Help! Immigration to Finland is possible for us?

[LadyCrosszeria]

Hyvää iltaa~!
First, I'd like to apologize because I've noticed that this question has been asked several times already and I'm sure you guys are tired of answering it. However, our case is somewhat different. Here is it.
My fiance and I are planning to move to Finland in a couple of years. He's from the United States, and I'm from Mexico. I have a degree in Radiology and by the time we plan to move there, I'll have another degree in English teaching while my fiance will have a degree in Physics. We are going to be fluent in Finnish by that time, and we will also be married. The idea is to move there, buy an apartment and get jobs, and basically just reside there permanently and form a family.
Now, we've read a lot about resident permits on multiple sites. We know that there're a few ways to get a resident permit such as family ties, employment, having been born in Finland, studying and having an intimate relationship with someone currently living in Finland. The problem here is that we don't fulfill any of these requirements. So, we are wondering if there's any other way that we can apply for a resident permit, taking our situation into account. And if not, what is the best way to go about fulfilling one of these requirements?

Any help will be greatly appreciated~!

[Rip]

The best would be if you could find a job for at least one of you first and then apply a permit based on that ground then.

Apart from that, one can try to apply in "other grounds category", just maybe they could give you the first year permit without particular grounds (but with solid finances). Even if that would work, it could well be that you'd end up hoping that you had got the job first anyway.

PS. People here are probably wondering "Why?"

[Upphew]

Now, we've read a lot about resident permits on multiple sites.

I'd stick to the info from migri.fi and maybe local Finnish embassy.

[rinso]

I have a degree in Radiology
my fiance will have a degree in Physics

There is a plan that the EU can issue "blue cards" (comparable with "green cards") for highly educated non-EU citizens. But the condition is that they have a job and they earn at least 150% of the average wages. So a job remains paramount.

My fiance and I are planning to move to Finland in a couple of years.
We are going to be fluent in Finnish by that time

It will be very difficult to achieve fluency in a couple of years when you are not immersed in the language (= living in Finland).

[dev]

It is (usually) very hard to get a job from Abroad. As you mentioned in your post that you are planing to take a degree, is it Masters degree? If yes, one option can be that instead of studying in Mexico or US, study in Finland. It will help you to integrate in two years ie. you can study Finnish and practice it in real life, as well as looking for jobs might be little easier. Just my 0.02€.

[interleukin]

Not to be nasty or anything, but why do you think you will be fluent in Finnish? Do you have Finnish speakers around you? Do you practice Finnish every day? Do you have any idea about the Finnish language? Also, do you know that Finns speak perfect English (at least the Finns you´d be competing for a job with), so unless your Finnish is very fluent, a native Finnish speaker with a high-quality education is going to get hired instead of you.

Sorry, but I fail to see why you have chosen Finland as your promised land.

[CH]

We are going to be fluent in Finnish by that time

Another one in the "no you aren't" crowd here. I'm sorry, but this caught my eye, and that was what immediately popped into my mind. Fluent in a few years while living in Finland would be an accomplishment. Doable, I guess, but hard. Doing the same somewhere else... nope, I can't see that happening unless you have a really good teacher doing really intensive training with you, and still I really don't see that happening.

I don't know what the situation is for radiologists, but it might be ok, especially if you are willing to move somewhere where not a lot of the new graduates want to move to (but get the job first!). Teaching English... well, there seems to be a lot of wannabes for that on this board. I'm sure there are jobs, but also a lot of competition. Recently graduated from Physics, on the other hand, might be much harder. If he hasn't done his doctoral thesis, one possibility would be to do that here. Then he would have the foot in the door to work in the physics department of the same university.

The easiest way, really, is to come over here to study. Getting a job is hard, especially if you are straight out of school with no experience in your field.

[Rodwen]

Fluent in a few years? Sorry, but I doubt that. I learnt Finnish IN Finland, and was able to communicate in a decent way in 2-3 years, but still after 7 years I occasionally have problems to express myself. And I usually have no problems learning languages, I know 5 others.
Also, I have been studying Finnish together with Americans and they have the hardest time with pronouncing Finnish.

I wish you all the best, but I would stay on Earth when it comes to the language.
If you are highly educated, you might get a job even if you are not that good in Finnish. My mom's a nurse and she pretty much immediately got a job when we moved, even tho she was only just studying Finnish. Because there is a demand for nurses/doctors.

[magenta22]

How are you so sure you will be fluent in Finnish by then? Sorry to burst your bubble but I have been learning Finnish for 6 years now and I am still no where near being fluent and I go to classes and OH is Finnish and I practice speaking Finnish every day as well as studying in my lunch hour.

Finnish is not the easiest language to learn, there are many rules in the language that you just need to know...

[ajl]

PS. People here are probably wondering "Why?"

I always wonder: Why FINLAND?! Do people spin a globe and have
their finger land on Finland or pick it out of a hat or just read
that the pisa scores are great or is it just a crazy idea that attracts
unrealistic wackos? How about you visit for more than just 2 weeks
during winter and get a good idea of if the location is really what
you think of it (visiting in the summer is not a fair representative
sample of living in Finland).

[LadyCrosszeria]

Thank you for all of your answers, they've already helped us a lot. Now, I think there are a few points that need to be clarified.

1. Regarding the fluency in Finnish issue. I apologize if we made it sound like learning Finnish is an easy thing to do. we are perfectly aware that this is not the case and we didn't mean to be disrespectful towards any of you.
We don't find Finnish to be just another language, we want to study it not only to move to Finland, but because we're also interested in its roots, history, evolution, etc. The time frame we mentioned ("a couple of years") is merely tentative, we are aware that it might take us longer to be all set to travel to Finland, so we don't have an exact date for our departure, although we expect it to be a minimum 7 to 8 years from now.
Now, to answer some of your questions: Yes, we'll be taking the best Finnish lessons available, with native speakers teaching us, and we intend to practice on a daily basis.We also have friends in Finland who are willing to help us with this and we'll do everything in our hands to learn the language. We're already working on it. I agree with you, the best place to learn Finnish is Finland itself; and when I said "fluent" I meant fluent enough to be able to lead a life there. Of course, we will learn a lot more once in Finland, but we are not planning to move there without having at least an intermediate level of fluency in Finnish.

2. About our educational preparation. Finland is well known for its high educational standards and competitiveness in the work field. We agree that Finns are more than well prepared to affront challenges and achieve their goals, and we greatly admire and respect that. Our plan is not to move immediately after we graduate, we are conscious that we need to be prepared to move into another country, both financially and in terms of experience. That's why before leaving for Finland we want to be 100% sure that we are all set and ready.

3.- Why Finland? Not only your high standards in livelihood, education, technology, etc., are appealing to us, but we also share and agree with your ideal of "we are all in the same boat". Social classes do not play a big part in Finnish society, an equality that is largely taken for granted in Finland. However, this social equality that we find so attractive is almost completely absent in our home countries. Of course, this doesn't mean that we expect our life in Finland to be perfect. We know that we'll face many challenges, and that it'll be difficult, at least in the beggining, to adapt to a completely different lifestyle and different customs. However, we're willing to do everything that's necessary to make our life in Finland work out. As for the weather, we know that Finland has very unforgiving winters, and we know that it's difficult to adapt to that kind of weather. That's why we are planning to visit in winter for a month to get a sense of how long it will take to become acclimated.
Finally, one of the most important reasons why we want to move to Finland is that we believe we can learn a lot about the Finnish way of life, a way of life that, with our still fairly limited knowledge, we align ourselves with. We also want to be part of that lifestyle, to a degree that we feel is only achievable by actually living in Finland.

Thank you, again, for all of your replies and if you have any more suggestions or opinions, we'll be more than happy to hear them.

[interleukin]

Ok, points 1 and 2 are fine, if you manage to get good Finnish skills and jobs, that's really great. I wish you the best.

Point 3 is another thing. Have you ever actually BEEN to Finland? It sounds like you have some internet-picture of Finland or something. Ok, there are worse countries around, but you sound completely unprepared for actually being in Finland. How about you come here and stay for as long as possible on visitors visas, and see what things are really like.

If you do, and still decide that Finland is the promised land, then go for it, I wish you luck and happiness.

[jahasjahas]

1. Regarding the fluency in Finnish issue. I apologize if we made it sound like learning Finnish is an easy thing to do. we are perfectly aware that this is not the case and we didn't mean to be disrespectful towards any of you.

It's not that we're proud to have a language that's hard to learn, so you weren't disrespectful. But it sounded unrealistic without further context. You seem to have quite a plan, let's hope it works the way you want!

2. About our educational preparation. Finland is well known for its high educational standards and competitiveness in the work field. We agree that Finns are more than well prepared to affront challenges and achieve their goals, and we greatly admire and respect that.

It might be hard to get a job here, but that doesn't mean that we're particularly competitive or efficient compared to, for example, the US or Asia.

Finally, one of the most important reasons why we want to move to Finland is that we believe we can learn a lot about the Finnish way of life, a way of life that, with our still fairly limited knowledge, we align ourselves with.

Quiet, grumpy and drunk? Welcome aboard

[magenta22]

planning to move there without having at least an intermediate level of fluency in Finnish.

I am in the intermediate level class and have been for a while and still not fluent!

As for the weather, we know that Finland has very unforgiving winters, and we know that it's difficult to adapt to that kind of weather. That's why we are planning to visit in winter for a month to get a sense of how long it will take to become acclimated.

I have been to Finland at varying times of the winter and even I have still not managed to experience the -25 degrees - you will have to time it perfectly to experience the real finnish winter.

[Kutittaa]

Personally I think you have no chance of being able to stay here permanently. Let alone learn fluent Finnish overseas (LOL?)

This is mostly via way of my own personal opinion (as per most of my posts) but also on grounds for entry.

If no ties to Finland and no Citizenship of any European country, as well as already being married to someone who also doesn't have either of the things I just mentioned = you have 'buckleys' (no chance) of getting into Finland.

I remember one woman who had a baby and was 'seperated' but not divorced from her husband. As far as I remember she actually said they were 'cohabitating' when 'appropriate' (again LOL) however she wouldn't file for a divorce. Thus she had no real way to gain entry to Finland.
Her plan was to sell the house, the car, and her pets (I'm serious) and then just walk into Finland and expect to stay. She was pretty much made a laughing stock over the rest of the week on another forum.

So like I said at the top in bold. You have no ties to Europe, no ties to Finland specifically and you are going to be married to someone who is in the same boat as you. All you can do as others have said is apply under the 'other grounds' in the hope that your 'profession' (because there is little else you can give to the country) grants you grounds to stay here.

It's a bit of a controversial matter though. Best of luck anyway, but don't think that you will be fluent in speaking 'Finnish' (3x LOL) when you have never been here and heard the language first-hand. That's just ignorant wishful thinking. Maybe it wouldn't be so disagreeable if your husband was Finnish but...

So you'll just learn Finnish real quick overseas, get a job in Finland (whilst overseas), then sell your stuff, move here, and then stay forever? <--- *reps*
You have no idea how hard it is for people who have double masters here to even find work IN the country whilst speaking NATIVE Finnish.. :/

Ok, points 1 and 2 are fine,

Point 3 is another thing. Have you ever actually BEEN to Finland? It sounds like you have some internet-picture of Finland or something. Ok, there are worse countries around, but you sound completely unprepared for actually being in Finland. How about you come here and stay for as long as possible on visitors visas, and see what things are really like.

If you do, and still decide that Finland is the promised land, then go for it, I wish you luck and happiness.

Agreed again.. if OP has been here (what 2 weeks?) or whatever. It really isn't enough the situation the OP is in to be able to make a judgement on number 3. I beg to differ with OP's explanation of 'equality' and such :/

But hey I'm sure at least most of us will cross our fingers for you both!

You can't just wake up one morning and decide you will just plan ahead 5 years and move here in the end reality is a lot more unkind. I don't know of anyone that can plan ahead the next 5 years. I think you're just going through a phase and eventually you'll slowly move on to something else. Either way, regardless of everything odds are severely stacked against you and many would say your investment of time and money is not worth it.