Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Where to buy? Where can I find? How do I? Getting started.
AldenG
Posts: 3357
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:11 am

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by AldenG » Wed Nov 18, 2009 9:55 pm

Tiwaz wrote: I have noticed americans have common tendency to put faith in corporations, as if they were moral operators.
That's funny. I can't think of a single American I know who thinks that way. Quite the opposite -- we are far more cynical than Finns in that respect. And with good reason.

You must be confused by some of the propaganda you hear our bought politicians spouting on the news channels. Nobody believes that bullbaloney.


As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Sponsor:

Finland Forum Ad-O-Matic
 

irnbru
Posts: 822
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:11 pm

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by irnbru » Wed Nov 18, 2009 10:03 pm

sinikettu wrote:
irnbru wrote:
sinikettu wrote:Well the debate here, and at Eduskuntatalo is over...it is at last law...
http://www.yle.fi/uutiset/news/2009/11/ ... 66540.html
Welcome Finland to the late 20th century.
Small modification

Welcome Finland..bit late to the 20th century :wink:
Will Alko open on Sunday now then? In case heaven forbid I might fancy a bottle of chateau de plonk on a whim with my Sunday lunch. Or am I still bolloxed on that score?

User avatar
sinikettu
Posts: 2769
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 1:16 pm

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by sinikettu » Wed Nov 18, 2009 10:10 pm

irnbru wrote:
Will Alko open on Sunday now then? In case heaven forbid I might fancy a bottle of chateau de plonk on a whim with my Sunday lunch. Or am I still bolloxed on that score?
Valitettavasti on
People do not become more irritable as they grow old - they simply stop making the effort to avoid annoying others.

Tiwaz
Posts: 2593
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:21 am

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by Tiwaz » Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:05 am

AldenG wrote:
Tiwaz wrote: I have noticed americans have common tendency to put faith in corporations, as if they were moral operators.
That's funny. I can't think of a single American I know who thinks that way. Quite the opposite -- we are far more cynical than Finns in that respect. And with good reason.

You must be confused by some of the propaganda you hear our bought politicians spouting on the news channels. Nobody believes that bullbaloney.
Actually I am not.

I often talk to Americans in various forums, and when they comes in any way question of who they prefer to handle X, answer is "We don't want no government involvement! Let market forces (essentially corporations) handle it!"

In essence, based on this, granted most likely unscientific method, take... Average American trusts their fate more likely to unelected board of corporation than their own elected leaders.

This applies practically to everything. Welfare? Let everyone pay for their own through insurance" (If they can afford it and if they actually can get money out of that company. After all it is business for insurance company to take in more money than they give out.)

Minimum wage? Let companies handle that! They MUST pay the most fairest and highest salaries if only evil government interference was taken out. Of course, everyone tends to forget what happened during wonderful days of industrial revolution when governments weren't interfering in things.

At least bed was always warm since guy who went to next shift had just recently vacated it.

AldenG
Posts: 3357
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:11 am

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by AldenG » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:10 am

Tiwaz wrote:market forces (essentially corporations)
You're giving the people to whom you refer too much credit. They are by and large not smart enough to recognize the connection you make in those four words. They think of market forces as the benign "invisible hand" described by Adam Smith and do not at all equate it to the wisdom and integrity of corporate boards or executives. And it's all very academic to them, an article of nearly religious faith.

Just because they have a bigger distrust of government than of human nature or corporate boards does not mean that they trust corporate boards. They don't recognize that their position implies such trust. Here's another inconsistency you will find in the people you're describing: Although they will say what you paraphrased about health insurance, talking in hyperbole like government "death panels" to decide who gets health care (actually, that's what we have now with corporate insurance bureaucrats -- some of them actually DO decide who will live and who will die), when you ask them about the financial meltdown, almost all of them will be among the first to say that instead of bailing out the banks and financial firms, we should have let them all fail (market justice) and thrown the officers into jail for fraud. Logical consistency is not a strong suit with them. It isn't that they're entirely inconsistent, but it's easy to make fun of them by stringing a few of their sentences from different contexts together so that they contradict themselves from each one to the next. A large majority of Americans believe there ought to have been a lot more jail sentences for illegal (and immoral) behavior in the executive suite and the corporate boardroom. It's just that few really believe such a thing can or will ever happen on a significant scale.

Not everyone who explains the rationalization behind how things happen in the US actually believes the rationalization. Some of them just want you to know how things got the way they are.

Scientific polling tells us that at present, 3/4 of Americans believe that health insurance reform should include a government-run program much like what KELA administers, the type of program under which we already pay for health care of people over about 64 years of age. Yet it's not at all clear we'll be able to get 50% + 1 of our legislators to vote for such a program. That's because citizens vote one day every two years and REALLY more like one day every four years. Corporations vote with dollars every day. Talk about THAT, apart from each person's little pet orthodoxy, and you'll get overwhelming agreement from Americans that corporations run American politics for their own good, not for the common good and not by any rules of moral conduct. Even Dick Cheney agrees with that -- he simply sees nothing wrong with it.

Give them a chance to condemn corporate venality without thereby admitting that "liberals" might be right about something; then you'll see them turn the same jaundiced eye on corporate behavior that you usually see them casting on their political opponents.

The people you're talking about, like the radio audience of blowhard Rush Limbaugh, are a minority of some millions. They are a very loud minority, but not at all representative of the man on the street. And remember as well, most of them have jobs where they can listen to right-wing radio all day because they don't have a whole hell of a lot else to do -- long-haul truck drivers, delivery guys, sandwich makers, etc. They're not the people who decide how much of anything happens in America.
Last edited by AldenG on Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.

AldenG
Posts: 3357
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:11 am

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by AldenG » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:20 am

Statistically speaking, chances are good that the people from whom you're getting this impression you describe are a lot like this guy:

Image

Highly visible, highly vocal, highly committed, but not really a mover or shaker. This priceless photograph is probably his peak contribution to American life.

(The sign the little girl is holding probably says "Let Freedom Ring," centered.)

(For Finnish readers who understandably might not see the word "moron" very often, it is spelled m-o-r-O-n.)
As he persisted, I was obliged to tootle him gently at first and then, seeing no improvement, to trumpet him vigorously with my horn.

jas_rho
Posts: 734
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:53 am
Location: Finland

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by jas_rho » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:41 am

AldenG wrote:
Tiwaz wrote: I have noticed americans have common tendency to put faith in corporations, as if they were moral operators.
That's funny. I can't think of a single American I know who thinks that way. Quite the opposite -- we are far more cynical than Finns in that respect. And with good reason.

You must be confused by some of the propaganda you hear our bought politicians spouting on the news channels. Nobody believes that bullbaloney.
I agree with AldenG, I don't know either of any Americans who put their faith in corporations like the way you describe. And being American I know my fair share of other Americans :)

Also, the market forces are not corporations, its us, the consumers. We are the market and its us which create the demand, not a corporation. A store being open on Sunday doesn't control me to go to the store on Sunday but if that's what the people want, then that's what they should get. I personally am happy for this change.
Image

User avatar
Pursuivant
Posts: 15089
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:51 am
Location: Bath & Wells

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by Pursuivant » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:56 am

But now you then have to remember "Sunday-Sundays" like Easter and Mothers Day etc.
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."

jas_rho
Posts: 734
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:53 am
Location: Finland

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by jas_rho » Thu Nov 19, 2009 12:09 pm

Pursuivant wrote:But now you then have to remember "Sunday-Sundays" like Easter and Mothers Day etc.
True, but we are on our way to getting those changed too :) They are next on the list... Nah, actually I don't care about those days. They can be closed. But normal sundays it's nice to have the option to go to the shop if I need/want.
Image

raskarhu
Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:11 pm
Location: BE

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by raskarhu » Thu Nov 19, 2009 12:51 pm

well it's a global world and the more you work in the big wide world and not some little backwater where the office can close for the whole of july then the more you have to adjust to what everyone else does. In dubai they just moved their weekend from thu/fri to fri/sat - so even weekends can be moved to somewhat match the rest of the world. In my IT based company more and more work is done in India with Finns put out of a job - no doubt because they had the habit of all taking their holiday in july meaning that all projects and deliveries must pause for 6 weeks during the finnish summer. So they have gotten what they deserved a little - and there is certainly no legislation that will reverse these changes.
And not for one moment did you think about the possibility that this is not the way it should be? Or do you believe in God and not in humans trying to make history? :?

raskarhu
Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:11 pm
Location: BE

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by raskarhu » Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:35 pm

Jas_rho wrote:
Hehe, I don't put my faith in corporations. I put my faith in the freedom to choose what I want to do, when I want to do it, and to be able to go where I want, when I want. (hehe, I just realized that sounds really american, well I guess it can since I am american :) )
Yeah, I understand your mentality see, like in Iraq or Afghanistan, why on earth should the inhabitatants of the United states of Satan account for whatever they do, hei?

And if your not with us (i.e. if you do not believe in neo-liberalism's dogma's) you're from Cuba or N-Korea. Yeah, right, heard that before ...

Oh, by the way, I'm proud to be a left-wing social democrat.

Grtz
Raskarhu

Bavarian
Posts: 751
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:42 pm
Location: New Yorker of Bavarian descent

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by Bavarian » Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:09 pm

jas_rho wrote: I agree with AldenG, I don't know either of any Americans who put their faith in corporations like the way you describe. And being American I know my fair share of other Americans :)
I agree: the closest to having faith in business is that Americans aren't fond of "Big Business"; we just expect government to be even worse. We don't want the entire economy to end up like the Department of Motor Vehicles. :) I'm the youngest kid in my family, and my mom was the youngest by several years, and I remember family dinners with my much older uncles spouting populist anti-business crap, but not having very much respect for a lot of what the government did, either.

That having been said, it always strikes me how we're supposed to celebrate multiculturalism and diversity, but that never seems to include American culture. And then the multicultis turn around and tell us they're the tolerant ones. :roll:
Also, the market forces are not corporations, its us, the consumers. We are the market and its us which create the demand, not a corporation. A store being open on Sunday doesn't control me to go to the store on Sunday but if that's what the people want, then that's what they should get. I personally am happy for this change.
Anti-busines folks like to complain about things like store loyatly cards, and how those horrible corporations are building up a database on us. Yet it's much easier to use cash and stay off such databases than it is to avoid government databases.

jas_rho
Posts: 734
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:53 am
Location: Finland

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by jas_rho » Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:55 am

raskarhu wrote:Jas_rho wrote:
Hehe, I don't put my faith in corporations. I put my faith in the freedom to choose what I want to do, when I want to do it, and to be able to go where I want, when I want. (hehe, I just realized that sounds really american, well I guess it can since I am american :) )
Yeah, I understand your mentality see, like in Iraq or Afghanistan, why on earth should the inhabitatants of the United states of Satan account for whatever they do, hei?

And if your not with us (i.e. if you do not believe in neo-liberalism's dogma's) you're from Cuba or N-Korea. Yeah, right, heard that before ...

Oh, by the way, I'm proud to be a left-wing social democrat.

Grtz
Raskarhu
Don't start with the war crap. This is about shops open on Sunday and that's what my comments referred to. And I'm glad you can be a left-wing social democrat and still remain proud... I couldn't.
Image

User avatar
Karhunkoski
Posts: 7034
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:44 pm
Location: Keski-Suomi

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by Karhunkoski » Fri Nov 20, 2009 8:29 am

Wow that's the first time I've ever seen one of raskarhu's posts be quoted!
Political correctness is the belief that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

User avatar
Pursuivant
Posts: 15089
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:51 am
Location: Bath & Wells

Re: Shops to open every Sunday :-)

Post by Pursuivant » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:13 pm

OK, heres a bit of a public service announcement: Opening Hours 2009 & 2010 (I think thats a typo in the top column)
http://www.pty.fi/850.html
So even open on Sundays then they might be closed on some other holidays.
"By the pricking of my thumbs,
Something wicked this way comes."


Post Reply