Working Holiday + extra

[FrustratedAussie]

Hi guys,

I have been browsing your forum for a little while trying to find the answer to some of my questions, but now I am even more confused! The migri site is actually the most difficult site to gain information from, in my opinion (which is saying a lot - I've had lots of exprience getting around the immi.gov site and thought that was bad!), so I thought I'd turn to some people who have knowledge or experience.

I recently obtained a working holiday visa (I'm Australian) beginning January. I realise it would be difficult to find someone to take me on for work, however I got it for two reasons - 1. so that I had the possibility to do 'trial' work at a few places before a possibility of gaining employment and a employment permit (which I know is 99.9% impossible, so see option two)... 2. So that I could work inbetween the entrance exam and beginning of study at a University, studying a course (in english) I am very interested in (this was my first choice). It's way too expensive to fly there for entrance exams and then fly home to await results/permit grant and then fly back again! So I thought getting a working holiday permit would be ideal as I could stay there longer than the 3 months and find some/any sort of work in the meantime, and prove myself in that role so that I could continue to work there parttime while studying.

Now however having read some of the comments on here, am I correct in assuming I am unable to apply for a student visa while on the working holiday visa!? Do they really expect me to fly there, do an entrance exam, fly home, wait, and fly there again if I get in, all in a matter of months? I can understand someone who lives in Europe doing this, but from Australia!? Really!? Also, where exactly does it say you are unable to apply for any other type of permit while on the WH? If someone could find me a link to the exact wording...

A second thing - I am trying to fill out the KELA form to obtain my social security number, but am a little confused in doing so. It appears it is only tailored to those with employment residency permits, not working holiday ones, although I am meant to get my social security number this way. If anyone has had experience with this and knows which form to fill out or how to fill it out, some help would be appreciated!

Thanks!!

[interleukin]

KELA are not the ones giving out id numbers, that´s the Maistratti. KELA is the social/health care system, and you are most likely not eligible for that.

[FrustratedAussie]

Ah yes, thanks for that. I wasn't sure... My Finnish friend thought it might be through them and she sent me a form to fill out. I guess I'll just ask when I get there?

[Rip]

Now however having read some of the comments on here, am I correct in assuming I am unable to apply for a student visa while on the working holiday visa!?

I recall something along lines that one would not be able to apply (successfully) for another permit while on "working holiday", but I think none of those persons were talking about personal experience or could show any law or official regulation to support their case (while we have had a few posters that have successfully applied for residence permit under those circumstances) .

So, I don't see why you could not apply, and if you're legally staying her with a one year permit, then it seems sensible to apply here.

The ID code issue was already discussed, but take look at: http://www.maistraatti.fi/en/Services/p ... otikunta_3

[rinso]

Now however having read some of the comments on here, am I correct in assuming I am unable to apply for a student visa while on the working holiday visa!?

Indeed. A working holiday visa is a one time option. after that you have to go back.

Do they really expect me to fly there, do an entrance exam, fly home, wait, and fly there again if I get in, all in a matter of months? I can understand someone who lives in Europe doing this, but from Australia!? Really!?

It is your choice to study at the opposite side of the world. They don't have to bend the rules to accommodate you.

[Rip]

Now however having read some of the comments on here, am I correct in assuming I am unable to apply for a student visa while on the working holiday visa!?

Indeed. A working holiday visa is a one time option. after that you have to go back.

That much is true that the working holiday visa can be only granted once for a person, but for more general statements (that one is not generally able to apply for another permit on some other basis in Finland while on "working holiday") I would like to see proof.

[FrustratedAussie]

Thanks rip

I have searched the alien acts for evidence of this 'rule' that one cannot apply for a residency permit while on a working holiday permit, and I could not find it anywhere. I have emailed the consulate to ask them. I know the working holiday is a one time only, but nowhere in the information does it say I am unable to apply for a different permit IN Finland while I am there. Even the student permit information says:

If the applicant has arrived in Finland with a visa or visa-free to participate in an entrance
exam at an educational institution and the alien has been accepted to the educational
institution and the studies commence relatively shortly after the entrance examination,
a residence permit may exceptionally be issued in Finland if the other
requirements for issuing a residence permit are met, and if it would be unreasonable,
considering all the factors affecting the matter, for the alien to have to return to
his or her home country to apply for a residence permit.

I realise I don't need a visa to participate in an entrance exam, being from Australia, and I realise that's what they mean with this statement, however my studies would commence shortly after the entrance exam - perhaps they would deem it unreasonable to return home. The problem I have with Migri is that they don't give examples of what these unreasonable factors would be.

If the issue is that two permits can not run at the same time, surely the working holiday can be cancelled as soon as the student permit is approved?

[rinso]

they don't give examples of what these unreasonable factors would be.

They want to keep their options open. It is judged on a case by case situation.

If the issue is that two permits can not run at the same time, surely the working holiday can be cancelled as soon as the student permit is approved?

In general when you apply for a new permit (based on other grounds) the existing permit is cancelled. (which means you have to leave if the second application is denied) I Don't know if this also applies for working holiday visa.

That much is true that the working holiday visa can be only granted once for a person, but for more general statements (that one is not generally able to apply for another permit on some other basis in Finland while on "working holiday") I would like to see proof.

In general migri doesn't like if a working holiday visa is used to get a foot in the door for an other permit. So you can expect some resistance, even if it is strictly speaking not forbidden.

[FrustratedAussie]

Oh right. Well now it makes sense - I can understand where they're coming from in that case. Thanks

[Rip]

In general when you apply for a new permit (based on other grounds) the existing permit is cancelled. (which means you have to leave if the second application is denied)

Really? Somebody has had their study permit cancelled because and when they applied for employment based permit, or had their old permit cancelled when they have applied for family based permit when being here originally on employment basis?

That much is true that the working holiday visa can be only granted once for a person, but for more general statements (that one is not generally able to apply for another permit on some other basis in Finland while on "working holiday") I would like to see proof.

In general migri doesn't like if a working holiday visa is used to get a foot in the door for an other permit. So you can expect some resistance, even if it is strictly speaking not forbidden.

That is a statement, not a proof of a statement. (Although personally I would not plan for a schedule where you apply for new permit "immediately" arriving here either.)

As a practical point on top of my list for OP would be that when applying for the study permit at the police station try to ask (nicely, politely) what will happen to the application. That is, if they are going to send it to Migri for decision anyway (seems reasonable to assume as Migri usually decides on the first student permits), if they could please do it now, instead after keeping it in their own pile for a couple of months. Studies after all start relatively soon after the date when you'd get confirmation you have study place (and become eligible to apply for the student permit).

[FrustratedAussie]

So I'd definitely go through the Police for it when I'm in Finland? Rather than contacting the Australian consulate for it?

Will do. Thanks for the help!

[Pete]

Don't count on visiting the consulate here for anything.
Last time i checked it was closed and the nearest one is in Stockholm.

[Rodwen]

Now however having read some of the comments on here, am I correct in assuming I am unable to apply for a student visa while on the working holiday visa!?

Indeed. A working holiday visa is a one time option. after that you have to go back.

Not true. My husband had a working holiday visa and we went and applied for a RP based on family ties in September (his WH visa didn't run out until December)
We are still waiting for the decision, but the police said the application is seen as an extension of a temporary RP, even tho the grounds changed.

[Kutittaa]

http://www.abroadeducation.com.np/study ... ocess.html

Student Visa For Students from Other Countries:

Students from countries other than Nordic and EU/EEA must compulsorily obtain a visa prior to entering into Finland. If student have been accepted as an full time student and wishes to stay for more than 90 days in Finland for study purpose, then foreign student from these countries need to apply and obtain residence permit from the Finnish diplomatic mission in their home country before entering Finland. If international students are requested to take an entrance examination before being admitted as foreign student in Finnish educational institutions, then they need to apply for a visa for the period of the entrance examination.

Documents Required to Submit in Finnish Diplomatic Mission to obtain Finnish Visa and Residence Permit

A completely filled application form along with a photograph attached with it.
A certificate or letter of acceptance showing that the student is enrolled for the full time study in Finnish educational institution including information related to study program and the duration of the program.
Accommodation documentation including information regarding the place where they are going to stay during their studies.
Health Insurance certificate covering all the health risks that is valid till the student's students complete in Finland.
Financial support documents (It may be a certificate from a bank confirming that student have enough fund to support their stay in Finland or the necessary documents that show that student have received a scholarships, study grants or any other type of financial aid to study in Finnish educational institution or the documents from financer if the student is going to be financed by the local Finnish resident).´

Documents needed for entry to Finland:-

When arriving in Finland you may also be expected to show, in addition to your visa and a valid travel document, insurance document for the duration of your stay and other documents related to your stay in Finland. You must prove that you have sufficient funds (EUR 40 per day or a scholarship or a training placement) for your stay and for your return journey or further travel.

If you would ordinarily need a visa but have a residence permit valid in one of the Schengen countries, you do not need a visa to enter another Schengen country if the intended duration of your stay is no more than 90 days.

Formalities:-

If you are a foreign national requiring a visa, you must always have one when entering the Schengen area. A Schengen visa is applied for from the embassy or consulate of the destination country. So when coming to Finland, you are requested to apply for it either from a Finnish embassy or consulate or from a mission of a Schengen country that represents Finland. For admission of visa one is always required to have a valid travel insurance together with other documents.

Cost of Studying in Finland, Living Costs, Tuition Fees For Study in Finland:

Since university education is funded by the State through the Ministry of Education, students enrolled in regular degree studies pay no tuition fees.

However, Tuition fees may be collected on a trial basis, starting from the year 2010, 2011 or 2012.

The monthly cost of living for a student in Finland is approx. EUR 750 ($965 AUD). This includes accommodation, travel and food bills. Leisure would be extra since there is a lot to do in Finland. Also, medical insurance has to be taken care of. A reasonable way of doing that is joining a student union which takes care of medical insurance as well as provides a student card which can help in availing discounts.

Also see: http://www.migri.fi/netcomm/content.asp ... anguage=EN

Last I checked, Google works...

[Pursuivant]

Well, just remember you also need the 6000 euros and a health insurance + then the obviously acceptance letter to the university. Dunno if you have "plan B" as in say a WH visa for UK where you wouldnt have too much trouble finding some job...