3rd verb forms

[Oombongo]

Ok, using thrd verb in Finnish is driving me nuts. How to know what case (partitiivi, elatiivi, adessiivi...) to use?

For example: If I want to say "I tried to call you to know"
would it be like: "Yritin soittaa sulle tietämään?" or "Yritin soittaa sulle tietämistä?"

Any rules/hits/suggestions to use 3rd verb in sentences would be nice

Thanks in advance

[EP]

Yritin soittaa sulle tietämään?" or "Yritin soittaa sulle tietämistä?"

Yritin soittaa s(in)ulle tietääkseni

or

Yritin soittaa s(in)ulle saadakseni tietää

[Rob A.]

Ok, using thrd verb in Finnish is driving me nuts. How to know what case (partitiivi, elatiivi, adessiivi...) to use?

For example: If I want to say "I tried to call you to know"
would it be like: "Yritin soittaa sulle tietämään?" or "Yritin soittaa sulle tietämistä?"

Any rules/hits/suggestions to use 3rd verb in sentences would be nice

Thanks in advance

This link discusses the "long form of the first infinitive"...if what you intend to say is something like... "I tried to call you in order to know..."....???...

However the link says that ...tietääkseni, has a special meaning ...."as far as I know", not, "in order to know." , which might be why EP is also suggesting, "saadakseni tietää"... ..."in order to get to know..."

Maybe your sentence could be completed a bit more...???

[Oombongo]

Thanks EP and Rob for your replies

Of course, I could say "Yritin soittaa sulle, ja haluaisin tietää....." but I wanted to make it a bit challenging as I am going to face such situation sooner or later

Is there anyway to know when to use what 3rd verb form in the sentence?

[Jukka Aho]

Thanks EP and Rob for your replies

Of course, I could say "Yritin soittaa sulle, ja haluaisin tietää....." but I wanted to make it a bit challenging as I am going to face such situation sooner or later :)

Yritin soittaa sinulle kysyäkseni voitko lähteä huomenna elokuviin, mutta et vastannut puhelimeen.
Yritin soittaa sinulle kysyäkseni neuvoa.
Yritin soittaa sinulle kysyäkseni sitä lupaamaasi kakkureseptiä, mutta puhelimesi oli varattu.

[Oombongo]

^Thanks. It seems that I am not ready to go for the national language exam yet

[Rob A.]

This so-called, "long form of the first infinitive" description for words such as tietääkseni, kysyäkseni, saadakseni, and so forth, has been bothering me. It seemed to me it was just a variation of the translative case. I found this further reference in uusikielemme...bottom of page.... I see clearly what is going on. The examples above are nominalized verbs having a somewhat specialized use...verbs turned into nouns using the translative suffix...so not really an infinitive.

So this is how it is developed:

tietää.....tietääksi.....tietääkse-.....tietääkseni ...any of the other possessive endings can be used... So that makes it a lot easier now to understand, it's just another example of a verb turned into a noun...but with a somewhat specialized use. No different really than, say, tietämys...the verb tietää turned into a noun with the meaning, "knowledge"....

[Aside: Some interesting trivia...the verb, tietää, is derived from the word, tie="road"...and this verb originally carried the meaning of, "knowing the way/road to somewhere",....much more important to the ancient hunter/gatherers than knowing what a tietokone is....]

[Upphew]

[Aside: Some interesting trivia...the verb, tietää, is derived from the word, tie="road"...and this verb originally carried the meaning of, "knowing the way/road to somewhere",....much more important to the ancient hunter/gatherers than knowing what a tietokone is....]

In English computers compute, in Finnish tietokone tietää? No wonder elder people think they are boxes full of magic smoke and voodoo.

[Pursuivant]

Icelanders have it figured out, its the tölva, the forecaster speaking in riddles...