Being pregnant and expelled from country

reindeer · Post by **reindeer** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:38 pm

Hi,

This is the case with my friend who came here on a business trip. She had sex with one guy from the same country (non-EU) and unfortunately got pregnant. Her visa is about to expire soon and she is facing the possibility of being expelled from the country (if not living here illegally). The guy who made her pregnant has been living here almost 4 years and is applying for Permanent Residence Permit which is expected to be available in months. My question is: Can having pregnant with a guy who is applying for PRP or already got PRP guarantee that one can stay here legally?

Thanks.

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Upphew · Post by **Upphew** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:46 pm

Visa is for visiting, so of course she should be leaving.

As for RP... work, study, family. Both work and study you should apply in your home country. Family... 2 years of co-habitation or marriage.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:54 pm

If they got married, she could apply for a residence permit (which could be denied, and the proper way for doing that would be applying from her home country...) - but at least you make it sound like they wouldn't have any continuing relationship.

A according to aliens Act is somebody you are either married to (she isn't at least now), you have been living together for two years (she hasn't, and it actually sounds like they are living together at all) or living together with a child. Before the child is born, the fatherhood can't be even legally established.

Residence permit for spouse of a foreign citizen requires also sufficient income.

reindeer · Post by **reindeer** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:29 pm

Rip wrote:If they got married, she could apply for a residence permit (which could be denied, and the proper way for doing that would be applying from her home country...) - but at least you make it sound like they wouldn't have any continuing relationship.

A according to aliens Act is somebody you are either married to (she isn't at least now), you have been living together for two years (she hasn't, and it actually sounds like they are living together at all) or living together with a child. Before the child is born, the fatherhood can't be even legally established.

Residence permit for spouse of a foreign citizen requires also sufficient income.

They're living together now and the child is expected to be born in less than half a year. My friend's visa will be expired before that but since the guy seems want to have a serious relationship with her, he's trying to make her stay here until she gives birth. Do you mean she can apply for residence permit when the child is born? Does the guy need to get married to her or does he only have to prove that the child is his son (by DNA test for example) in order to make sure that she gets the RP?

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:51 pm

reindeer wrote: They're living together now and the child is expected to be born in less than half a year.

And she may be expelled from Finland some 5 months before that...?

If she applies for residence permit, they will decide on that before escorting her to the airport. But I don't see she has any acceptable grounds for it now, unless they get married.

Do you mean she can apply for residence permit when the child is born? Does the guy need to get married to her or does he only have to prove that the child is his son (by DNA test for example) in order to make sure that she gets the RP?

When the child is born and the fatherhood is established, that could be used as reason to get permit (being also married would likely still makes things smoother) - but she would need to break the law to stay here so long (if she does not apply for a permit now) and could be expelled ("refused entry"), probably making any later application even harder.

Upphew · Post by **Upphew** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:03 pm

reindeer wrote:They're living together now and the child is expected to be born in less than half a year. My friend's visa will be expired before that but since the guy seems want to have a serious relationship with her, he's trying to make her stay here until she gives birth. Do you mean she can apply for residence permit when the child is born? Does the guy need to get married to her or does he only have to prove that the child is his son (by DNA test for example) in order to make sure that she gets the RP?

Overstaying the visa isn't going to help. She has to apply to new visa or RP before this one expires. So the shotgun wedding seems to be the "easiest" way out of this whole mess.

reindeer · Post by **reindeer** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:09 pm

Thank you guys! Now I understand what my friend needs to do. A shortgun wedding probably helps but then they have to come back to their home country to get the marriage certificate (or is it possible to do that at the Embassy in Finland?). Well, if that's the case then it might be the chicken-egg problem.

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:16 pm

They can marry in Finland - the man is a resident - they need to get the "unmarried certificate" before that (from their country or the embassy).

Oombongo · Post by **Oombongo** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:42 pm

out of curiosity (yes I know it is off topic) but can a woman file for child support in the similar situation?

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:52 pm

Oombongo wrote:out of curiosity (yes I know it is off topic) but can a woman file for child support in the similar situation?

No she can't since she doesn't have a kela card.

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:03 pm

To the OP, your friend needs to realize that she will suffer even more if she continued here for the following reasons: 1. Pregnant women need to check with mother care at the health clinics to follow up on the pregnancy and make sure it progressing normally and the baby is in good condition and for that she needs a kela card otherwise she has to do it at a private clinic and that will cost a lot. 2. Delivery costs will be considerably high without a kela card assuming there are no complications.

Even if they did get married, there are no guarantees she will receive a residence permit and if she did, there are no guarantees she will receive it before her delivery time.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:07 pm

Logic wrote:
Oombongo wrote:out of curiosity (yes I know it is off topic) but can a woman file for child support in the similar situation?
No she can't since she doesn't have a kela card.

If they are not living together she can (after the baby has been born and paternity established) apply for a court order to make the father to pay (if he is not volunteering). In case the father too poor or otherwise can't be made to pay, then yes, I assume she would need a KELA card to get KELA to pay any money instead of him.

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:12 pm

Rip wrote:
Logic wrote:
Oombongo wrote:out of curiosity (yes I know it is off topic) but can a woman file for child support in the similar situation?
No she can't since she doesn't have a kela card.

If they are not living together she can (after the baby has been born and paternity established) apply for a court order to make the father to pay (if he is not volunteering). In case the father too poor or otherwise can't be made to pay, then yes, I assume she would need a KELA card to get KELA to pay any money instead of him.

But she won't be getting the maternity benefits but as you said if paternity is established then the father can apply for child benefits given that the child is living with him.

edit to my earlier post: the child can be registered if paternity is established.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:16 pm

Points Logic makes in his last post regarding costs are valid (with the possible exception that I do not know if the child could inherit KELA coverage from his father (in case the baby would need medical care himself)).

The check-ups during pregnancy can cost several hundred euros combined, fairly uncomplicated births 2000-3000 euros without KELA coverage.

Logic · Post by **Logic** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:25 pm

(with the possible exception that I do not know if the child could inherit KELA coverage from his father (in case the baby would need medical care himself)).

The kela coverage won't be automatic as in the case if the mother was covered but it might require application by the father once the child gets its residence permit. In that case any treatment to the child prior to receiving the kela card will also be covered.

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