Ads in Finnish: Sähkökampa tekee ihmeitä

[jahasjahas]

....and I noticed this verb in the list:
jokellella.....

Example Vauva jokellelin koko päivän.
...which apparently is derived from the verb, jokeltaa...

So what would be the difference between these two sentences...?

Vauva jokellelin koko päivän./Vauva jokelsin koko päivän.

Jokeltaa, itself, looks like it could be a frequentative verb ...-el- marker. I'm also wondering if these words have an onomatopoeic orgin....the stem seems to be joki...???

Click on "show" next to "Conjugation of jokellella (type tulla)" and "Conjugation of jokeltaa (type huutaa)", and you'll see the conjugation tables. So the forms you're looking for are "jokelteli" and "jokelsi".

"Vauva jokelsi koko päivän." (Not frequentative.)
"Vauva jokelteli koko päivän." (Frequentative.)

There isn't much of a difference in this situation. I suppose the latter one is more natural, since the action being described is most likely spread sporadically through the day, instead of being a constant don't-stop-to-breathe babble.

A clearer example would be "Vauva röyhtäili koko päivän." (The baby burbed [kept on burbing / was burbing around???] the whole day.), where the non-frequentative option "Vauva röyhtäisi koko päivän." might well be interpreted as a single 24-hour burp. Which I really don't want to imagine.

The frequentative and non-frequentative options might be more interchangeable in a sentence like "Vauva jokelsi kehdossa." / "Vauva jokelteli kehdossa." (The baby babbled in the crib.) The first one seems to concentrate on the fact that a sound of babble could be heard, while the second tells us that the baby was chilling in the crib and babbling along. Maybe. Iso suomen kielioppi points out that using the frequentative might describe the action in a more informal and friendly manner, but this is of course secondary to other differences in meaning.

EDIT TO ADD:
I don't have an etymological dictionary, so I'm just going to guess that "jokeltaa" might well be onomatopoetic (or not), but I can't really imagine a connection with "joki". Surely a theoretical frequentative verb derived from "joki" would have consonant gradation ("joeltaa"?)?

[AldenG]

I wanted to save this comment until people had a chance to discuss the language of it a bit.

Isn't it funny how every new technology gets imbued with mysterious healing powers at first? I think one of the Roosevelts used an electric belt at one point. Maybe Franklin, which would make a lot of sense, although his Guillain-Barre happened so late that popular culture should have been past the point of thinking electrical currents might improve it. So possibly Theodore, who got a sickly start to life. I just can't remember which one of them it was.

Nuclear radiation was another example. At first people assumed (or hucksters made them believe) that radium had health-enhancing powers.

Recent decades have seen a resurgence in belief of the healing powers of magnetism.

[Rob A.]

....and I noticed this verb in the list:
jokellella.....

Example Vauva jokellelin koko päivän.
...which apparently is derived from the verb, jokeltaa...

So what would be the difference between these two sentences...?

Vauva jokellelin koko päivän./Vauva jokelsin koko päivän.

Jokeltaa, itself, looks like it could be a frequentative verb ...-el- marker. I'm also wondering if these words have an onomatopoeic orgin....the stem seems to be joki...???

Click on "show" next to "Conjugation of jokellella (type tulla)" and "Conjugation of jokeltaa (type huutaa)", and you'll see the conjugation tables. So the forms you're looking for are "jokelteli" and "jokelsi".

"Vauva jokelsi koko päivän." (Not frequentative.)
"Vauva jokelteli koko päivän." (Frequentative.)

There isn't much of a difference in this situation. I suppose the latter one is more natural, since the action being described is most likely spread sporadically through the day, instead of being a constant don't-stop-to-breathe babble.

A clearer example would be "Vauva röyhtäili koko päivän." (The baby burbed [kept on burbing / was burbing around???] the whole day.), where the non-frequentative option "Vauva röyhtäisi koko päivän." might well be interpreted as a single 24-hour burp. Which I really don't want to imagine.

The frequentative and non-frequentative options might be more interchangeable in a sentence like "Vauva jokelsi kehdossa." / "Vauva jokelteli kehdossa." (The baby babbled in the crib.) The first one seems to concentrate on the fact that a sound of babble could be heard, while the second tells us that the baby was chilling in the crib and babbling along. Maybe. Iso suomen kielioppi points out that using the frequentative might describe the action in a more informal and friendly manner, but this is of course secondary to other differences in meaning.

EDIT TO ADD:
I don't have an etymological dictionary, so I'm just going to guess that "jokeltaa" might well be onomatopoetic (or not), but I can't really imagine a connection with "joki". Surely a theoretical frequentative verb derived from "joki" would have consonant gradation ("joeltaa"?)?

OK...yes...I did notice I had messed up the conjugation before you posted... I was thinking first person singular rather than third person singular....and in addition missing the "lt" consonant gradation...partly due to my rather poor eyesight...and, of course, forgetting to consider consonant gradationl...

I still have a bit of a problem with those words that change thier syllable breakdown with different conjugations...syllables being closed and opened in their various forms which may invoke consonant gradation....

As far as etymological possibilities, I guess being a non-native speaker I may sometimes see things that either aren't really there, or that a native speaker may not think are particularly relevant....

[Rob A.]

EDIT TO ADD:
I don't have an etymological dictionary, so I'm just going to guess that "jokeltaa" might well be onomatopoetic (or not), but I can't really imagine a connection with "joki". Surely a theoretical frequentative verb derived from "joki" would have consonant gradation ("joeltaa"?)?

OK... though I seem to remember reading that consonant gradation only reaches back to the syllable before the end syllable...in other words the penultimate syllable.

Therefore:

jo.ki >jo.kel->jo.kel.taa>jo.kel.lan.

a. jo.ki is the basic word
b. jo.kel- when the frequentative marker is added the "i" has to lower to an "e"
c. jo.kel.taa/jo.kel.lan ....in the first instance the syllable is open, there strong grade; in the second the syllable is closed therefore the weak grade.....

But I'm just using "logic" here ...it doesn't mean I'm right....