English Elementary Schools in Espoo

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diablogun
Posts: 134
Joined: Sat Sep 18, 2010 5:05 am

Re: English Elementary Schools in Espoo

Post by diablogun » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:31 am

AldenG wrote:Does there seem to be, in the research or in personal experience, a point at which "multi-" becomes "too many?"

I ask because some kids I've known from childhood into adulthood over the years, who grew up tri-lingual, did indeed seem fluent in the sense of flowing, comfortable, in the two languages I could assess. But I wouldn't call them exactly "native level" in either of those languages and I'm guessing probably not in the third one, either. Well, there are different levels of native, I suppose. Many people who grow up with only one language probably don't use it well enough to be in the top 25% on a matriculation exam (at least 75% don't), much less to write unsupervised for publication. It's not that I mind people using the "wrong" prepositions and such; I simply notice it and wonder how much it has to do with not having one "anchor" language. (I don't even particularly mind the handful of inferior choices I myself inevitably make in most any Finnish or Swedish email or letter I write, as long as it reaches a reasonably high level of clarity, intelligence, and correctness. I learn but certainly don't cringe when later reviewing some of them with the family Finn.) The benefits of growing up spontaneous and quite good in three languages might outweigh the advantages of not having a true and certain ear in any of them. (What do others think about this notion?) However, it could cause problems in some contexts such as trying to earn teacher certification.
I think that, perhaps, you are reading your own ability to be articulate into the way that others converse in a language, which is wholly understandable. For most people the need to communicate a feeling or thought is what drives them to converse, and they will not stress about having to overcome the hurdle of perfection to carry it off. In my opinion, the raw intelligence, at least in the sense that raw intelligence is used/defined for those that are predisposed to master the syntax of communication, is what you are getting at. I don't think it is a matter that the multi-lingual amongst us are not properly anchored in one tongue, it is simply that you are smart enough in oral communication to pay attention to the mastery of speech. As an example, my nephew is 16 and a very athletic teenager. He is strong and quick, and the quickness he expresses physically could in some way be defined as a facet of intelligence, i.e., he is able to make decisions concerning distance and speed at a mind-boggling rate, and in different sports. If one was to ask if his quickness and acumen in one sport was damaged by his ability to play several well, then I would probably think this to be untrue. He is good at it because he has a talent for it.

And he is terrible in languages :-)



Re: English Elementary Schools in Espoo

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diablogun
Posts: 134
Joined: Sat Sep 18, 2010 5:05 am

Re: English Elementary Schools in Espoo

Post by diablogun » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:39 am

Cory wrote:
AldenG wrote:Does there seem to be, in the research or in personal experience, a point at which "multi-" becomes "too many?"
I've never come across research about "too many languages". Doesn't mean there isn't.

Would totally depend on each person and their biology/history, age of introduction of each language, their ability to learn languages and their expectations for themselves. We know that the earlier a child/baby is introduced to more than one language, the more intricate and complex the neural pathways are and the denser the grey matter is in the brain. We know that the brain is structurally different in a bi/multilingual person than the brain in a monolingual person. http://www.sfn.org/index.aspx?pagename= ... ngualbrain Some interesting MRI photos at the bottom of the page on the link.

How much is too much? Does everyone expect complete fluency and complete accuracy as a goal when learning multiple languages? Some do but I would suspect that some (most) don't. Is "success" in fluency in multiple languages due to biology or sisu or luck or timing? It's a hot area of research these days.
I would go further and suggest that languages are a boon, particularly for those that are older. I believe there is research that suggests that one keeping his or her brain active is an excellent way to stay sharper mentally, which kind of makes sense to me--at least intuitively. In fact, I think adults pursuing languages could be the smartest things they can do, though they obviously will not be able to speak in the same way that a person who is quite young when they learn.

I am thoroughly from the camp that suggests the more the merrier in relation to the study of foreign languages, and not just at a young age.

Upphew
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Re: English Elementary Schools in Espoo

Post by Upphew » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:22 am

diablogun wrote:For most people the need to communicate a feeling or thought is what drives them to converse, and they will not stress about having to overcome the hurdle of perfection to carry it off.
I suppose you are not a Finn?
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diablogun
Posts: 134
Joined: Sat Sep 18, 2010 5:05 am

Re: English Elementary Schools in Espoo

Post by diablogun » Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:36 am

Upphew wrote:
diablogun wrote:For most people the need to communicate a feeling or thought is what drives them to converse, and they will not stress about having to overcome the hurdle of perfection to carry it off.
I suppose you are not a Finn?
Most definitely not ;-)


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