Alien's/Foreigner's Passport

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Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:07 am

Well if you can visit "your country" what is the reason for not getting a "your country" passport?

funloving · Post by **funloving** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:12 am

Hi,

well obviously someone gets this passport when one cant get his own country's passport.

Regards,

FL

Kutittaa · Post by **Kutittaa** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:44 am

Why can't you get your own? A country won't let you through its walls and treat you like you're part of them if you don't have a corresponding passport for that country. There's no such thing as a 'free' meal.

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:32 am

You need a visa for anywhere you go outside the schengen zone.

Pursuivant wrote:Well if you can visit "your country" what is the reason for not getting a "your country" passport?

There are three probable reasons. 1. The majority of asylum seekers who arrive here change their name, age or country of origin so naturally getting a national passport will screw their whole case. 2. People who claim asylum with their national passport will have that passport seized by the authorities and are issued an alien's passport. 3. There are dysfunctional countries like Iraq and Somalia where getting a national passport is difficult so an alien's passport is a more convenient alternative.

funloving · Post by **funloving** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:19 pm

Not everyone feels happy in giving away their identification. I just wanted to know any personal experiences or of any body you know. People with alien's passport can travel around europe without any problem and some of them have also got smooth entry in UK also, I just wanted to know about other regions like middle east, Australia or USA.

Thanks,

FL

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:48 pm

funloving wrote:People with alien's passport can travel around europe without any problem and some of them have also got smooth entry in UK also

Those have the 1951 refugee convention travel documents which apparently you don't have.

funloving wrote: I just wanted to know about other regions like middle east, Australia or USA.

No, you need a visa.

funloving · Post by **funloving** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:55 pm

I know i will need visa for that, but question is about passport recognition.

Kutittaa · Post by **Kutittaa** » Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:39 am

As far as I know you can't get a visa to Australia on an 'aliens passport' if you don't have travel documents (a passport) for a country whom you belong to. An aliens passport means that you don't actually belong to a country... hence its name. It's complicated but even if there were some way to make it into Australia, you would either:

A) Never be granted a visa in the first place.
A1) If you travelled to Australia without a visa you'd be either turned around at the airport in the country you were leaving from.
A2) Or you would be turned around when you landed in Australia and then banned entry for 'x' amount of years. And/Or subject to 'extra screening' every other time you try to come back in, even in a legitimate way.

B) Even if you got a visa somehow you would still be subject to all of the above when you enter the country.

I don't know about the US or whatever but I'd assume they are just as strict, if not more strict with aliens. I've seen people turned around in Heathrow airport on aliens passport even though they had a green card for the US simply because the woman said that without a proper passport they can't go there. So they went back to Thailand. (Which they weren't an official member of anyway).

You'd have a better chance at applying for asylum, but you'll end up jumping off one of the buildings at an asylum camp to try and send a message like this guy did.

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:20 am

funloving wrote:I know i will need visa for that, but question is about passport recognition.

The document itself is recognized but the question is whether its holder is accepted or not. So if they have any issues you'd be denied a visa upfront. The main problem with alien passports is that unlike refugee passports, the holders are not automatically entitled to be readmitted into Finland which makes some countries reluctant to accept them.

edit: it's the 1954 convention not 1951.

funloving · Post by **funloving** » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:51 pm

Thanks for your responses. I got it that it wont be accepted out of Europe.

Regards,

FL

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:55 am

Logic wrote:The main problem with alien passports is that unlike refugee passports, the holders are not automatically entitled to be readmitted into Finland which makes some countries reluctant to accept them.

Well if a person can visit "their country" they are not in any need of asylum are they?

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:43 am

Pursuivant wrote: Well if a person can visit "their country" they are not in any need of asylum are they?

You're not getting the point. Not all people with alien passports are asylum seekers! but if they were asylum seekers then authorities have deemed it safe for them to visit their country (example: people who applied for humanitarian not political asylum) and hence granted them an alien passport. Only people with refugee passports cannot visit their country.

Kutittaa · Post by **Kutittaa** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:58 am

Logic wrote:
Pursuivant wrote: Well if a person can visit "their country" they are not in any need of asylum are they?
You're not getting the point. Not all people with alien passports are asylum seekers! but if they were asylum seekers then authorities have deemed it safe for them to visit their country (example: people who applied for humanitarian not political asylum) and hence granted them an alien passport. Only people with refugee passports cannot visit their country.

Oh and what... 1% of them wouldn't be asylum seekers?

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:35 pm

You're not getting the point.

Yes I am getting the point - If they can visit their country there is no other reason them to be in Finland except the welfare handout.

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