Apergers or ADD? Worried

[am I Finnish yet?]

Hi, is there anyone here with a child who has Aspergers?

My son is 12 and I used to think he had ADD but now I am starting to think it is something more like Aspergers or both Aspergers and ADD. Some old behavior I thought he would grow out of he is not, and there is definitely SOMETHING going on with him.

I have already been trying to get some help for the suspected ADD, but I guess I will take him to the doctor and talk to his teacher at school.

I just was curious if anyone else had kids who need special help, and how to get the help.... Also, my son speaks only English as of yet.

Sorry if this is incoherent, I have only been realizing that there might be a more serious issue with my son in the last month or so.

[Rosamunda]

If your child is 12 and has been at the same school during his childhood then you should definitely have a discussion with his teachers and the school psychologist.

One of the (BIG) problems with English language schooling in Finland is that many of the teachers are quite simply not as experienced and qualified as their Finnish counterparts. My sons went through English language primary school in Finland and quite frankly I don't think any of their teachers would be able to diagnose any kind of learning disorder or (worse) have the slightest clue how to deal with it.

We tore our hair out for ears. We got professional help from an educational psychologist in London (who came to Helsinki and did an assessment on one of our kids, at our expense) but there was no follow up. We have hounded the schools to give our son the help he needs but they just don't have the resources or the expertise (in English) to help all the kids who need it.

We also made an appointment with an organisation in Kaisaniemi called HERO (Vilhonkatu 4 http://www.lukihero.fi/ ) where our son was again assessed, this time by a Finnish psychologist (in English) who wrote a short report which we gave to his school but again the follow up was minimal.

I know a couple of families whose kids have severe problems and they do seem to get some help, so it is worth pursuing this (through the school) or maybe in your home country if you still have contacts there. I think you will also need to consider your long term plans, it is unlikely that you will find adequate help and support in Finland if your son only speaks English.

[CarmenfromTexas]

I found a site by the Child Development Institute on Asperger's Syndrome. It gives information for the parents and the teachers.

http://childdevelopmentinfo.com/disorde ... rger.shtml

I remember seeing this stunningly beautiful model on TV who has Aspergers. Sometimes she would freeze in place for a few seconds and then start up again as if her nervous system were resetting itself. Her career is still going well, as far as I know.

Children with AS usually have a history of developmental delays in motor skills such as pedaling a bike, catching a ball, or climbing outdoor play equipment. They are often awkward and poorly coordinated with a walk that can appear either stilted or bouncy.

Most doctors rely on the presence of a core group of behaviors to alert them to the possibility of a diagnosis of AS. These are:

abnormal eye contact
aloofness
the failure to turn when called by name
the failure to use gestures to point or show
a lack of interactive play
a lack of interest in peers
Some of these behaviors may be apparent in the first few months of a child’s life, or they may appear later. Problems in at least one of the areas of communication and socialization or repetitive, restricted behavior must be present before the age of 3.

The diagnosis of AS is a two-stage process. The first stage begins with developmental screening during a “well-child” check-up with a family doctor or pediatrician. The second stage is a comprehensive team evaluation to either rule in or rule out AS. This team generally includes a psychologist, neurologist, psychiatrist, speech therapist, and additional professionals who have expertise in diagnosing children with AS.

The comprehensive evaluation includes neurologic and genetic assessment, with in-depth cognitive and language testing to establish IQ and evaluate psychomotor function, verbal and non-verbal strengths and weaknesses, style of learning, and independent living skills. An assessment of communication strengths and weaknesses includes evaluating non-verbal forms of communication (gaze and gestures); the use of non-literal language (metaphor, irony, absurdities, and humor); patterns of inflection, stress and volume modulation; pragmatics (turn-taking and sensitivity to verbal cues); and the content, clarity, and coherence of conversation. The physician will look at the testing results and combine them with the child’s developmental history and current symptoms to make a diagnosis.

Whatever your child is going through, please research it because you will need to be sharp on the major points of concern. The General Practioner Doctor you first visit might be reaching back to a JAMA article he/she read three years ago. What an earlier poster said is very true. Be a squeaky wheel for your son. You're his advocate and no one else can champion his needs as well as you.

[am I Finnish yet?]

Thanks everyone... I am just not sure, and not sure where would be the best place to start.

He has SOME of the problems associated with aspergers but not all of them. I don't know if it is that. I have now had 2 people mention aspergers to me (In reference to him) and I also have really realized that some of his unusual behavior he is not growing out of.

He has been at postipuu for 4 years now. He was held back one year. Now, his grades a decent and he does homework without being asked, which is wonderful and I am very proud of him for that.

He is a very loving and affectionate boy. He has always craves a lot of hugs and kisses, etc.

He has no friends at school. Neither he nor his teacher say he has been bullied, and he doesn't seem traumatized or complain of not wanting to go to school in any way that would make me suspicious of that. In his prior group, he seemed to have some semi-friends. He doesn't seem too interested in having friends. I don't know if it is just normal fear of rejection or something more.

He does and says things repeatedly out of "habit," and at inapprpropriate times. I can't seem to help him break these habits. I get embarassed around company or in social situations with him. He just says inane things like "Poopie," or "Mommy is a potato." I used to think that he just wanted to talk and didn't know what to say or was seeking attention, but I don't know.

I will read that hero website and figure out where to start to see if he needs help. I was feeling like the situation was hopeless today, so thanks everyone!

[DMC]

Have you seen "COPING: A SURVIVAL GUIDE FOR PEOPLE WITH ASPERGER SYNDROME "?

(I had never heard of Apergers before reading your post, but Google listed the book in a completely unrelated search. Weird.)

[am I Finnish yet?]

Thanks! I've saved that and it looks good.

[Mölkky-Fan]

My only advice is to go to a doctor or child psychologist or other specialist, and not trawl through the web and try and diagnose something yourself. Trawling through the web is OK to get further info on a disease (and if you do not trust /not get any help with the professionals), but leave the diagnosis to the specialists and then read up afterwards. Maybe you will not be satisfied with the professionals, but at least try them as a first step. Many of these problems can range in severity and symptoms and as you suggest might have a few different disorders mixed up, and can be misdiagnosed fairly simply by those with a little bit of knowledge from the web.

By the way I think you should have got a professional to check out the ADD diagnosis you came to. Just hoping 'special behaviour' will disappear with age is not the best idea, they might actually be symptoms of different problems and also there are ways to treat kids with ADD which might help development. Luckily it is typically over-diagnosed by parents, and is sometimes a different problem and often just natural behaviour.

Good luck with your son, hopefully it is nothing too serious!

[am I Finnish yet?]

Yeah thanks, I don't want to self diagnose, but I need to be able to express what I'm worried about to the professionals.

The thing with the "Special behavior" is that I didn't think it was so special until recently. Also, I have a relative who is a psychologist and had really thought my son had ADD, but at the time my son was 5 or 6 and would not even take the test.

His teacher suspects something going on, but the school has no psychologist right now.

I will push the school avenue harder and so on.

Also, I think that in reading about aspergers, I can still get pointers how to handle the special behavior myself as a parent in the meantime.

Thanks again, everyone!

[Rosamunda]

but the school has no psychologist right now....

...which is outrageous for a school which has a special section for children with (very) special needs. You should call the education board (suomenkielinen koulutuskeskus) in Espoonkeskus and demand that you are given access to an educational psychologist. There is no excuse for the school not having access to a psychologist at least on a parttime basis (ie shared with Komeetta or with another school in Leppävaara).

If you are residing permanently in Finland then you must get your child into "the system" as soon as possible. Otherwise he won't get the support he needs in ylä-aste which will effect his options after that. There aren't many high school options in Espoo for kids who don't speak Finnish and although it might seem far away, believe me, you have to get professional support as soon as you can. Once your son has been assessed and a report has been written then he will have access to special ed and also to such things as extra time in tests and even a private room for studying. Sometimes a teaching assistant can be allocated to a class (full or parttime) to give the teacher extra help.

There is also an organisation called EETU (their webpages are out of date but it's www.eetu.fi ) and there might be someone there who can help you. Also, your school has its own School Board made up of parents and teachers (NOT the PTA but a proper, elected school board, the names will be on your school's webpage on www.espoo.fi ) and you can contact anyone on that board who can represent you at the next School Board meeting (there are a minimum of 3 per year).

[Mölkky-Fan]

Push the school, push the school board, visit your doctor... anything to get things going. The doctor can help push the school as well (our doctor did). I can almost guarantee that if you start the process off straight away, then you can have a meeting with the right person within a week or so, and then you will have a good idea about how things are and can then read up on what you need. Sorry to be so frank, but IMO the best first step is to get it checked out asap with a professional. The Finnish system does work well and they are good at handling these problems once he is diagnosed.

Our son has a mild case of dyslexia, and we spotted something was not quite right. The doctor helped and he was diagnosed, and then he had his classes changed a little to suit his learning needs. We did not suspect dyslexia at all at the early stages, even though my brother in law and his son have it. He is now doing much better at school, has friends and seems very happy (when I can get him away from the Playstation we even talk a little).

[magenta22]

My sister has AS.

I'm not sure what the help would be like in Finland but in the UK it took until she was 18 before she actually got some help!
You just have to keep on at the people you are in contact with to make sure your son does.
If he is in mainstream school and is coping then I would suggest that you keep him in that school rather than change to another one. It might help with the social phobia that is related to AS. If he is finding mainstream school too much then perhaps a special needs school would be an option but he might find that academically it will be frustrating because children with AS are very intelligent.

[am I Finnish yet?]

Thanks Magenta! My son is getting good grades and has a good teacher, but he has no friends at school. I don't think I'd want to put him in a special needs school.

[am I Finnish yet?]

In case this is helpful for anyone else,

Update: The school does have a psychologist, although there was a time when it did not.

She is there only one day per week. I met with her, She met with the teacher, and then she met with my son for an valuation over 3 separate appointments. She cannot give a diagnosis, but I guess the evaluation helped to get a clearer picture of what is going on with my son. There was then a meeting between Her, me, and the teacher.

She felt that he likely had aspberger's, but on the less severe end of the spectrum. She also didn't feel he would need to be in any type of special ed group.

Then, son's teacher an I and my son met with the school doctor. That appointment took 1.5 hours! Anyway, she has given a referral for him to see a neuro-psycholigist at a children's hospital in Helsinki. This wait could be long, maybe this fall, maybe in a year. I'll follow up if the wait seems too long.

Right now, son's situation is ok, he is not being bullied, and it is a great fit with his teacher. He'll be in 6th grade next year, then he'll change schools. His teacher and I feel that while he is doing fine now, we need some kind of diagnosis or concrete information the pass on to his next school, to help things go better for him. Also, any therapy he might need, etc.

[Rosamunda]

That's good news.
I think you should follow it up and don't be nervous about contacting the school frequently to get updates (they probably won't call you unless there is a problem).