the normal Finnish schools can make, 'cos their friends keep moving. They won't being going to the local school, so they won't make friends with the neighbourhood kids etc. It consigns them to always being "different", which is what they like when they are teenagers and rebelling, but when they are kids, they like to fit in. Your choice, but just something to think about.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Biscayne,
I think there is only one school in Helsinki which is truly an international school in the way you describe and that is ISH (the INternational School of Helsinki) which is a private fee-paying IB World School. The teachers and the students "rotate" (probably >30% per annum for the students) and the the majority of the students would be non-FInnish.
However, there are many "international" schools in the Greater Helsinki area which are not like that. They are simply Finnish public schools which teach the Finnish core curriculum using English as the language of education (or French, German, Russian). There is nothing significantly "international" about the school syllabus other than the emphasis on languages. Kulosaari Yhteiskoulu is a good example of one of these schools. Their international stream is taught 100% in English but the vast majority of the students are Finnish and living fulltime in Finland. The teachers are also permanent teachers mostly with the full pack of teaching qualifications from Finland. Believe me, the dominant culture in the school is Finnish, not British or American or anything else.
There is a similar school in Espoo (Espoo International) which is actually located on three different sites (Leppävaara, Olari and Tapiola) and again, the huge majority of the children are Finnish, live permanently in Finland and are local to the schools. Even though many of the teachers are non-Finns, most of them are either married to Finns and/or have been living here for many years. The Finnish core curriculum is at the core of the programme (this is obligatory) which includes, for example, TET training in 8th grade which takes place in the local community. More and more of the teaching materials are published by Finnish publishers (eg the Finnish primary maths text books and exercise books have recently been published in English). In my opinion these are very much local community schools, with one difference: they teach in English.
Currently there is a huge demand for places in these schools in Finland (there was an article in Hesari last week on this concerning a school in Tampere I think).
I would (and frequently do on this forum) recommend a "Full-Finnish" education for people who intend to stay here permanently as it is clearly the least painful route towards active bilingualism if Finnish is not spoken in the home. This is the mistake we made, my kids have struggled to achieve fluency in the "international" schools as Finnish foreign language teaching is so inadequate. However, they are very much integrated into mainstream Finnish youth culture. My youngest has friends in our street, even though they are not in his class at school. They have all played sports in local teams. And, btw, schools do not have a monopoly on educating children, at least not in our house.
I think there is only one school in Helsinki which is truly an international school in the way you describe and that is ISH (the INternational School of Helsinki) which is a private fee-paying IB World School. The teachers and the students "rotate" (probably >30% per annum for the students) and the the majority of the students would be non-FInnish.
However, there are many "international" schools in the Greater Helsinki area which are not like that. They are simply Finnish public schools which teach the Finnish core curriculum using English as the language of education (or French, German, Russian). There is nothing significantly "international" about the school syllabus other than the emphasis on languages. Kulosaari Yhteiskoulu is a good example of one of these schools. Their international stream is taught 100% in English but the vast majority of the students are Finnish and living fulltime in Finland. The teachers are also permanent teachers mostly with the full pack of teaching qualifications from Finland. Believe me, the dominant culture in the school is Finnish, not British or American or anything else.
There is a similar school in Espoo (Espoo International) which is actually located on three different sites (Leppävaara, Olari and Tapiola) and again, the huge majority of the children are Finnish, live permanently in Finland and are local to the schools. Even though many of the teachers are non-Finns, most of them are either married to Finns and/or have been living here for many years. The Finnish core curriculum is at the core of the programme (this is obligatory) which includes, for example, TET training in 8th grade which takes place in the local community. More and more of the teaching materials are published by Finnish publishers (eg the Finnish primary maths text books and exercise books have recently been published in English). In my opinion these are very much local community schools, with one difference: they teach in English.
Currently there is a huge demand for places in these schools in Finland (there was an article in Hesari last week on this concerning a school in Tampere I think).
I would (and frequently do on this forum) recommend a "Full-Finnish" education for people who intend to stay here permanently as it is clearly the least painful route towards active bilingualism if Finnish is not spoken in the home. This is the mistake we made, my kids have struggled to achieve fluency in the "international" schools as Finnish foreign language teaching is so inadequate. However, they are very much integrated into mainstream Finnish youth culture. My youngest has friends in our street, even though they are not in his class at school. They have all played sports in local teams. And, btw, schools do not have a monopoly on educating children, at least not in our house.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Penelope,
yes, that's fair enough, (what you have written), my comments were based on experience of international schools in other settings. If the dominant culture in the Finnish ones is Finnish, I would think that's better for kids who will likely be staying. I was just thinking that in general they seemed to me (in other countries) to cater pretty much for the (somewhat spoiled) kids of "ex-pat" as opposed to simply foreign parents, they move around a lot, and I personally, wouldn't send my child there if I was staying in country "x" on a long-term basis, as I would prefer to seem them fit in more and have local friends. But they seem to be somewhat different in Finland based on what you are saying.
yes, that's fair enough, (what you have written), my comments were based on experience of international schools in other settings. If the dominant culture in the Finnish ones is Finnish, I would think that's better for kids who will likely be staying. I was just thinking that in general they seemed to me (in other countries) to cater pretty much for the (somewhat spoiled) kids of "ex-pat" as opposed to simply foreign parents, they move around a lot, and I personally, wouldn't send my child there if I was staying in country "x" on a long-term basis, as I would prefer to seem them fit in more and have local friends. But they seem to be somewhat different in Finland based on what you are saying.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Hi,
My daughter (half English and half Finnish) is one of those kids who passed the tests no problem to get into Komeetta but didn't get a place (well she got a reserve place), anyway currently she has a place in Tähtiniity school (bi-lingual programme) and believe it or not we are still waiting to hear from Komettaa if she got a reserve place or not!!!! School starts next Tuesday for crying out loud!!! I am so frustrated by this whole system, which is unfair to kids and parents alike. I can not say for sure which school my daughter will go to and she is due to start school in 2 working days time!, also the after school care issue, if we need to change that arrangement that's another headache.
Out of the 41 kids that are due to start in Tähtiniity, 2 are bi-lingual, the rest have come from a language immersion programme and both parents are Finnish, so the parents evening etc. is in Finnish. I believe most of the teachers are Finnish that speak Finnish very well, one is a native English speaker from Canada. They also follow the Canadian primary school model (whatever that means). The childs Finnish needs to be perfect to get on this programme. The headmistress is lovely and the school seems to have an excellent philosophy.
My daughter went to a normal Finnish daycare/preschool.
So maybe you can detect that I am not over impressed with how this school business has been handled. Hope you have better luck.
My daughter (half English and half Finnish) is one of those kids who passed the tests no problem to get into Komeetta but didn't get a place (well she got a reserve place), anyway currently she has a place in Tähtiniity school (bi-lingual programme) and believe it or not we are still waiting to hear from Komettaa if she got a reserve place or not!!!! School starts next Tuesday for crying out loud!!! I am so frustrated by this whole system, which is unfair to kids and parents alike. I can not say for sure which school my daughter will go to and she is due to start school in 2 working days time!, also the after school care issue, if we need to change that arrangement that's another headache.
Out of the 41 kids that are due to start in Tähtiniity, 2 are bi-lingual, the rest have come from a language immersion programme and both parents are Finnish, so the parents evening etc. is in Finnish. I believe most of the teachers are Finnish that speak Finnish very well, one is a native English speaker from Canada. They also follow the Canadian primary school model (whatever that means). The childs Finnish needs to be perfect to get on this programme. The headmistress is lovely and the school seems to have an excellent philosophy.
My daughter went to a normal Finnish daycare/preschool.
So maybe you can detect that I am not over impressed with how this school business has been handled. Hope you have better luck.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
i fail to understand why the system would be unfair?estherk wrote:
My daughter (half English and half Finnish) is one of those kids who passed the tests no problem to get into Komeetta but didn't get a place (well she got a reserve place), anyway currently she has a place in Tähtiniity school (bi-lingual programme)
I am so frustrated by this whole system, which is unfair to kids and parents alike.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
The schools have to leave a certain number of places open for returning Finns from abroad. I suggest you try phoning the school to find out if you have a place or not. There might be somebody there this week, there will certainly be staff there on Monday.
If you feel you have been treated unfairly, then you should contact the koulutuskeskus in Espoonkeskus and give them details. The system is supposed to be fair.
I have heard of cases before where children of native English speakers have not been selected. The tests are well-constructed and I think they give a good indication of the fluency of the child. The ability to read and write is not tested in that age group, only oral fluency, accuracy and vocabulary, and listening skills.
You are unlucky because the demand exceeds the supply this year. I can understand your frustration but given the huge demand and the fact that the classes are full, it is difficult to imagine how the system could be fairer. In previous years the first grade classes have been as small as 17 or 18 (even smaller in Postipuu) as not enough children got through the entrance test.
By the way, if I remember correctly the plans I have seen for Suurpelto (which is now on hold) did not increase the number of classes. The school would be roughly the same size as the current Postipuu/Komeetta/Pohjois Tapiola arrangement.
If you feel you have been treated unfairly, then you should contact the koulutuskeskus in Espoonkeskus and give them details. The system is supposed to be fair.
I have heard of cases before where children of native English speakers have not been selected. The tests are well-constructed and I think they give a good indication of the fluency of the child. The ability to read and write is not tested in that age group, only oral fluency, accuracy and vocabulary, and listening skills.
You are unlucky because the demand exceeds the supply this year. I can understand your frustration but given the huge demand and the fact that the classes are full, it is difficult to imagine how the system could be fairer. In previous years the first grade classes have been as small as 17 or 18 (even smaller in Postipuu) as not enough children got through the entrance test.
By the way, if I remember correctly the plans I have seen for Suurpelto (which is now on hold) did not increase the number of classes. The school would be roughly the same size as the current Postipuu/Komeetta/Pohjois Tapiola arrangement.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
The essence of this is all about Integration...Not just for foreigners in Finland..But their kids...and shows the importance of a long-term stay requiring the kids needing to be integrated fully into the Culture and system here!!Cory wrote:I think they throw the words around to make it appear that it's truly an English speaking curriculum. Canada consists of of 10 provinces and 3 territories and the educational systems/curriculi are under provincial jurisdiction so I find it funny that they can say that there is *a* Canadian primary school model.estherk wrote: They also follow the Canadian primary school model (whatever that means)
My son started his elementary education in the English school in Lahti. Terrible system and meant for non-native speakers of English. He ended up trying to speak English with a non-native accent because, as he said "that's how the other kids talked".I yanked him out and he's spent grades 2 and 3 in a neighbourhood Finnish school. I've taken on the responsibility of keeping his English development at a near peer level in reading and writing by doing some extra work 2 or 3 times per week at home. It's not "fun" for me but he's a normal Finnish kid who happens to speak English and has a solid grounding in Finland. He's been enroled in the normal English class with his mono-lingual Finnish peers and it's been enough for him because they tend to spend the majority of time on learning how to read and write so I try to reinforce the lessons taught in school at home ie identify the nouns, conjugate the verbs, etc. He's been bored at times when for the 5th time the kids are still reciting "what is your name?" but I send some word-search puzzles or descramble the sentence type exercises that he can pull out during the lesson so he doesn't get disruptive. I find the teacher very open to suggestions and very easy to work with in the best interest of the child. I have no complaints at all about the typical Finnish school system in the area in which we live.
Our 2 kids are fully into the Finnish Day-care and school system and will be!! I am the ones using various techniques to get them to pick up English and my Mother tongue..
Now my 2 little tots actually play by having a "conversation" in English..and its like their equivalent mother tongue is English!! the older one tutors the younger ones on words and grammar..and its amazing to watch the conversation and the corrections of words and grammar..
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
What do you mean you fair to see how the system would be unfair!?! To leave you waiting until a couple of days before school starts as to whether you get a place or not! I was not able to say to my 6 year old daughter which school she was going to for sure!!!! Does that sound fair?inkku wrote:i fail to understand why the system would be unfair?estherk wrote:
My daughter (half English and half Finnish) is one of those kids who passed the tests no problem to get into Komeetta but didn't get a place (well she got a reserve place), anyway currently she has a place in Tähtiniity school (bi-lingual programme)
I am so frustrated by this whole system, which is unfair to kids and parents alike.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
Hi Cory,Cory wrote:I think they throw the words around to make it appear that it's truly an English speaking curriculum. Canada consists of of 10 provinces and 3 territories and the educational systems/curriculi are under provincial jurisdiction so I find it funny that they can say that there is *a* Canadian primary school model.estherk wrote: They also follow the Canadian primary school model (whatever that means)
My son started his elementary education in the English school in Lahti. Terrible system and meant for non-native speakers of English. He ended up trying to speak English with a non-native accent because, as he said "that's how the other kids talked".I yanked him out and he's spent grades 2 and 3 in a neighbourhood Finnish school. I've taken on the responsibility of keeping his English development at a near peer level in reading and writing by doing some extra work 2 or 3 times per week at home. It's not "fun" for me but he's a normal Finnish kid who happens to speak English and has a solid grounding in Finland. He's been enroled in the normal English class with his mono-lingual Finnish peers and it's been enough for him because they tend to spend the majority of time on learning how to read and write so I try to reinforce the lessons taught in school at home ie identify the nouns, conjugate the verbs, etc. He's been bored at times when for the 5th time the kids are still reciting "what is your name?" but I send some word-search puzzles or descramble the sentence type exercises that he can pull out during the lesson so he doesn't get disruptive. I find the teacher very open to suggestions and very easy to work with in the best interest of the child. I have no complaints at all about the typical Finnish school system in the area in which we live.
Thanks for your reply, in the end I did the same as you and put my daughter into the local Finnish school as she didn't get into the English school. But now we have no after school care it's all full! It seems Olari is a popular location! Thanks for the advice.
Re: Primary/secondary school entrance examinations
The asukaspuisto in Olari is very nice. My youngest used to go there sometimes.